Go Back  R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Racing Forum
Tamiya Championship Series >

Tamiya Championship Series

Like Tree830Likes

Tamiya Championship Series

Old 12-13-2008, 12:14 AM
  #9871  
Tech Elite
iTrader: (11)
 
Kevin CBR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: "Racing Budget" is an oxymoron
Posts: 3,984
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by djfourmoney
Yeah the R is a nice car, full of upgrades. I found one for $115 on Ebay, but its been shipped from HK so shipping/handling increases the price by $55 and its not that much of a bargain at that point.

I'm also weighing XB cars vs. Kit+Radio setups.

XB would have me running as soon as I put a charged pack into the car. The radio is nothing to write home about, however it speeds up the process of getting track time and tuning the car.

I can change the radio system later, in the meantime I can run the car stock, get used to the speed of the car, the track and then make changes.

I do have one question about tires...

You're suppose to use "kit" tires, does it matter if you car has radials (street models) or racing slicks (race cars) and should that enter into my buying choices?

Something to keep in mind if you are planning to run "Novice Spec". It is just that, a class for Novice drivers. If you show up with experience and lap the fields, expect to get bumped up to GT-3. At least if you are runing at Tamiya's home track.

Now, with the stock gearing, you will go very sloooowwwww. My girlfriend moved up from Novice to GT-3 for that reason alone. Why ? Because final drive in spec is around 8.0 or above. In GT-3 with the same car and motor, you would need to be around 5.0 - 5.3 final drive ratio to be competitive. Also, the TT-01 is a good simple but limited car. If you want to race with the same car for 2-3 years, the TA05 or TB03 is a better investment and you can add hop-ups as you go. More money up front ? Of course it is but cheaper than buying a new kit a year later when you realize your car can not keep up. If you have aspirations of bumping up to GT-3 and making the A or B main, it will be very tough with a TT01. Racing will be more expensive than backyard bashing. But if you want to race, no matter how good a driver you are, you can only do so much with a limited car. I ran 1:1 scale road racing before and a slower driver in a nice tueb frame car could usually beat a very talented driver in an older tub chassis. Not trying to discourage you from the sport, just trying to give you a realistic idea of what you want to get into.
Kevin CBR is offline  
Old 12-13-2008, 11:22 AM
  #9872  
Tech Master
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: West of Crook County Illinois
Posts: 1,979
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by djfourmoney
Yeah the R is a nice car, full of upgrades. I found one for $115 on Ebay, but its been shipped from HK so shipping/handling increases the price by $55 and its not that much of a bargain at that point.
I did see a TT01 on ebay for $50 + $20 shipping, hardly used. I am sure since he has no bids, might even go lower.

You can find a decent cheap radio on ebay for around $50-$60. Spektrum is nice, since everybody has gone that route, frequencies are available, just have a few extra crystal sets. If you skip spektrum for now, get a radio with more than 1 model memory. Make getting the next car or 2nd class a little easier.

Chargers I would 2nd the Onyx 230, mainly for future batteries you will be buying. A friend has one and loves it.

Bearings http://www.avidrc.com/ sells them for a buck each. I think over $30 it is free shipping.

Originally Posted by Kevin CBR
Something to keep in mind if you are planning to run "Novice Spec". It is just that, a class for Novice drivers. If you show up with experience and lap the fields, expect to get bumped up to GT-3.
Although I have not seen that, even at Aliso. One of my friends used to run it and was planning on it until I talked him out of it, he is an expert. There are still some guys in the series that run this class, maybe as long as 5 years or more, when really they should have moved to GT3. It is a hard rule to enforce, unless you really know the people that are in it. I would think 2-3 novice wins, you should move on if you win or even podium GT1, GT2, GT3 or mini, you are definately not a novice.
A-Ko is offline  
Old 12-13-2008, 03:59 PM
  #9873  
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: San Fernando Valley (818)
Posts: 117
Default TT-01 Uncompetitive in GT-3?

A few things,

Thanks for all the advice thus far. TB-03 is too $$$ and limited bodies, I need to see another NSX like a hole in the head. I don't get amp'ed up over Japanese icons I personally think the NSX is the slowest overpriced supercar ever produced!

But I digress....

Why not hop up my TL-01? I already own one...

