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Old 03-02-2007, 05:39 AM   #961
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I have droped the gearing from 17/23 to 16/22 on the MTX4, is their anything else that I should look at to help get the most out of the engine. Running the Orion clutch and pipe (Cyrul Worlds combo).

Any help appreciated

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Old 03-02-2007, 01:11 PM   #962
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nano
Clutch:
Kyosho White Clutch Weight - Drilled to 3.5mm
Kyosho 1.9mm Hard Spring at 1.40 setting
Gap = .50
Kyosho Grey Clutch Shoe

Gearing:
16 / 22 Pinion
56 / 59 Spur

These are just to get you started. The gearing we don't change that much.

Nano
thanks nano,
when you say drill to 3.5, this means open up the 3 holes in each of the 3 clutch wieghts-holes, and do not use any set screws(not using any now)?
so im lightning the white clutch weights?
thanks for your help...

As far as the Audio tach, you might want to check with EdwardN on that... or search on google for audio tachometer... my buddy has the software, ill find out more info.
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Old 03-03-2007, 12:57 AM   #963
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Here we go-here is some links where you guys can get what you are looking for-it is not direct Audio Tachometer, but defenetly with some of your friend who has some programming expririence-it can be converted to Audio tachometer http://www.relisoft.com/Freeware/freq.html . Those guys are so kind-they provide source code, which will make progarmmer work way easier. It still required to install some friquency filters and converter (devide Friquency by 60 to get RPM), but it is piece of cake project..

Here is ready written software in 2 versions-for pocket PC and Windows based PC. Honestly I ddindt't have luck with it-I couldn't tuned it right and I have mine works great so I droped it, but may be somebody will be more lucky then me. http://www.tunelab-world.com/rpmsound.html
Good luck.
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Old 03-03-2007, 01:16 AM   #964
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nano
Clutch:
Kyosho White Clutch Weight - Drilled to 3.5mm
Kyosho 1.9mm Hard Spring at 1.40 setting
Gap = .50
Kyosho Grey Clutch Shim

Nano
By drilling the clutch weights bigger what does that do, can you explain ,and what do the set screws do with the orion clutch when they are added because i have seen where some people say to put 2 set scews in each weight.
can someone explain the whole clutch weight thing I would app..to get more knowledge on the centax setup

Last edited by MRX4-R03; 03-03-2007 at 10:52 AM.
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Old 03-03-2007, 10:34 AM   #965
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I was told the lighter the clutch weights the more linear the acceleration would be. Increasing the clutch weights will lead to more initial punch. I just know the facts but have no idea of what physics is behind that ...
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Old 03-03-2007, 11:06 AM   #966
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With more weight you have more momentum(energy). So, considering the same RPM to move the havier clucth weight, it will take longer to build the energy necessary to move the shoe, but when it does, it have so much energy(compared to a lighter weight) that the engagement is harder.
Ain't that ?
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Old 03-04-2007, 01:07 AM   #967
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This is how the clutch works

The RPM of the engine throws the clutch weights out. As the flywheel is tapered the weights also travel forward. This forward movement is resisted by the spring. The weights push the clutch shoe onto the clutch bell and engages the clutch. Drop the RPM and the reverse happens

If the weights are heavy the force forward will be more than if they are light for given RPM and so you will need a stronger spring or more spring tension. If they are lighter (with bigger holes) they need less spring tension

The heavier the weights the more force applied to the clutch bell when its engaged at High RPM.

As the power of the engine comes in at high revs you need the engine to rev before engaging the clutch and so need to adjust the tension of the spring to suit your engine. My advice is keep screwing it in until the car doesn't handle well then back it off a bit.

