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Old 12-18-2017, 03:08 PM
  #61  
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I agree Julius
I think we are both are saying the same thing here. May well be my fault as sometimes I do not explain too well.

Can cloud thing's when trying to consider both pivot ball and C hub susp'.

Either way. I think there is an enormous potential in the design of the XRay suspension. Something to definitely build on! Will be interesting to see where they go with the car.

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Old 12-19-2017, 06:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Julius View Post
I had been under the impression that the xray car had its lower wishbone parallel to the ground. But looking at the build manual it seems xray forgot to ‘optimise’ this. Kickup in itself has nothing to do with anti dive etc. It is all dependant on the pivot points. And they are easily changed, however it seems the pillow ball suspension on the xray is counterproductive here as it would require a modified top arm pivot setup as well.

Also the kickup on the buggy chassis is the wrong way to go for on road cars. As the std angle of buggy front suspension will increase dive under braking and increase lift of the front under acceleration. If you wish to use anti dive for gt the lower arm should be lower in front!

I tested with the serpent rtr gt recently. As it has angled lower front arms as standard, it is similar to the xray in suspension setup. One of the tested options was the cobra 3.0 front pivot points which put the lower arm parallel to the ground. Although laptimes were only slightly better, the car felt so much more lije a real racecar. Much less reactive to on/off power transitions. A much more noticable change that just reducing caster.

The kickup rule of ifmar is a last ditch attempt to keep the cars close to buggys. But I think that station is passed already. The essence of gt is not in kickup but in the shaft drive, rubber tires and bodyshell type. As long as the tire situation is not allowed to get out of hand, read hand out or restricted tires for races, the class will be ok.
+YUP!
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Old 12-26-2017, 06:21 PM
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Hi friends, here is the setup we used in the World Cup in Argentina to be in fourth place. Regards

XRAY ::: Set-up Sheet - GTX8'17
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Old 01-03-2018, 04:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Julius View Post
I had been under the impression that the xray car had its lower wishbone parallel to the ground. But looking at the build manual it seems xray forgot to ‘optimise’ this. Kickup in itself has nothing to do with anti dive etc. It is all dependant on the pivot points. And they are easily changed, however it seems the pillow ball suspension on the xray is counterproductive here as it would require a modified top arm pivot setup as well.

Also the kickup on the buggy chassis is the wrong way to go for on road cars. As the std angle of buggy front suspension will increase dive under braking and increase lift of the front under acceleration. If you wish to use anti dive for gt the lower arm should be lower in front!

I tested with the serpent rtr gt recently. As it has angled lower front arms as standard, it is similar to the xray in suspension setup. One of the tested options was the cobra 3.0 front pivot points which put the lower arm parallel to the ground. Although laptimes were only slightly better, the car felt so much more lije a real racecar. Much less reactive to on/off power transitions. A much more noticable change that just reducing caster.

The kickup rule of ifmar is a last ditch attempt to keep the cars close to buggys. But I think that station is passed already. The essence of gt is not in kickup but in the shaft drive, rubber tires and bodyshell type. As long as the tire situation is not allowed to get out of hand, read hand out or restricted tires for races, the class will be ok.

I just read this again and I'm afraid it's actually incorrect, or at the very least, a play on words.
Nothing has anything to do with caster angle "in itself" except the caster angle itself. BUT numerous adjustments made to a car can have an effect on changing the caster angle.
For example. If you alter the kick up from 7 degrees to 2 degrees and with out changing anything else. This change WILL change the caster angle! In reality. You will have problems putting the car back together as some parts like the top bulkhead brace may not then fit.
Another point.
Yes. The angle of the lower wishbone inner pivot pin has a direct effect on anti-dive/ pro-dive setting. As does the angle of the upper, inner wishbone pivot pin.
Points of detail can so easily be lost in such forum "conversation's"
The last paragraph in the quote I totally agree with though.
Just felt I needed to put this straight. Either way. I am looking at buying the X Ray GTX when we get some details, if planned at all(?) on the 2018 model.

