Palmaris engine thread

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Old 07-07-2004, 08:34 AM
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Old 07-07-2004, 07:33 PM
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Default temp range

I know this is a very vague question, and I know you cannot tune just by temp alone, but around what temps are you guys running at. I know some engines like it hotter than others. All I have leaned it out to is 190 or so at the glowplug, maybe 160-170 at the cylinder. This weekend hopefully, I can tune it in some more.
Tks
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Old 07-07-2004, 08:26 PM
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Chuck, I would lean the engine out more. If you want to pay attention to temps, make sure the crank case just below the cooling head is at least 190F. This will give the sleeve a chance to expand and not be too tight for the piston. Also, I suggest that you give the engine 30 sec. or more to warm up before you put it on the track (i think this goes for other engines as well). If the engine's not up to temp then you're just placing extra stress on the moving parts that doesn't need to be there. You'll get a feel for the warm up when you go out too early and the engine doesn't run out on the straight for the first lap then it does on the next lap.

My engines in TX have typically been running 250-260F at the button. I don't worry as much with this engine as I do with other designs. Actually, when I raced at the O'Donnell champs, I never checked temp. I tuned it and ran.
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Old 07-07-2004, 08:34 PM
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Tks Surge, I like the engine. I was on par with the others out there, and I know I have a lot of tuneing in to do. Too bad I had other problems on Sat. All ready to go Sunday and it rained. I should be going to the 1/8 scale setup in Bklyn on Sat if all goes to plan, Should be a nice test.
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Old 07-08-2004, 02:56 AM
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Default Re: temp range

Originally posted by CHUCKMANDO
I know this is a very vague question, and I know you cannot tune just by temp alone, but around what temps are you guys running at. I know some engines like it hotter than others. All I have leaned it out to is 190 or so at the glowplug, maybe 160-170 at the cylinder. This weekend hopefully, I can tune it in some more.
Tks
Chuckmando
Here in HK, we have been running at around 130 celsius, from the plug. The sleeve section was around 95. Our air temp have been around 35 so is quite hot.
As Surge said, don't worry too much about temp on this engine.
But do "read" the plug after you have adjusted tunning

have fun kicking/passing other engines
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Old 07-08-2004, 08:23 AM
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I want a motor !!!
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Old 07-08-2004, 09:07 AM
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They're still for sale!
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Old 07-08-2004, 09:21 AM
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Originally posted by Pit-racer
They're still for sale!
where?
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Old 07-08-2004, 10:14 AM
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From Top Gun 777 of course.
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Old 07-08-2004, 10:22 AM
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Originally posted by Pit-racer
From Top Gun 777 of course.
Thanks i got his PM
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Old 07-10-2004, 09:25 AM
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Default Piston Modification

Top Gun 777,

Hiya Edward !! How r u ?. The weather in UK is too wet for 1/8th racing and even for the F1 !!

Just a quick question, the holes adjacent to the the conrod holes in the piston. How would the performances of the engine will be affected if these holes were to be made bigger or groves were cut into them ? I assume that fuel consumption and torque would be increased. Would be grateful if you could shed some lights on this question. There are quiet a few topics in this forum about the modification of crankshafts, liners and carbs, but no topic on piston mod !!! What else can you do to improve the efficient of the piston?

Thanks

Xtreme888
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Old 07-10-2004, 04:36 PM
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Default Re: help

Originally posted by Marcos.S710
I want a motor !!!
I finally started leaning the engine out and wow. I am ok on the bottom end at best, so far, but the mid and top end are great. I am compareing it to my exceptional Rb x12 ( which is very touquie) which I have in my other ntc3 and my friends sirio today. We were on a small to mid, not too technical track today. My problem is that I geared for the large track we were supposed to go to. After we finished I asked him what he thought, and he said its probably the fastest engine he has seen so far. He is not one to give compliments too freely too. Tomorrow I will check it out against the usuals. I am very happy with the engine so far.