The CRF engine has a higher powerband and so needs the clutch to engage later. It also has more power so needs more force to keep the clutch engaged. If you lighten the clutch weights it will engage later but have less force when engaging so will slip so the Team Orion guys made the clutch weights heavier (Inserts) and a stronger sping. This ensures the clutch engages later and with more force to match the engine characteristics

The gap is also important as the more the gap the more the clutch shoe accelerates into the clutch bell and the more "snap" you get. For a general rule the more spring tension you have the less gap you need

Hope this helps
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Old 03-04-2007, 01:23 AM   #968
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Ziggy12345,

Morning !! weather so bad that we r on pc instead !! I am using the orion serpent combo clutch, but it never came with any weights or drilled out. Performance wise at bottom is already quicker than most engine at the moment. I set the clutch by making it slip after 4/5 laps den back off the screw until the clutch engaged. So drilling and inserting weights would improve bottom end more, is that correct ? Gonna to experiments when weather permitted.
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Old 03-04-2007, 01:38 AM   #969
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The weights fit without drilling. Only drill the holes if you want to lighten the clutch. With the CRF spring you dont need to.
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Old 03-04-2007, 12:03 PM   #970
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggy12345
The weights fit without drilling. Only drill the holes if you want to lighten the clutch. With the CRF spring you dont need to.
so by drilling the kyosho weights bigger and using them with the kyosho hard spring your doing worse..
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Old 03-04-2007, 02:42 PM   #971
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It will engage later but with less force so will slip like mad

Cheers
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Old 03-04-2007, 06:00 PM   #972
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Thumbs up murnan crf powered 720

hey ,guys bobby here just got back from state race,the murnan crf ,amazed everyone by winning 3 out 4 qailifiers the 4 one, i came in 2nd behind Paul Wynn sorry PW if i didnt spell your last name right which put me second behind Uriah Murnan ,won the 25min B final,bump to the 30min A final finished 8th the engine stood up to the plate,I got to run with the best in florida So in total the Murnan CRF run for a total of 1hr.Runtime was about 5 1/2 mins.
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Old 03-05-2007, 03:43 AM   #973
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Seeking a little bit of help here. My tune seems to be good as it idles in the pit nicely, makes good power and runtime. Idles nicely at the end of the race but during a race it will won't drop to idle when you cut the throttle going into a corner.
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Old 03-05-2007, 08:04 AM   #974
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The white material used for original Kyosho weights is heavier and softer than the material used for the CRF weigths. In these settings (given by Josh Cyrul) he drilled them to 3.5mm in order to make them lighter.

What can happen over time is that the softer weights start binding (because of wear and dirt) to the shoe plate, causing friction and instability in the clutch function.

The CRF weights using a lighter and harder material have 2 main advantages, firstly they last longer and minimize the binding to the shoe plate, secondly you can adjust the weight of the weigths by adding screws.

At this time, we are using 2 screws in each weight for the Kyosho CRF clutch parts.

The heavier the weights, the harder the spring needs to be to slow the engagement of the clutch. However springs have a certain range of function, so a softer highly compressed spring will not work the same as a harder less compressed spring.
At a certain point of compression, springs stop working properly. So if you have to compress the spring too much, it will become impossible to get the clutch to work as it is meant to.

Another important point is the gap between the shoe and clutch bell, this will also vastly affect how your clutch engages. A larger gap will usually give a more violent clutch engagement and a smaller gap will give a more progressive clutch engagement.

At the end there is not only one setting that works, there can be small variations depending on the drivers preference.

Nano
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Old 03-05-2007, 08:09 AM   #975
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B4
Seeking a little bit of help here. My tune seems to be good as it idles in the pit nicely, makes good power and runtime. Idles nicely at the end of the race but during a race it will won't drop to idle when you cut the throttle going into a corner.
You might be too rich on the low end and too lean on the top end. Trying opening the HSN half a turn and closing the LSN by 2 marks. Then you can close the HSN as long as you are not getting this high idling while driving on the track.

If you canno't solve the problem with these settings, maybe your clutch is sticking when you lift the throttle an that is spinning the engine even if the throttle is closed.

Nano
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