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Old 01-21-2010, 10:04 PM
  #12451  
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Originally Posted by Kevin CBR
I am familar with the Hobby Wing set-up. One major problem as a "spec" system. It is programmable. Now for racing, how many people do you know that seriously race that system that are running A main expert class ?

My Tamiya cars and equipment are what I race all year long. So when I upgrade my equipment, I do so to be competiive at all races I attend. There are some that rce a different brand all year long and dust off thier Tamiya car just for their local regional or the nationals.

Lets get back to what a "racing series" is all about. The rule makers make the rules, you choose which class you prefer, and you go run that class. Does everybody make as much noise to their local race tracks to change rules like we see here on this thread ?
It is possible. Although comparing $80 to a $300 system, there is no comparison.

I tend to do the same and stay on top of the Tamiya upgrades.

Yes!
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Old 01-21-2010, 10:18 PM
  #12452  
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Originally Posted by Kevin CBR
Lets get back to what a "racing series" is all about. The rule makers make the rules, you choose which class you prefer, and you go run that class. Does everybody make as much noise to their local race tracks to change rules like we see here on this thread ?
you havent read the RCGT Showdown and RCGT USA threads have you? people whining about new escs.. people whining about not using a specific spec speedo..pushing their own agendas... people saying the class dropped when the rules didnt even change! blah blah blah...

waaah waaah waaah!

Last edited by Hebiki; 01-21-2010 at 10:30 PM.
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Old 01-22-2010, 07:51 AM
  #12453  
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Originally Posted by Kevin CBR
I am familar with the Hobby Wing set-up. One major problem as a "spec" system. It is programmable. Now for racing, how many people do you know that seriously race that system that are running A main expert class ?

My Tamiya cars and equipment are what I race all year long. So when I upgrade my equipment, I do so to be competiive at all races I attend. There are some that rce a different brand all year long and dust off thier Tamiya car just for their local regional or the nationals.

If people really want a Tamiya "spec class" for experienced drivers, why not make GT-3 that class ? Tub chassis hopped up to a maximum of say a TT01-R or TA05-R. No need to have a $ 500.00 TA05 IFS with every hop-up if what the masses want is a low cost spec class. That is what it sounds like on this thread. Spec a stock Tamiya spur and pinion gear for each car (just like Japan Worlds does) spec a Tamiya silver can, black can or "mild tuned" motor with RPM limits close to out of box numbers and Tamiya brushes only if mild tuned and something in the range of max 3400 mah battery. If people truly want to take the spending out and put the driver talent in, take away motor tuning, keep the battery power to a minumum so you can use the same battery for a couple of years and spec gearing for all.

If you want to go faster and play with the big boys, GT-2 with the IFS type chassis, any Tamiya hop ups, set a battery mah limit but any ROAR legal (hard case only of course), any esc and any ROAR legal 17.5 motor.

For those with great driving talent or can afford lots of spares, GT-1 with any Tamiya chassis, any esc, same battery rule as GT-2 and either 13.5 motor or back to the good ol days of no motor limit. Open mod.

Lets get back to what a "racing series" is all about. The rule makers make the rules, you choose which class you prefer, and you go run that class. Does everybody make as much noise to their local race tracks to change rules like we see here on this thread ?
Dude,
You said it!
Couldn't agree more
3 of the constants with this hobby.
The fast guys will always be fast
The bitchers will always bitch
And the whiners will always whine
I run my Tamiya stuff year round as well, at least when I get the chance to race. Any inquiry that I have ever made has not been about spending, but unnecessary spending. I have already ranted enough about this stuff. I think there should be a freeze in the rules. No changes for at least 2 years. Same motors, same batteries. If you want to chase the technology for ROAR races or even club races go right ahead, but for TCS you could hang on to this years stuff and know that for the next 2 years, you wouldn't have to buy batteries or motors. I know racing costs money, and again I am not opposed to spending, hell I just acquired a slightly used but very nice and very hopped up TB03, and I will be setting it up as a second racecar, or maybe even my primary along side my TA05 IFS. I just dont want to spend money replacing perfectly good equipment thats all.
Stepping off the soapbox now, have a nice day
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Old 01-22-2010, 08:33 AM
  #12454  
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Originally Posted by Kevin CBR
...