Thanks Ed
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Old 07-10-2004, 08:18 PM
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Chuck,

Edward's probaby suggested it already but... the PS12 tunes different than other Nova or Sirios I've turned. I had to learn out of that a little for this one. It wants to be leaner on the bottom than any other engine I've run. I usually try to get the top end tuned on straight. Then on the starter box with the engine around 200F or so I lean to bottom end until the engine starts bogging a little. Then richen the bottom needle maybe 1-2hrs and try that. You may also have to richen the top needle just a little to compensate. I pinch the fuel tube about 3inches back from the carb and count between 1-2 secs before the engine dies. It might help with the bottom end a little. Edward probably disagrees with me tuning on the starter box but it'll get you close.
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Old 07-10-2004, 11:00 PM
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Default Re: Re: help

Originally posted by CHUCKMANDO
I finally started leaning the engine out and wow. I am ok on the bottom end at best, so far, but the mid and top end are great. I am compareing it to my exceptional Rb x12 ( which is very touquie) which I have in my other ntc3 and my friends sirio today. We were on a small to mid, not too technical track today. My problem is that I geared for the large track we were supposed to go to. After we finished I asked him what he thought, and he said its probably the fastest engine he has seen so far. He is not one to give compliments too freely too. Tomorrow I will check it out against the usuals. I am very happy with the engine so far.

Thanks Ed
Chuck,
I have the PS12 installed on mine710 now. Other then tunning/leaning the bottom like Surge have suggested, I would also try tighten the Clutch spring little bit more ( I have 1.2mm distance now) and I actually used smaller first spur gear but tighter the 2 speed so that it will engage into 2nd later. I just tried this on a fairly big track with 240 feet straight. (n passing 1/8 ) with better result.

good luck
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Old 07-11-2004, 06:56 AM
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Default Re: Piston Modification

Originally posted by xtreme888
Top Gun 777,

Hiya Edward !! How r u ?. The weather in UK is too wet for 1/8th racing and even for the F1 !!

Just a quick question, the holes adjacent to the the conrod holes in the piston. How would the performances of the engine will be affected if these holes were to be made bigger or groves were cut into them ? I assume that fuel consumption and torque would be increased. Would be grateful if you could shed some lights on this question. There are quiet a few topics in this forum about the modification of crankshafts, liners and carbs, but no topic on piston mod !!! What else can you do to improve the efficient of the piston?

Thanks

Xtreme888
Hi Xtreme.
I realy don't understand the stry about "holes adjacent", never heard this word before. Can you please rephrase it to more simple.
About piston modification, there is not to much to moddify if everything done right or if everything done and nothing left to midify. A lot of moddifyers are cutting scirt further on buster side ( the most modding I saw so far), but I see it differently. Piston also must to be balanced-if we cut metal from one side, the other side will be haevier ( I think it is abviouse). At speed of piston this weight differnce became as big dragging force to side opposite of cutted and this is realy heart on performance and engine life. On PS12 piston isn't cut at all.
The main thing about piston is alloy propertiesl properties and this is the reason why I am making my own P/S sets even for existing engines- we have different view and expirience. It has been proove already many times that we put my P/S set ( stock version) on existing engines and performance is totaly different from original P/S set.
Also I totaly disagree with grooves made on top of piston ( I am assuming they are for lubrication). That grooves are garbage collectores, nothing else. According to the theory, that grooves have to trap oil for extra lubrication, but what is happening if oil realy traped there and stays there for 5 minuts_it is realy trap and oil isn't cyrcylating there it is just carbonising and after couple runs 0il became as a hard substance and will nto do designed work, actualy can became as cutter. Oils which we use to lubricate our engines ( castor and synthetic) are realy strong on molecular level, specialy castor oil, it has ammesing properties and it is very difficult to brake it's film even if thickness is close to size of moleculas. Conclusion is-we don't need grooves.
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