Go Back  R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Nitro Off-Road > Offroad Nitro Engine Forum
Rossi Elite 5 lsn/glow plug question >

Rossi Elite 5 lsn/glow plug question

Like Tree1Likes
  • 1 Post By Roelof

Rossi Elite 5 lsn/glow plug question

Reply

Old 09-28-2019, 11:14 PM
  #1  
Tech Initiate
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Posts: 40
Default Rossi Elite 5 lsn/glow plug question

Being new to the nitro world, I wanted some clarification on the factory lsn setting. Iíve started a break recently and was curious about the lsn setting. Says to be adjusted when the carb barrel is fully open. Is this in reference to me, I guess opening the throttle with my radios, screwing in till tension then unscrewing to 5 turns? Or say, with linkages off and barrel open, then adjust. I ask this because the setting seems to be different at all points in the carb barrel is open/closed. EPA is set to 6.5mm to match the Venturi. Through 5 tanks Iím a bit lean on lsn I believe by looking at the plug/smoke, rich in the hsn judging by smoke. And temps are still not quite what I think is right. Iím still in the 200-220 range but barely the upper end of that range. Buggy isles decent and makes decent passes. And again I know this is just a starting guide.

Next is plug question. I ordered a cto7 to match my temps here in Florida and the first 2 tanks I had bubbling fuel/oil out the top of the plug/motor. Taper looked good, threads werenít stripped. Basically it ran like shit for the 2 tanks. I replaced with a 5, pretty much opposite of my temps here in Florida and it started to run well with no bubbling of fuel. This had me thinking. Either way Iíll continue with tanks 5-8/9 and not worry about needle settings and get the temps I should see at the motor. Any suggestions or input is greatly appreciated
KeyMB is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2019, 01:44 AM
  #2  
Tech Champion
 
Roelof's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Holland
Posts: 8,191
Default

You need to set the EPA a bit larger, not to the ventury but take out the vantury and be sure the barrel goes a little bit beyond the opening. That is needed to be sure the carb stays maximized open that flex in the chassis while running at full speed can not cause a small jitter on the full throttle.
The same with idle, you need to have some small space when moving the throttle before it will move the carburator to prevent a jitter on idle with vibrations in the chassis.

The LSN is basically the acceleration screw. If the top speed has a nice constant speed/sound then the LSN will determ the speed how fast it will reach the top speed. And there is a limit when you notice it will hold in. Just find a good setting and do not go too lean unless you want to win races.

It is true that the glowplug need to or just can be chosen with the outside temperature but air pressure and humidity also plays a role so it is no standard must. It is all about ignition timing. Because these engines work on a self combustion the ignition is determed by all kind of factors (weather, nitro, plug number and headplay), the glowplug is one of them. With some shifting of the ignition timing you can controll the behavour of the engine, more rpm when it is set to a later ignition (colder plug) and more bottom torque with a sooner ignition (hotter plug)
KeyMB likes this.
Roelof is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2019, 06:27 AM
  #3  
Tech Initiate
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Posts: 40
Default

Originally Posted by Roelof View Post
You need to set the EPA a bit larger, not to the ventury but take out the vantury and be sure the barrel goes a little bit beyond the opening. That is needed to be sure the carb stays maximized open that flex in the chassis while running at full speed can not cause a small jitter on the full throttle.
The same with idle, you need to have some small space when moving the throttle before it will move the carburator to prevent a jitter on idle with vibrations in the chassis.

The LSN is basically the acceleration screw. If the top speed has a nice constant speed/sound then the LSN will determ the speed how fast it will reach the top speed. And there is a limit when you notice it will hold in. Just find a good setting and do not go too lean unless you want to win races.