If you want to go faster and play with the big boys, GT-2 with the IFS type chassis, any Tamiya hop ups, set a battery mah limit but any ROAR legal (hard case only of course), any esc and any ROAR legal 17.5 motor.

For those with great driving talent or can afford lots of spares, GT-1 with any Tamiya chassis, any esc, same battery rule as GT-2 and either 13.5 motor or back to the good ol days of no motor limit. Open mod.

..
Kinda dont agree with that...

#1.. There are people with 'great driving talent' in GT2 who can afford lots of spares (and others who cant afford lots of spares) #2, with the advent of programmable speedos (in GT2) this has already turned the class into 'OpenMod' if you really think about it..


I say if you wanna go balls out and buy all the 'trick-bits' and 'latest and greatest', step up to GT1.. like it was back in the day..

let me add... time for spec speedos since that seems to be the 'kicker'.. "non-upgradable speedos (firmware, or whatever the trick is to make them super-sonic)" GT2 has a list of motors, time to add a list of speedos.. only makes sense.. no? NOVAK GTB, NOVAK HAVOK, LRP Sphere TC Spec (non SPX) sounds like a good list to start with..


$0.02

Last edited by OSherman; 01-22-2010 at 11:01 AM.
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Old 01-22-2010, 10:58 AM
  #12455  
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Originally Posted by BP SHADOW
Dude,
You said it!
Couldn't agree more
3 of the constants with this hobby.
The fast guys will always be fast
The bitchers will always bitch
And the whiners will always whine
I run my Tamiya stuff year round as well, at least when I get the chance to race. Any inquiry that I have ever made has not been about spending, but unnecessary spending. I have already ranted enough about this stuff. I think there should be a freeze in the rules. No changes for at least 2 years. Same motors, same batteries. If you want to chase the technology for ROAR races or even club races go right ahead, but for TCS you could hang on to this years stuff and know that for the next 2 years, you wouldn't have to buy batteries or motors. I know racing costs money, and again I am not opposed to spending, hell I just acquired a slightly used but very nice and very hopped up TB03, and I will be setting it up as a second racecar, or maybe even my primary along side my TA05 IFS. I just dont want to spend money replacing perfectly good equipment thats all.
Stepping off the soapbox now, have a nice day
Could not agree more.
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Old 01-22-2010, 11:15 AM
  #12456  
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I'm a bitch'in fast whiner , lets race!!!!!
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Old 01-22-2010, 12:48 PM
  #12457  
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Originally Posted by Hebiki
you havent read the RCGT Showdown and RCGT USA threads have you? people whining about new escs.. people whining about not using a specific spec speedo..pushing their own agendas... people saying the class dropped when the rules didnt even change! blah blah blah...

waaah waaah waaah!
Hebiki, I think it is time to bust out the "waahambulance" again.
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Old 01-22-2010, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Kevin CBR
Hebiki, I think it is time to bust out the "waahambulance" again.
i think $250 is worth waah-waah-waahing over... especiall in these times..
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Old 01-22-2010, 01:11 PM
  #12459  
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Originally Posted by Kevin CBR
Hebiki, I think it is time to bust out the "waahambulance" again.
i retired from that service.

Originally Posted by OSherman
i think $250 is worth waah-waah-waahing over... especiall in these times..
its okay.. we still have claymores in MW2.
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Old 01-22-2010, 05:22 PM
  #12460  
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Originally Posted by Hebiki
you havent read the RCGT Showdown and RCGT USA threads have you? people whining about new escs.. people whining about not using a specific spec speedo..pushing their own agendas... people saying the class dropped when the rules didnt even change! blah blah blah...

waaah waaah waaah!
Actually that is pretty common, really in anything competitive. We had a big debate with our local point series that really did not matter in the end. Even at the end it was still screwd up, people got the wrong trophies, yet still did not really matter.

There is much talk about creating Beginner, Intermediate and Advanced classes in this series. Even Spec is supposed to be Novice yet you will still get guys who have raced a dozen or so years in RC running in it.

I have both sides of the coin. I would prefer not spending money to keep up with the rules but have for reasons of racing the series. Locally I don't really need expensive stuff to be competitive. It changes in racing TCS. I would agree whatever the rules are there will always be someone unhappy.
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Old 01-22-2010, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by OSherman
i think $250 is worth waah-waah-waahing over... especiall in these times..
O - my reference was to how people are never happy with the rules and when something new comes out, the people who are against it are those that don't have it. We are seeing the same complaints today we saw when LIPO's came out and when Nimh batteries jumped from 3300 to what 4700 / 4800 very quickly. What did it cost to race at the top when you had to buy at least 3-4 good matched cell packs a few times a year ?

