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Old 12-19-2006, 07:32 AM   #1156
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Default Mega Picco 0.12 DS II

Are there anybody who know, when the Mega Picco 0.12 DS II part # 201011 will be available in the US?

It look like as it only is available in Europe, but the € euro is high.
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Old 01-06-2007, 01:37 AM   #1157
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Ive bought a DSII and ran it in 2 weeks ago
Im running a Mega 2607 pipe set.
The engine doesnt seem to have the bottom end performance I was expecting.
Compared to my PR12 its dissapointing.
Has great run time though and a decent top end although I could use some more speed down the back straight.
I am running it in a G4S.
What surprised me was how much longer gearing I have on 1st gear compared to the PR12.
Engine is temping at 110deg/c and idling great ,not hunting as you come of throttle or any misbehaviour whatsoever.
Ive played with the clutch setup as well but would appreciate some feed back or tips from guys who are running it and possibly running the G4S as well.
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Old 01-06-2007, 01:41 AM   #1158
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Forgot to mention the engine comes shimmed with 2 x .2 mm shims ,is this ok for 16% or can we go smaller to .3mm ?
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Old 01-06-2007, 01:25 PM   #1159
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Guys
what's the factory setting for HSN? for ZX21 DSII
I've expericend some problems when using Josh Cyrul break-in method. I set the HSN so the whels can't spin.. my engine sounds like a 4 cycle and the temp don't get over 50ēC.. I think I'm making something wrong
Hey M7H! Where are you? Please gime me some tips to break-in this engine properly
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Old 01-06-2007, 02:15 PM   #1160
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Your doing great....
Maybe cover the engine with something, to get some heat in......
But I ran the engine too on 50-60 C the first 3 tanks WOT, like your doing now, so don't be scared.....
After a these 3 tanks give it a cooldown of 15-20 min., and run 2 additional tanks on the same setting....
again, cooldown, and then 2 tanks on the same setting, full throttle, but open the lid for 1 second and close for 3, open for 1 close for 3......

This way the engine runs a bit leaner with the tank lid open, so will raise in rpm, until you close the lid..... it's a different way of "throttle blipping"

then after a total of these 7 tanks, lean the engine until the car can move, plop it on the track, and every 1/2 tank, come in for fuel, and lean the engine 1/4 turn, until you reach the perfect mixture.....

I have 2 DSII engine, 1 brand new, the other is 7 liters of fuel old now, but still has a good pinch on TDC.....
The compression when the engine is hot, is also still great, so I can't complain about any reliability issue's like with the DSI.......
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Old 01-07-2007, 01:12 AM   #1161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by razzor
Ive bought a DSII and ran it in 2 weeks ago
Im running a Mega 2607 pipe set.
The engine doesnt seem to have the bottom end performance I was expecting.
Compared to my PR12 its dissapointing.
Has great run time though and a decent top end although I could use some more speed down the back straight.
I am running it in a G4S.
What surprised me was how much longer gearing I have on 1st gear compared to the PR12.
Engine is temping at 110deg/c and idling great ,not hunting as you come of throttle or any misbehaviour whatsoever.
Ive played with the clutch setup as well but would appreciate some feed back or tips from guys who are running it and possibly running the G4S as well.
I run at 1500 mts above sea level with 40% nitro with .3mm of shimming and allow the engine to go a bit higher in temp. I am no expert but would tend to think 120 is definitely safe.

Bringing down the button head improved both bottom and top ends.
I'd say it would not hurt to try .3 mm but stay away from .2mm.

I hope that helps. Obviously running a G4S
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Old 01-07-2007, 02:42 AM   #1162
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Thanks bud ,could you tell me what pipe and plug you run.
Obviously altitude would make a difference seeing that I am at the coast.
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Old 01-07-2007, 08:48 AM   #1163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by razzor
Thanks bud ,could you tell me what pipe and plug you run.
Obviously altitude would make a difference seeing that I am at the coast.
On a .12 engine I would only advise going 0.10mm over or under 0.46mm, so that is 0.36mm or 0.56mm of total head clearance at sea level.
Generally on a .12 engine 0.10mm will change the compression ratio about 3/4 to 1 point..

This is what I suggets for new Picco based engines:

A real head clearance between piston and combustion chamber of about 0.45mm or more, when the piston is at Top Dead Center. The real head clearance can be calculated as follows:
Real head clearance = Thickness of head shims + 0.05mm*
I suggest you start with 0.40mm shims underneath the combustion chamber. You may want to adjust the shims depending on nitro-content (see table) or track layout. Large tracks may require an extra 0.10mm shim to reach higher top speed and improved fuel consumption, but this will decrease acceleration slightly.
Nitro content 16%/ 20% /25%/ 30%
Real head clearance 0.45mm / 0.45mm / 0.55mm / 0.65mm
Head shims 0.40mm / 0.40mm / 0.50mm / 0.60mm

* (that‘s due to the internal construction of the engine and the compression of the head shims, when the cooling head is mounted

Plugs: Team drivers always uses a Picco based #7 turbo plug. Only when the ambient temperature is very high, a #8 plug is used.

UFO Clutch setting: gap 0.6mm, end play 0.1mm, yellow spring, no weights on shoes, tighten spring nut to get 0.7mm clearance to top of thread.

Gearing: These engines have a lot of torque, so they run taller gearings compared to Sirio or Nova based engines.


AFM
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Old 01-07-2007, 09:38 AM   #1164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by afm
On a .12 engine I would only advise going 0.10mm over or under 0.46mm, so that is 0.36mm or 0.56mm of total head clearance at sea level.
Generally on a .12 engine 0.10mm will change the compression ratio about 3/4 to 1 point..