It is true that the glowplug need to or just can be chosen with the outside temperature but air pressure and humidity also plays a role so it is no standard must. It is all about ignition timing. Because these engines work on a self combustion the ignition is determed by all kind of factors (weather, nitro, plug number and headplay), the glowplug is one of them. With some shifting of the ignition timing you can controll the behavour of the engine, more rpm when it is set to a later ignition (colder plug) and more bottom torque with a sooner ignition (hotter plug)
Thanks for the info. Iíll take a look at my throttle epa with Venturi out. Idle part I believe I have correct as I put a piece of paper between the horn end and set screw knob, giving me a tiny bit of movement before it pulls the carb. As far as the plug, I figured being in Florida and humid as hell, that the plug recommended for this motor would run a bit better than it did. Compared to one I didnít think Iíd use. I did order a couple P3ís to give them a try instead of he novarossi plugs.
KeyMB is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2019, 11:47 AM
  #4  
am
Tech Master
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,817
Default

When it is humid you need a slightly warmer plug becasue of the "water" i the air. The P3 plugs are to hot for the Nova engines. I have not got an OS plug working good in a Nova and i have sold them and used tham 10+ year in total.

For the Elite 5 i recomend the C6 TGC if you can get hold of it. It works very well in all temps we have here 27 degrees celcius and a very few times hotter. (not this year tpough) :-)

Good luck and welcome to the wonderful world of nitro RC racing. :-)
am is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2019, 04:44 PM
  #5  
Tech Initiate
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Posts: 40
Default

Originally Posted by am View Post
When it is humid you need a slightly warmer plug becasue of the "water" i the air. The P3 plugs are to hot for the Nova engines. I have not got an OS plug working good in a Nova and i have sold them and used tham 10+ year in total.

For the Elite 5 i recomend the C6 TGC if you can get hold of it. It works very well in all temps we have here 27 degrees celcius and a very few times hotter. (not this year tpough) :-)

Good luck and welcome to the wonderful world of nitro RC racing. :-)
Thanks for the info. Iíll note that I did look at that particular plug but itís a discontinued plug. They say the CTO6 replaces that. But either way, Iíll be picking up a couple of everything. At this point, itís trial and error on my part
KeyMB is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2019, 12:49 PM
  #6  
Tech Apprentice
 
srt4johnny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 58
Default

Donít have time to go into details right now but a buddy of mine ran OS P3 in his Nova and it wrecked all sorts of havoc I would suggest sticking to Nova plugs
srt4johnny is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-05-2019, 05:45 PM
  #7  
Tech Initiate
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Posts: 40
Default Novarossi Elite 5 motor/plug help

May be a bit long but Iím curious with this. A couple days ago I ran my 8th tank of fuel through the motor. Had the needles set to a decent setting while not being extremely lean/rich. My first cto7 plug I used had some issues. Had a bit of bubbling from the plug area and ran like crap(85-90 degree temps here). Put the 5 plug in it about the 3rd tank to the 8th. It ran pretty damn good, but noticed a slight bubble here and there from the plug again. Today I went to fire it up again to mess with t some more and the buggy would not fire up. Just turned over and over and over. Carb was getting fuel, and nothing seemed out of wack. It just wouldnít fire up. I couldnít find the original cto7 plug so I couldnít test that. The 5 still had a glow when put on the igniter out of the motor. I guess my 2 questions would be, what would or does cause the bubbles I see from the plug area? And lastly, would 5-6 tanks of fuel through the 5 really cause it to not start even if the plug would glow on the igniter? Iím newer to the nitro world and am looking for any help, tips and suggestions. The only plug I have now at the moment is an OS P4, which I read is not wise in the Rossi motors. Let me know what you think.

Tomorrow I was going to try to Richen up the lsn/hsn a bit more and try to see if it fires up then. But I will add, after the 8th tank, pinch test and seeing a decent trail of smoke under load weíre all about right. Thanks for reading guys
KeyMB is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2019, 01:51 AM
  #8  
Tech Initiate
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Posts: 40
Default

Originally Posted by srt4johnny View Post
Donít have time to go into details right now but a buddy of mine ran OS P3 in his Nova and it wrecked all sorts of havoc I would suggest sticking to Nova plugs
While I have a P4 laying around, I did decide not to use it and will order Nova plugs. The noticeable difference in overall length and other physical differences was big as well. I do not know enough yet to try that. I read you can, I read you canít. I didnít like that. Iíll stick with Nova
KeyMB is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2019, 02:49 AM
  #9  
Tech Champion
 
Roelof's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Holland
Posts: 8,191
Default

I think 1 topic is enough?
Rossi Elite 5 lsn/glow plug question
Roelof is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2019, 12:35 PM
  #10  
Tech Initiate
iTrader: (2)
 
Galatians2 20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Location: NYC
Posts: 32
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

I heard from someone that use to only run Nova, that Nova's like to run a little leaner on the lsn then other motors which to me makes sense why they use colder plugs then other manufacturers.
I also have to make sure igniter is strong on battery power.