Race Bucks raced one near stock and got a podium (TT-03) with limited hop ups, what prevents the car from doing better and are we talking TT-03, TT-03d or Type E?
djfourmoney is offline  
Old 12-13-2008, 04:47 PM
  #9874  
MD
Tech Champion
iTrader: (136)
 
MD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Illinois
Posts: 5,723
Trader Rating: 136 (100%+)
Default

In my experience in the TCS some adults run the Novice/Spec Class for more than one year even after they win the class and have their picture on the Tamiya website as the winner the previous year.

djfoourmoney - Run what you can afford and have fun. if you think it's fun you can invest more the second year. As A-Ko suggests, Ebay is a great source. Tower Hobbies has the TT01 Ferrari kit 58302 for $105.00 and they have a discount, if you spend $100 you can $10.00 off. If you go to this site, http://www.rocousa.com/tamiyasale.htm, they have TA58318 RC CLK-DTM AMG Mercedes for $87.00, but their shipping is higher.
MD is offline  
Old 12-13-2008, 05:05 PM
  #9875  
Tech Addict
iTrader: (6)
 
RaceBucks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Huntington Beach, Ca.
Posts: 512
Trader Rating: 6 (100%+)
Default

A couple comments just to make sure the record is straight:
1) I did not podium; I finished mid-B-main, was thrilled with how I did.
2) I ran a TT-01 near stock in GT-3; perhaps TT-03 was a typo.


You've received lots of advise, MD just added some more good advice: "Run what you can afford and have fun. if you think it's fun you can invest more the second year."
I ran my cheap TT-01 knowing I wasn't going to win, but just wanted to have fun and I was personally surprised at how little it took to feel proud of my results in the silver can class.
You can run a TT-01 in GT-3; I race in sportsman sedan with high end cars for years, my point was that it really wasn't the car that held me back. GT-3 attracts some really good drivers.
Since you are more of a novice and want to run Spec Novice, it's academic, get the TT-01, get the body style you want. My advice was to resist all the hop-up $'s spending until you've tested it; you will find it takes less than you think.
Let next year sort itself out next year, enjoy this year.

Jeff Smith
RaceBucks is offline  
Old 12-13-2008, 05:41 PM
  #9876  
Registered User
iTrader: (20)
 
UltegraSTI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 7,171
Trader Rating: 20 (100%+)
Default

honestly i think if your on the boards and your already tryin to 'strategize' for the spec class @ TCS. u dont belong there.

i admit many times i wondered if i should run in the class while doin so on the club level. i always backed off b/c it was considered a novice class and it wouldnt be right even to win. then sadly u'd go to the event to hang out and see the folks running in that class, and knowing they shouldnt be there.
on another note, i think its better for tamiya to get folks into a ta05 and tb03 so they can race all the upper classes in time and race 'touring car' every other wkend. for folks that want to run in a spec class, let em buy the car and let em run at TCS. repalign ur classes to accomodate and make a 'novice class' for true novices, namely kids to get em into the hobby and off the nintendo.

R
UltegraSTI is offline  
Old 12-13-2008, 06:50 PM
  #9877  
AWK
Tech Master
iTrader: (9)
 
AWK's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,021
Trader Rating: 9 (100%+)
Default

Please remember that if you choose to run the TCS Spec class, and we determine you are at a skill level beyond what should be running in that class, we do reserve the right to tell you you will be bumped up to the next class (i.e. GT3).

Please make sure to be honest when entering the races as in the end it can hurt you. Spec is for very novice drivers as you will see when going to any TCS race. We do our best to weed out the people who are their because they think it will be an easy win.

I would also agree that if you want a car to race for years to come and you can grow into different classes as your skill level grow, a TB03, TA05, or TA05 IFS are the best options. You can take any of these kits from GT3 to GT1 and be competitive. Like Hebiki said, buy cheap, buy twice. Do things right the first time around and it will cost you less in the long run. While I understand that getting the best of everything right away is not an option, making the smart choices on where to invest your money is key to not going broke and being frustrated every race.

The key is having fun!
AWK is offline  
Old 12-13-2008, 07:53 PM
  #9878  
MD
Tech Champion
iTrader: (136)
 
MD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Illinois
Posts: 5,723
Trader Rating: 136 (100%+)
Default

When I raced at Trackside in 07 there was a guy running Novice/Spec and he had been racing mini for some years before that. He went to Maryland where he won Novice in 06 and ran it again in 07 and won I think. Nothing was said. At the regional level I have seen kids teching cars that would probably be racing novice themselves. I hoped it improved this past year.