This is what I suggets for new Picco based engines:

A real head clearance between piston and combustion chamber of about 0.45mm or more, when the piston is at Top Dead Center. The real head clearance can be calculated as follows:
Real head clearance = Thickness of head shims + 0.05mm*
I suggest you start with 0.40mm shims underneath the combustion chamber. You may want to adjust the shims depending on nitro-content (see table) or track layout. Large tracks may require an extra 0.10mm shim to reach higher top speed and improved fuel consumption, but this will decrease acceleration slightly.
Nitro content 16%/ 20% /25%/ 30%
Real head clearance 0.45mm / 0.45mm / 0.55mm / 0.65mm
Head shims 0.40mm / 0.40mm / 0.50mm / 0.60mm

* (that‘s due to the internal construction of the engine and the compression of the head shims, when the cooling head is mounted

Plugs: Team drivers always uses a Picco based #7 turbo plug. Only when the ambient temperature is very high, a #8 plug is used.

UFO Clutch setting: gap 0.6mm, end play 0.1mm, yellow spring, no weights on shoes, tighten spring nut to get 0.7mm clearance to top of thread.

Gearing: These engines have a lot of torque, so they run taller gearings compared to Sirio or Nova based engines.


AFM

AFM,

What would you suggest for headshims at sea level with 20%, 25%, 30% Nitro for the MEGA .21 DSII?

Thanks.
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Old 01-07-2007, 09:51 AM   #1165
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Thanks AFM .
Im on .35mm actual clearance ,think ill put it back to stock .45mm.
Is the clutch setup for the G4s.
Im running .6mm gap , .1mm play ,all weights in the shoes.
black 1.8 spring .6mm tension.
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Old 01-07-2007, 10:52 AM   #1166
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What's the factory setting for ZX21 DSII engine?
my HSN is about 1mm out and the LSN is 1mm inside the ball link. I received with this configuration. I'm a bit worried because after the 6th tank in Josh Cyrul method that says to use 2~3sec bliping instead of WOT my engine started to rev high and a I have just leaned 1/4 ... Did I made something wrong
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Old 01-07-2007, 12:08 PM   #1167
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Jeff, factory setting for the ZX21 DSII is.
HSN, almost flush with housing, so your still on the rich side,
LSN, 1-2 mm OUT of the ball link....

So your bottom end seems to be too lean, and from what your telling, I think this is the case.....
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Old 01-07-2007, 03:08 PM   #1168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by razzor
Thanks AFM .
Im on .35mm actual clearance ,think ill put it back to stock .45mm.
Is the clutch setup for the G4s.
Im running .6mm gap , .1mm play ,all weights in the shoes.
black 1.8 spring .6mm tension.
Yes the settings i gave are for the G4S UFO Clutch

AFM
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Old 01-07-2007, 03:09 PM   #1169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kendall
AFM,

What would you suggest for headshims at sea level with 20%, 25%, 30% Nitro for the MEGA .21 DSII?

Thanks.
Sorry, no experience with .21 engines

AFM
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Old 01-07-2007, 05:14 PM   #1170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M7H


Your doing great....
Maybe cover the engine with something, to get some heat in......
But I ran the engine too on 50-60 C the first 3 tanks WOT, like your doing now, so don't be scared.....
After a these 3 tanks give it a cooldown of 15-20 min., and run 2 additional tanks on the same setting....
again, cooldown, and then 2 tanks on the same setting, full throttle, but open the lid for 1 second and close for 3, open for 1 close for 3......

This way the engine runs a bit leaner with the tank lid open, so will raise in rpm, until you close the lid..... it's a different way of "throttle blipping"

then after a total of these 7 tanks, lean the engine until the car can move, plop it on the track, and every 1/2 tank, come in for fuel, and lean the engine 1/4 turn, until you reach the perfect mixture.....

I have 2 DSII engine, 1 brand new, the other is 7 liters of fuel old now, but still has a good pinch on TDC.....
The compression when the engine is hot, is also still great, so I can't complain about any reliability issue's like with the DSI.......

M7H you're the man.. Since the Evo2 problem and for choose this engine you're helpingme a lot!!

Here what I did to break-in following your tips and josh

First I opened the HSN 1 full turn from flush, then 1/2 turn... In this configuration I got a stady rev, no wheel spin (a little move from clutch, but didn't move the wheels)
The engines is on a Vector with Centax I with 9.2mm from nut to end of shaft of pre-load configuration (this is the basic setting) gap is 0.5 and end-play 0.1mm. I was using a looser configuration on this (about 7.5mm), result: engine was too rich to avoid wheel spin and I had dificult to keep it running. The temps were 70~85ēC with a towel on the head and also I kept a hairdryer on, without that my temps were 40~50ēC too cold I think
The engine ran great! For 3 tanks, after that I shut it off.. and let it cooldown. More 2 tanks and again cooldown. One more tank the same thing, on the 7th I opened the lid as you said 1sec open and 3close, the rpm raised like you said and I noticed that in the of this tank the rpm started to increase (I didn't touch on the needle) is that normal? On the 8th tank I used what Josh says close 1/4 and 2-3 bliping on 1/2 of the tank closed more 1/4 and finished the tank.. I also noticed the rpm increscing in the end of these tanks (sound like a ready to race engine), is that normal? It wasn't fuel but something in the engine that I can't discover

Today I hit the track and I had to lean about 1full turn the HSN (now it is about 0.4mm out), because the car didn't moved. Unfortunetly it started to rain and I went home
I also riched the low end as you said.. the needle is about 1mm out, but I had to lean it a bit because the engines tend to die


any advice for break-in on the track?

Thanks!
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