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Old 12-11-2009, 02:13 PM
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I am left scratching my head.

I agree with Larry's and most of Gary's comments.

I don't understand the GT1-3 direction.
The GT classes has always been about different motors and GT1 was the fastest. By saying you should only run a spec motor, for GT1 and GT2 is sorta silly when local racing usually runs Roar 17.5 and not 17.5 spec. So guys with Duos and other 17.5s would have to spend $79 to run 1 race. Ok sure you could run a spec locally but if you are not running a timed esc, don't expect much.

The elimination of dish wheels does not make sense. Last I checked we were running toys not real cars. I did switch to dish because the spoke wheels are much more fragile. So now I have to buy rims, a cost I was not expecting. Plus it eliminates tires that are almost brand new race ready! Although GT1 seems not to have this rule.

GT2 thought it was silly to only allow 2 cars. Which is why I did not run GT2 in 09. Now I have a 3rd choice. I have one IFS and used it for GT3. I don't understand why older chassis are not ran, the TA04 & TA05 are still good cars, especially for those on a budget. Yeah I know for $30 I can convert my TA05 cars to IFS. Let the parts scarcity eliminate the cars....

GT3 there was no mention of RPM limits, so it seems, anything goes!

I do applaud a foam and rubber F1 class even though I don't have any inclination this year in that direction.

As mentioned earlier in the past years (even this year) about how the rules are made to make this racing affordable. In tough economic times with no economic certainty, these rules are not totally fair. Sure I could sell a motor at a loss, sure I could sell my rims at a loss, sure I could even sell a chassis at a loss. That is money I cannot recover. I should just be able to grab two cars I race locally (stock and GT3) and race in those respected classes, under the current rules, I cannot.

I hope to make a few races this year, think Tamiya Fred has done a great job, just would like to see less $$ spending and more racing.
Again it should be easier for new and old race TCS, not harder. Right now it is harder.
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Old 12-11-2009, 02:21 PM
  #12137  
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Originally Posted by A-Ko
I am left scratching my head.

I agree with Larry's and most of Gary's comments.

I don't understand the GT1-3 direction.
The GT classes has always been about different motors and GT1 was the fastest. By saying you should only run a spec motor, for GT1 and GT2 is sorta silly when local racing usually runs Roar 17.5 and not 17.5 spec. So guys with Duos and other 17.5s would have to spend $79 to run 1 race. Ok sure you could run a spec locally but if you are not running a timed esc, don't expect much.
OOPS! my bad. i didnt read the GT1 rules (with a fine tooth comb since i dont run it at nats). i just saw 17.5 and moved on.

but wow... i didnt know the GT2 motor rules applied to GT1. apologies to whoever i flamed. (gary, i own you a mayo packed double double next time you're in socal. )
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Old 12-11-2009, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by f1larry
I know the rules are the rules and I can see in the Grand scheme of things Tamiya is trying to keep the costs down and attract more people to the series. I think the motor rule really is the only real bad rule because I think the issue now is more in the ESC. If they aren't allowing the black ring 17.5 that many people have (that has the same part number as the yellow ring motor) because they think someone will use a 10.5 with the 17.5 purple ring (because the 10.5 has the black ring) to try and cheat I think is absurd as it would be very obvious the difference in speed between the 2 motors. I think that would be very easy to spot. As far as the other Tamiya parts needed I like many others have a war chest full of tires from many years of running in the series.

Don't get me wrong I am a huge supporter of Tamiya and I appreciate all that Fred and the guys have done for this series, some how I will find a way to be at the race in March at Trackside.
Have you contacted Novak to see if you can send in your motor and have a yellow ring installed?
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Old 12-11-2009, 02:31 PM
  #12139  
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Originally Posted by Hebiki
you're killing me gary....fine ill entertain your train of though. you move GT2 to 21.5.. you'll hose GT3. what then? then you'll want mini at 21.5? don't post like an asshat. everyone knows who you are. the move is to increase attendance for GT1, not to "piss Gary K" off. TCS doesnt revolve around you.

is your diaper wet because you didnt get what you want? Then now you're just making noise to make noise. GT2 is fine at 17.5. take the rules as is... race.. or dont race. these days... you're doing more whining than racing.
It has nothing to do with what "I" want. It has to do with logic. Some of these rules, particularity the motor and battery rules don't make a lot of logical sense. Again I ask why add the Tekin to the already approved Novak and LRP Motors and no others? I can somewhat understand adding the Ballistic and the X-12 to the "approved" list as the older Novak and LRP will probably dry up soon. If we're happy to say "Follow ROAR Rules" for the LiPo batteries why not do the same for motors? We used to do just that with 27T. Same thing with the battery rules. Like I said you can get a good quality 5300, hard cased LiPo for under $90. You can also pay over $130 for batteries that conform to the C-rating and Capacity limits set forth. This could also be a typo but the fact that, as the rules are now, Orion Platinum 4800 and 5000mAh LiPo packs are ILLEGAL since they are 2S2P! I know a lot of people have these packs and I am sure this is an oversight but still, even if this sticks???