And I know I am opening another can of worms here but people screaming about needing a spec esc because they can't afford $ 160 -180 for a new one but they can afford to spend $ 100.00 or more on tires for a single race ?

One thing I have noticed in TCS, at least on the West Coast. How many people have dropped down from GT-1 to slower classes like GT-2 or mini. Look at how few GT-1 drivers were at the Nats. I used to race GT-2 and GT-3. I decided I wanted to get better so I race GT-1 and GT-2 now. If I can learn to control the speed of a GT-1 car, that will only make me better with my GT-2 car.
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Old 01-22-2010, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by A-Ko
Actually that is pretty common, really in anything competitive. We had a big debate with our local point series that really did not matter in the end. Even at the end it was still screwd up, people got the wrong trophies, yet still did not really matter.

There is much talk about creating Beginner, Intermediate and Advanced classes in this series. Even Spec is supposed to be Novice yet you will still get guys who have raced a dozen or so years in RC running in it.

I have both sides of the coin. I would prefer not spending money to keep up with the rules but have for reasons of racing the series. Locally I don't really need expensive stuff to be competitive. It changes in racing TCS. I would agree whatever the rules are there will always be someone unhappy.
True, there's no way to make EVERYONE happy, but I think I would like to see some stability in the rules for a few years, I think that would do a lot to keep racers & bring in more than the constant changes we're seeing the last couple of years.....
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Old 01-22-2010, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Kevin CBR
O - my reference was to how people are never happy with the rules and when something new comes out, the people who are against it are those that don't have it. We are seeing the same complaints today we saw when LIPO's came out and when Nimh batteries jumped from 3300 to what 4700 / 4800 very quickly. What did it cost to race at the top when you had to buy at least 3-4 good matched cell packs a few times a year ?

And I know I am opening another can of worms here but people screaming about needing a spec esc because they can't afford $ 160 -180 for a new one but they can afford to spend $ 100.00 or more on tires for a single race ?

One thing I have noticed in TCS, at least on the West Coast. How many people have dropped down from GT-1 to slower classes like GT-2 or mini. Look at how few GT-1 drivers were at the Nats. I used to race GT-2 and GT-3. I decided I wanted to get better so I race GT-1 and GT-2 now. If I can learn to control the speed of a GT-1 car, that will only make me better with my GT-2 car.
While I dont disagree with what you just said, I dont think you can directly compare NiMh to Lipos. Under continuous use even with good maintenance and storage practices one was lucky to get a year out of NiMh cells before they were junk, and even that was a stretch.
I said it in an earlier post, these packs are capable of going 1000 cycles before they are no good, and I have had to sell packs with less than 100 cycles just to be reasonably competitive, to me thats just a waste on a lot of levels. The bigger problem I see is that the technology is accelerating, but the cost is staying level or rising, which is not typical of technology as it goes through its lifecycle.I dont think of this as whining, I think it is an issue that needs to be addressed before it irreparably damages our hobby/sport .
Even F1 , the pinnacle of motorsports has seen rule and technology freezes to address cost concerns.
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Old 01-22-2010, 08:15 PM
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If you look at what has happened in the TA series it seems the esc's are the big issue. I don't race at that level, but i have been to a track where I heard the discussion of the programming of the esc's and all the settings. They discussed the problem that they didn't have the latest updates so they couldn't compete. I really think that's kind of interesting and cool. But, I would like to see Tamiya offer a class like the Senior Spec Class they run in Maryland. They have chosen a cheap chassis, limited hop-ups, fixed gearing, limited tires, cheap esc's, battery rules, and handout motors. GT3 should be something like that, but when hop-ups and tires are not limited, other than they must be Tamiya it can also be an expensive deal. I think if goal of Tamiya is to use the TCS to promote and sell more product this could help. I know that more than one person has suggested it to Tamiya. I think the TCS could be an even more popular series. I think the TCS locations are better with races in the East, West, Midwest, and one in the South.
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Old 01-22-2010, 08:32 PM
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This will be parked at all TCS races this season

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