I have some questions about the Novice/Spec class. If it's a novice class why are all the hop-ups allowed, but you can only run a 19 tooth pinion? A spec class is often box stock. I realize that the "R" chassis and the "E" chassis come with certain hop-ups, but why would a novice need them? It gives a real advantage the person with more money.
MD is offline  
Old 12-13-2008, 08:55 PM
  #9879  
Tech Addict
 
Waltrip55's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Fort Myers, FL
Posts: 578
Default

Originally Posted by MD
When I raced at Trackside in 07 there was a guy running Novice/Spec and he had been racing mini for some years before that. He went to Maryland where he won Novice in 06 and ran it again in 07 and won I think. Nothing was said. At the regional level I have seen kids teching cars that would probably be racing novice themselves. I hoped it improved this past year.
That was the year by brother(who was 11...a novice) placed third to that guy. I complained and told them to bump him up to GT-3, nothing happened. All they did was eliminate the round where he got TQ with the speed tuned gear set. Didn't matter though, because he made his way up through the field no problem. I hate when guys ruin a great class to bring new people into the hobby.
Waltrip55 is offline  
Old 12-13-2008, 11:38 PM
  #9880  
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: San Fernando Valley (818)
Posts: 117
Default

Well part of the hobby is getting more out of less, or it that an American thing to do???

How could the TT be that "bad" for GT-3? I'll get to the Novice comments made thus far in a minute.

People said the TL-01 was a horrible starting point for a competitive race car, umm that turned out to be wrong for the most part. Is it competitive at the National Level vs purpose built cars? It depends, if its vs a fairly intermediate driver or even worst a "hack" behind the wheel, the TL-01 driven well blew your doors off...

How many times have I heard or read in Club stock classes an entry level car is more than competitive when its short-coming are addressed, its not Tamiya's shoddy engineering, far from it, its locking out adjustment of the chassis, fiction shocks and crappy stock tires than keep it from running with a TA-05 out of the box, DUH.

The TT is very simple and by keeping it simple usually means it can be pretty darn quick...

Give me some adjustment and proper tires and I don't see why a TT couldn't be competitive. I'm sure it would be more "me" as a driver and less the "car".

Now about Spec Novice...

Bump me up, I don't care...

The truth remains -

a) I have never raced competitively ever, period. Not off-road, not parking lots, not on a purpose built tracks, no place. I have about 20-30 laps around an very mild off-road track built by a friend next door, the person that got my interested in R/C to begin with, that was 25 years ago, I'm 38, do the math...

b) I bought and built a TL-01, its never been run, ever. Its sits inside its box unused, painted, no radio, no battery pack. That was back in 1998, I finished building it sometime in 2001...

c) Now if somehow that puts me in GT-3 I find that very interesting. I barely understand trim controls on a radio, I have never used a electronic speed control, nor tuned one or set one up.

However I'm a HUGE 1:1 Racing Fan and a devoted follower of the ALMS, WTCC, BTCC, Brit GT, FIA GT and F1. I understand basic car setup, these things are no different. Driving lines are no different, smooth driving is key and solid handling is important.

A few have mentioned here that they are former or current 1:1 Club Racers or Autocrossers, that doesn't automatically make them good enough to beat David Jun around his home track driving equal equipment now does it?

Do I understand R/C? Yes

So am I complete NOOB? No

But racing I am a Novice and Spec Novice is where I feel I belong. If talent rears its ugly head, I don't mind being bumped up.

Practice is key and I do plan on going down to AV to get some laps in and I don't see how that makes it unfair. Just because I know the track and know the racing line doesn't mean I should automatically run GT-3 with a largely unfamiliar car and no concept of how to adjust it just yet.

I agree there's no glory in easy victory, hard earned are far more rewarding.

If my lap times are comparable to GT-3, challenge me to move up!

Mr. Smith -

I feel you left quite a bit on the table and with all the slop in the suspension, drive-line and the friction shocks, something tells me you could have challenged for a higher finish, selling the car a bit short don't you think?

Finally "Car King" -

I'll assume you work at Tamiya USA, and while the TT-01R is more than likely the best performing version of the TT-01, it doesn't have the improved chassis stiffening parts, nor the improved steering and it does have the hotter Sport Tuned engine, are you saying that I need every hop up in the book to be competitive with a belt-drive car????

Mr. Smith said he was surprised to be as close as he was given the cars mostly stock condition. So is that more him as a driver vs the other drivers at the finals or the car vs. drivers in better equipment?

I say you can do this it won't cost you nearly as much, take the best parts from the discontinued R model, use the improvements from the Type E, tune it up for GT-3 and see what happens...

Jeers to those that say I should jump into the deep end with a steep learning curve and complicated car like the TA-05IFS.