For motors I firmly believe that a 21.5 is still faster than a Mabuchi. Look at Trans Am cars; almost the same speed and lap times as stock is. And no, 21.5's should not be used in Mini either. According to those who have run them 13.5's tend to most closely replicate the speed of a mabuchi in a mini. I actually have no problem with GT2 being a 17.5 class. GT2 has always been the "Stock-equivalent class". It's got a history and a niche that it fills quite well. The issue I have/what I dislike is the semi-spec nature of the GT2 motor rules (Either spec 1 motor or open it to any ROAR legal 17.5) and GT1 being a semi-spec 17.5 class as well. I would have actually liked to have seen the motor rules exactly the same as last year. Why make people buy new gear to compete in the series. I'll argue that it makes more sense to change a tire/wheel/body rule than a motor and battery rule. Wheels, tires and bodies are consumable items. Most people buy new ones before a TCS race. They're also considerably less expensive than a $90 brushless motor. The key to any series thriving is to make it as easy as possible for people to compete, not hard.

I'm not posting to be an asshat. I'm also not getting emotional about this as you have Chris. Fred has a hard time every year keeping this thing going and he deserves a lot of credit. For me, personally, it does not make sense for me to invest in equipment to run one or two times a year. Around me there is no real on-road presence. I still have a NIB 05V2 that I have yet to even start building. Now I am not saying that people shouldn't run TCS. Far from it. I'm just saying, for me, the motor and battery rules make it cost prohibitive for me to run a GT Class in 2010.
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Old 12-11-2009, 02:33 PM
  #12140  
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Originally Posted by User Name
Larry when the time comes if you need a motor I've got one you can borrow for TCS. It would be a shame for that to keep you and Matt from being there to race against.

Shawn Conley
Shawn,
Thanks for the offer, That is the other reason I like the TCS so much, people like you that are involved.

Larry
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Old 12-11-2009, 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Hebiki
OOPS! my bad. i didnt read the GT1 rules (with a fine tooth comb since i dont run it at nats). i just saw 17.5 and moved on.

but wow... i didnt know the GT2 motor rules applied to GT1. apologies to whoever i flamed. (gary, i own you a mayo packed double double next time you're in socal. )
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Old 12-11-2009, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by RCGaryK
It has nothing to do with what "I" want...... . I'm just saying, for me, the motor and battery rules make it cost prohibitive for me to run a GT Class in 2010.
Sorry, I couldn't resist...
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Old 12-11-2009, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by RCGaryK
me? emotional? nah.... i guess i should read more the rules in detail like you guys have. i tried to read your previous post before the helmet one above......but it was too long and i fell asleep, drooled on my keyboard, it short circuited and it shocked me awake.

either way.. stop whining on here.. mow some extra lawns and we'll see you at nats! btw.. you look great in your picture above.. you have a nice tan.. the facial hair makes you look more mature too.
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Old 12-11-2009, 03:29 PM
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...and another thing, what with all these changes in the Mini rules!!!!

Oh ,wait a minute, there has been no changes in mini rules for 10+ years!!!

I'm still mad , I have to run the same tires,battery and body from three years ago !!! LOL.

You can build a mac daddy race ready mini for the price of a fancy brushless ESC!!!!
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Old 12-11-2009, 03:32 PM
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Mini ,the Economy class since the beginning!!!!!
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Old 12-11-2009, 04:14 PM
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I believe it says that the 540J motors will have a 13.5 k rpm limit at some Regional venues. Which ones, I haven't the foggiest notion. I guess it sort of depends.
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Old 12-11-2009, 06:30 PM
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It all looks good to me. In the grand scheme of things (travel, hotels, etc etc.) a $70 motor isn't really a big deal...especially since you can get a well taken care of used one on the forums for $45 or so. Sell your black ringed for $30...buy a yellow ringed for $45.

I like that the 17.5 motors are specd...opening up to any motor really gets whacky. Maybe open it up in GT1, but GT2 is fine. Heck...I'd like to see a 21.5 class too.

Now it's time to knuckle down and get the minis ready for Omaha...and....

Anyone who hasn't been to the Omaha Hobbyplex...your missing one of the best tracks in the country!! Make the trip!!
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Old 12-11-2009, 06:42 PM
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RCGaryk- I can tell you from personal experience this summer racing against in a mixed class with two VTA cars with 21.5's and special ESC's and they walked away from my car and a friends car. We were running 20T Stingers. So, i assume they would walk away from a silver can, but who knows what a top notch esc would do with a hot silver can.
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Old 12-11-2009, 06:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Granpa
I believe it says that the 540J motors will have a 13.5 k rpm limit at some Regional venues. Which ones, I haven't the foggiest notion. I guess it sort of depends.
The venues that have the 13.5k rpm limit are all in the same place this year...

Whinerville, usa.
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Old 12-11-2009, 08:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Markus
The venues that have the 13.5k rpm limit are all in the same place this year...

Whinerville, usa.
I'm definitely a whiner. I won't go to an unlimited rpm race. That's just a stupid idea.

Well maybe once I get my magnet zapper and allen wrenches, then I'll be there.
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