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Old 01-03-2018, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by British Menace View Post
I just read this again and I'm afraid it's actually incorrect, or at the very least, a play on words.
Nothing has anything to do with caster angle "in itself" except the caster angle itself. BUT numerous adjustments made to a car can have an effect on changing the caster angle.
For example. If you alter the kick up from 7 degrees to 2 degrees and with out changing anything else. This change WILL change the caster angle! In reality. You will have problems putting the car back together as some parts like the top bulkhead brace may not then fit.
Another point.
Yes. The angle of the lower wishbone inner pivot pin has a direct effect on anti-dive/ pro-dive setting. As does the angle of the upper, inner wishbone pivot pin.
Points of detail can so easily be lost in such forum "conversation's"
The last paragraph in the quote I totally agree with though.
Just felt I needed to put this straight. Either way. I am looking at buying the X Ray GTX when we get some details, if planned at all(?) on the 2018 model.

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BM
Julius is stating the same thing as an answer / response to the earlier messages

Last edited by wkloppen; 01-03-2018 at 12:22 PM.
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Old 01-04-2018, 04:12 AM
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Originally Posted by wkloppen View Post
Julius is stating the same thing as an answer / response to the earlier messages
This is why things can get confusing. I did not get that impression at all. Mainly cause of the quote I added to (and the replied to/ the point of) my message above.

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Old 01-04-2018, 05:19 AM
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Originally Posted by British Menace View Post
This is why things can get confusing. I did not get that impression at all. Mainly cause of the quote I added to (and the replied to/ the point of) my message above.

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BM
True that but if you read between the lines, take into account the various native languages we write/speak including a full awareness of the content we're discussing which sometimes can be a bit difficult, Im pretty sure the conclusions on the topic are heading in the same direction
All in all worthy content I would say....

w.
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Old 01-04-2018, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by wkloppen View Post
True that but if you read between the lines, take into account the various native languages we write/speak including a full awareness of the content we're discussing which sometimes can be a bit difficult, Im pretty sure the conclusions on the topic are heading in the same direction
All in all worthy content I would say....

w.
Sure. I agree. I just wanted to clarify. I am just interested to see where XRay go with this car.
It is unfortunate that ROAR are not ditching this "keep it like a buggy" idea and let GT become and evolve into an on-road class in it's own right! But that's probably better discussed in another forum topic :-)

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Old 04-05-2018, 02:27 PM
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Source velocity racing, sure some of you will be happy 😃
“This is what all the GTX8 drivers have been waiting for, the new angled front upper arm , when fitted it will put the caster to around the 6° mark, still leaving some caster adjustment on the pivot pins for forward and rearward movement on the arm. So Hudy has listened and watched what's been happening and responded reasonably quickly.”

Piece reference: 352134 at Hudy shop
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Old 04-11-2018, 12:22 PM
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Nuevo brazo delantero de x GT

• Ángulo inferior de caster
• Aumento de la dirección
• Menos desgaste de los neumáticos
• Mejora de la gestión

Brazo de suspensión frontal para gtx y gtxe hecho de material compuesto de alta tecnología. Diseñado específicamente para la plataforma GT, con un ángulo de caster inferior que proporciona más dirección y menos desgaste de neumáticos. Dirección más precisa en las esquinas. Una parte de la opción "debe tener" para cada gt racer que quiere mejorar significativamente el manejo de su coche.

#352134 GT FRENTE AL BRAZO SUPERIOR

http://bit.ly/2staHk3
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Old 05-23-2018, 08:45 AM
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Setup del Xray GTX8 en la final de la primera prueba del campeonato de España en Arca-Madrid con el que conseguimos la victoria.

https://imgur.com/a/AZX1sO1
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Old 08-28-2018, 12:17 PM
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Anyone feel that the rear shock shafts or eyelets should be longer to get the proper droop? The manual has a 3mm thread above the eyelet for the rear shock shaft but the shock doesn't reach the mounting hole without pulling the arm up. I had to go to about 4.5mm and use a different droop setting than the setup sheets posted online.
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