If I found I had a talent for this, I would park the TT-01 and buy something more in-line with my abilities and talent, thus I would be spending twice anyway... It would be quite funny if I started with such an expensive car and ended up no matter what I did towards the back of the pack, wow that would be disheartening now wouldn't it?
djfourmoney is offline  
Old 12-13-2008, 11:54 PM
  #9881  
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: San Fernando Valley (818)
Posts: 117
Default

Originally Posted by MD
When I raced at Trackside in 07 there was a guy running Novice/Spec and he had been racing mini for some years before that. He went to Maryland where he won Novice in 06 and ran it again in 07 and won I think. Nothing was said. At the regional level I have seen kids teching cars that would probably be racing novice themselves. I hoped it improved this past year.

I have some questions about the Novice/Spec class. If it's a novice class why are all the hop-ups allowed, but you can only run a 19 tooth pinion? A spec class is often box stock. I realize that the "R" chassis and the "E" chassis come with certain hop-ups, but why would a novice need them? It gives a real advantage the person with more money.
I think your right, the advantage is to those with more in their wallet, but that doesn't mean they know how to get the most out of it or drive really well. A friend of mine bought the TA-03 with the HKS Time Attack Toyota Altezza body and all the Tamiya Hop Ups and never ran a competitive lap with it.

Some people just want the best of the best despite being a total neophyte.

They end up with a car with all the shiny aluminum parts and find its fast in a straight line and handles flatly, but as I said they have no idea how to tune. Get to the TCS and find out they can't run the Sport Tuned engine, get handed a regular ol'e Sliver Can and use the same pinion....

Complete Newbies aren't going to do well no matter what they bought if they are 100% new to R/C and R/C Racing. Loosing shouldn't deter them, they should learn from it. I think more than a few people understand its more them than the car is the reason why they finished so badly. There's nothing you can do about "quitters" however...
djfourmoney is offline  
Old 12-14-2008, 12:11 AM
  #9882  
Tech Elite
iTrader: (11)
 
Kevin CBR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: "Racing Budget" is an oxymoron
Posts: 3,984
Trader Rating: 11 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by djfourmoney
Well part of the hobby is getting more out of less, or it that an American thing to do???

How could the TT be that "bad" for GT-3? I'll get to the Novice comments made thus far in a minute.

People said the TL-01 was a horrible starting point for a competitive race car, umm that turned out to be wrong for the most part. Is it competitive at the National Level vs purpose built cars? It depends, if its vs a fairly intermediate driver or even worst a "hack" behind the wheel, the TL-01 driven well blew your doors off...

How many times have I heard or read in Club stock classes an entry level car is more than competitive when its short-coming are addressed, its not Tamiya's shoddy engineering, far from it, its locking out adjustment of the chassis, fiction shocks and crappy stock tires than keep it from running with a TA-05 out of the box, DUH.

The TT is very simple and by keeping it simple usually means it can be pretty darn quick...

Give me some adjustment and proper tires and I don't see why a TT couldn't be competitive. I'm sure it would be more "me" as a driver and less the "car".

Now about Spec Novice...

Bump me up, I don't care...

The truth remains -

a) I have never raced competitively ever, period. Not off-road, not parking lots, not on a purpose built tracks, no place. I have about 20-30 laps around an very mild off-road track built by a friend next door, the person that got my interested in R/C to begin with, that was 25 years ago, I'm 38, do the math...

b) I bought and built a TL-01, its never been run, ever. Its sits inside its box unused, painted, no radio, no battery pack. That was back in 1998, I finished building it sometime in 2001...

c) Now if somehow that puts me in GT-3 I find that very interesting. I barely understand trim controls on a radio, I have never used a electronic speed control, nor tuned one or set one up.

However I'm a HUGE 1:1 Racing Fan and a devoted follower of the ALMS, WTCC, BTCC, Brit GT, FIA GT and F1. I understand basic car setup, these things are no different. Driving lines are no different, smooth driving is key and solid handling is important.

A few have mentioned here that they are former or current 1:1 Club Racers or Autocrossers, that doesn't automatically make them good enough to beat David Jun around his home track driving equal equipment now does it?

Do I understand R/C? Yes

So am I complete NOOB? No

But racing I am a Novice and Spec Novice is where I feel I belong. If talent rears its ugly head, I don't mind being bumped up.

Practice is key and I do plan on going down to AV to get some laps in and I don't see how that makes it unfair. Just because I know the track and know the racing line doesn't mean I should automatically run GT-3 with a largely unfamiliar car and no concept of how to adjust it just yet.

I agree there's no glory in easy victory, hard earned are far more rewarding.