I've read and heard a few places that the Nova setting they give as factory for having your lsn out 5-6 turns in the beginning is off.
This time I started with my lsn at 3 5/8 turns out on original start and opened idle gap. After about 9 break in tanks had to lean it about 2 hours about 1/8 of turn as I was starting to put more load on it slowly giving it more throttle. I also leaned out the hsn at this point about 2 hours.
I then took it to the track and hit the straight back and forth a few times easy on the throttle and started leaning out hsn an hour at a time until I got good rpm and sound and leaned out lsn probably another 1/8 turn, then took it easy on the track for a few tanks.
I then had to lean out lsn and adjust idle gap to get better throttle response and good sounding idle that came down off of full throttle. I left with it running great and hottest it got was about 235* F, so I know I can still go leaner hsn.
At this point the lsn was about 3 1/8 turns out with small idle gap probably about .4-.5mm.
After issues with first motor I richened up lsn and opened idle gap a bit and engine was not running with great snap/response like before. Got dark so couldn't keep tuning. I will be going back to getting my lsn leaner with smaller gap.
This was all done with a #7 plug and cool temps low 70's. I will be putting in a #6 soon which will probably allow me to go a tad richer on low end.

Hopes this helps you out as I'm sharing what i'm learning about Nova's as well.
Galatians2 20 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2019, 06:26 AM
  #11  
Tech Initiate
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Posts: 40
Default

Originally Posted by Galatians2 20 View Post
I heard from someone that use to only run Nova, that Nova's like to run a little leaner on the lsn then other motors which to me makes sense why they use colder plugs then other manufacturers.
I also have to make sure igniter is strong on battery power.

I've read and heard a few places that the Nova setting they give as factory for having your lsn out 5-6 turns in the beginning is off.
This time I started with my lsn at 3 5/8 turns out on original start and opened idle gap. After about 9 break in tanks had to lean it about 2 hours about 1/8 of turn as I was starting to put more load on it slowly giving it more throttle. I also leaned out the hsn at this point about 2 hours.
I then took it to the track and hit the straight back and forth a few times easy on the throttle and started leaning out hsn an hour at a time until I got good rpm and sound and leaned out lsn probably another 1/8 turn, then took it easy on the track for a few tanks.
I then had to lean out lsn and adjust idle gap to get better throttle response and good sounding idle that came down off of full throttle. I left with it running great and hottest it got was about 235* F, so I know I can still go leaner hsn.
At this point the lsn was about 3 1/8 turns out with small idle gap probably about .4-.5mm.
After issues with first motor I richened up lsn and opened idle gap a bit and engine was not running with great snap/response like before. Got dark so couldn't keep tuning. I will be going back to getting my lsn leaner with smaller gap.
This was all done with a #7 plug and cool temps low 70's. I will be putting in a #6 soon which will probably allow me to go a tad richer on low end.

Hopes this helps you out as I'm sharing what i'm learning about Nova's as well.
For the most part Iíve taken similar steps to the needle tunes. It ran great for 8 tanks and my lsn was in the same ballpark as yours by the last tank. My concern came when I went to run a 9th tank, it would not fire up for the life of it. This was on the #5 plug as my 7 I had running issues and a decent amount of bubbles from the plug area. The 5 was good but again it will not fire up now. I have some OS plugs but Iíve been advised not to do that. I have more #6 novas on the way so hopefully it was a plug issue as it ran great 2 days prior. The 5 still glows which had me concerned as well as to why it wouldnít start. Thanks for the info
KeyMB is offline  
Reply With Quote

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service