If my lap times are comparable to GT-3, challenge me to move up!

Mr. Smith -

I feel you left quite a bit on the table and with all the slop in the suspension, drive-line and the friction shocks, something tells me you could have challenged for a higher finish, selling the car a bit short don't you think?

Finally "Car King" -

I'll assume you work at Tamiya USA, and while the TT-01R is more than likely the best performing version of the TT-01, it doesn't have the improved chassis stiffening parts, nor the improved steering and it does have the hotter Sport Tuned engine, are you saying that I need every hop up in the book to be competitive with a belt-drive car????

Mr. Smith said he was surprised to be as close as he was given the cars mostly stock condition. So is that more him as a driver vs the other drivers at the finals or the car vs. drivers in better equipment?

I say you can do this it won't cost you nearly as much, take the best parts from the discontinued R model, use the improvements from the Type E, tune it up for GT-3 and see what happens...

Jeers to those that say I should jump into the deep end with a steep learning curve and complicated car like the TA-05IFS.

If I found I had a talent for this, I would park the TT-01 and buy something more in-line with my abilities and talent, thus I would be spending twice anyway... It would be quite funny if I started with such an expensive car and ended up no matter what I did towards the back of the pack, wow that would be disheartening now wouldn't it?

You asked for opinions, yopu have been given many and you keep coming back to why you think the TT01 will be competive for what you want. So, start racing your TT01 and move on to a new subject. The Tamiya USA track in Aliso Viejo is open every Saturday to Tamiya cars. Bring your car out an run on the Tamiya track. There will be other silver can cars there usually. Then you can see how competitive you and your car will be. Again, it is all about what YOU want to get out of it. If you are happy in the C main, run what you have on a low $$ budget. If you run with the pack, good for you. If you dominate, you will get moved up. I can't speak for other tracks but at Aliso, you will not find a highly experienced driver in Novice. For all the other tracks, people have to remember it is the local track promoter that should be weeding out local ringers in Novice, or the other drivers that know him. Is it really worth ruining the fun for real Novices just to win a meadl and a car kit ?
Kevin CBR is offline  
Old 12-14-2008, 02:39 AM
  #9883  
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: San Fernando Valley (818)
Posts: 117
Default

Do I have to say "Thank You" in every post? I said Thanks for the advice thus far. A few questions haven't been answered and most likely will go unanswered and that's okay.

I'm just doing my research that's basically all and I have decided on a TT-01, just haven't figured out which version yet -

The cheapest (TT-01)

The one with a few hop ups (TT-01D)

The one with the latest updated (TT-01E)

I have taken in advice about the Duratrax chargers and that's on my list.

Can't afford a DSM radio just yet, that's why I'm considering an XB, it comes with one and if everybody else is on DSM, no problems finding a freq I can run.

I will venture behind the R.O.C soon enough, target seems to be around early January as my next paycheck is basically spent already.

Just in case you missed it -

Thank You For All The Advice

Last edited by djfourmoney; 12-14-2008 at 02:45 AM. Reason: Nevermind, not worth it - Look for the Red SRT-4...
djfourmoney is offline  
Old 12-14-2008, 04:59 AM
  #9884  
Registered User
iTrader: (20)
 
UltegraSTI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 7,171
Trader Rating: 20 (100%+)
Default

if you guys are goin out and gettin the D or R b/c u know the advantages of droop control etc then again u shouldnt be in the spec class.

honestly, if novice adults are truely there at a 'free' race to have a good time. then the spec class should be kids. honestly kids should be able to run any chassis and get them started early but leave them able to truely move up. as i said before, also have somethin they can really race and get better each wk in their stock touring class. if guys wanna work over a 'spec' chassis to see who is a better scientist/engineer...then let em in a 'spec' class. the dirty 4-letter S-word.

lay off the tamiya guys, their tryin to make somethin for every1. heck new rule as of right now. if u complain about the spec class or gettin into the spec class, u cant run. simple.

and a lil easier than just sayin if you cant be in Menudo, then u cant be in spec.

R
UltegraSTI is offline  
Old 12-14-2008, 07:28 AM
  #9885  
Tech Regular
iTrader: (7)
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 436
Trader Rating: 7 (100%+)
Default

Hi Guys, A good friend of mine, (Former multiyear nat champ in 1/12 and 1/8 gas), gave me some real good advice a few years ago. "The best hopup part is transmitter time and don't forget at the end of the day it still is just playing with toy cars, so have a good time" Just wanted to pass it along. Andy
alphacat is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.