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Old 06-18-2007, 05:16 PM   #7201
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Originally Posted by Lycan View Post
kodakhodak: Are you running a mugen rear sway bar? What size?

Have you tried a 2.0mm one?

On our low grip track I found my G4S wanted to keep swapping ends with the 2.3mm swaybar on. As soon as I changed to a 2.0, the issue disappeared.
still running the smae swaybar, hoping to get the new G4S+ new setup on next order!!!

plus a whole bunch more - my biggest mistake this weekend was i ran 30,000 diff oil with 40W shore rears tires!
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Old 06-18-2007, 05:17 PM   #7202
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Originally Posted by rmdhawaii View Post
Second car is good for testing and having a backup, but it's much more work and unless you got exactly the same gear in each - and move motors to do comparisons, it's really not the same.

If you're running a stock OS TZ, perhaps it's time to get something faster. TZ will only take you so far. What I found with my stock TZ and setup, is that if you lose a few positions, you really can't catch up, because it just doesn't have enough power. If you want to keep the TZ, a Murnan crank will give you much more bottom end if you're on a technical track.

For a lot more power all the way around, try the newest CRF with all the upgrades. That thing is very quick. Or maybe one of those IDMs.

What gearing are you running on the ED and have you tried different combos. Also, have you tried DAZ's clutch setup? It's in the KB.
so considerring new engine, as this OS TZ is great for a starter now its time for that extra KAPOW!!!
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Old 06-18-2007, 05:23 PM   #7203
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Also i think i need to do is these MODS ASAP:

A. shorten the front arms lower to gain smaller front width

B. Reduce wheel base in the rear by 3mm

C. Place back 10,000 rear diff oil as i think spool up front helps with front traction

D. NEW engine - one that is competitive

E. maybe new tire brand

F. FUN is always F LOL

G. require good setup for low grip & bumpy track
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Old 06-18-2007, 07:46 PM   #7204
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Originally Posted by Kodak Hodak View Post
Also i think i need to do is these MODS ASAP:

A. shorten the front arms lower to gain smaller front width

B. Reduce wheel base in the rear by 3mm

C. Place back 10,000 rear diff oil as i think spool up front helps with front traction

D. NEW engine - one that is competitive

E. maybe new tire brand

F. FUN is always F LOL

G. require good setup for low grip & bumpy track
Looks like a sound plan to me. Would be good to try these first before you bolt on any G4+ parts.

For tires, you may want to try a set or two of Kawaharas, just to run a comparison. The fact that you were running 30K diff oil in the rear under low traction conditions, may not actually reflect the performance of the K Factory or Jaco tires, so you should try running them again with 10K in the rear.
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Old 06-18-2007, 07:55 PM   #7205
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Originally Posted by gansei View Post
hi!!! kodakhodak

the most difficult setup was corner exit.

the rear grip was very unstable.
I have driven on low grip the past several races I got rear grip with mostly half full 10K rear diff and front spool or 100K diff.
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Old 06-18-2007, 08:37 PM   #7206
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i have a question about car cornering setup.

if i want to increase more steering and rotation speed,

is increasing more rear camber effective?
What are your thoughts on this? How does this compare to the stock setup?
http://www.nitrokb.com/g4s/faqtips.html#setup3
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Old 06-18-2007, 08:55 PM   #7207
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Originally Posted by rmdhawaii View Post
What are your thoughts on this? How does this compare to the stock setup?
http://www.nitrokb.com/g4s/faqtips.html#setup3
i read this article in your site


More steering /rotation:
  • Narrowing the front track, making the front only 196-7mm. You can take about 2mm off the off the end of the front wishbones to reduce the front track width without any problems (you may need to shorten the end of the pivot balls too, depends which ones you use), it just gives you the option of running a narrow front track width (down to about 195mm), even with 1mm you can notice a difference. Once you have cut the ends off the wishbones then just measure each hub, from a point on the chassis (to get the same width each side). Just reducing the front by 1mm is noticeable so try it before going the full hog as you may well end up with too much steering/rotation.
  • Shortening the wheelbase of the car by taking material from the lower rear 밃?arms (wishbones) has a positive effect on improving the cars ability to 'rotate'. The rear lowers can be filed from the front by about 2.5mm, and a 2.5 mm spacer put behind the arm on the hinge, that뭩 how I have always run my car and it just makes the car rotate quicker.
  • Using plenty of rear camber (3 to 4 degrees) and the use of overdrive also can improve rear traction.
-> is relation to more steering/rotation?
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Old 06-18-2007, 09:30 PM   #7208
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Originally Posted by Kodak Hodak View Post
Also why is my side belt stripping teeth all of a sudden? maybe the locked diff i thinks, i did run a 2mm split always with ED trans and ran a 52T 1st and 46 2nd
Kodak,

The split with the locked diff take more toll on the belts as the split becomes smaller and smaller. Essentially, the rear becomes smaller and smaller, and ends up scrubbing off speed. The belt is trying to turn the front pulley, but the smaller diameter rear wheels is dragging the side pulley, creating a lot of stress on the belts.

Hope that made sense.
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Old 06-18-2007, 09:30 PM   #7209
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Originally Posted by bucknuts View Post
I have driven on low grip the past several races I got rear grip with mostly half full 10K rear diff and front spool or 100K diff.
this i will try, maube its a solution to my problem, less 10,000k diff oil may reduce rear to step out on power, while the spool front shall pull it out of corners using all four wheels to drive....

if you think of the characteristics on how a car behaves you can generally make adjustments to suit....!

this thread since i have had my rant, has become rather helpfull and i am sure my local g4S friends will take note!


ill give feed back in 3 weeks when i race again,

once again thanks guys!!!
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Old 06-19-2007, 12:03 AM   #7210
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Default front solid

i will test front solid system from this week.

i remember front soild is slower than diff system in cornering.

But front diff system is slower in corner-out.


so i must find good more-steering/rotation setup in front solid system.

maybe.. it will not be easy.

if i get good setup.. i will use solid system mainly
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Old 06-19-2007, 12:22 AM   #7211
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Originally Posted by gansei View Post
i read this article in your site


More steering /rotation:
  • Narrowing the front track, making the front only 196-7mm. You can take about 2mm off the off the end of the front wishbones to reduce the front track width without any problems (you may need to shorten the end of the pivot balls too, depends which ones you use), it just gives you the option of running a narrow front track width (down to about 195mm), even with 1mm you can notice a difference. Once you have cut the ends off the wishbones then just measure each hub, from a point on the chassis (to get the same width each side). Just reducing the front by 1mm is noticeable so try it before going the full hog as you may well end up with too much steering/rotation.
  • Shortening the wheelbase of the car by taking material from the lower rear 밃?arms (wishbones) has a positive effect on improving the cars ability to 'rotate'. The rear lowers can be filed from the front by about 2.5mm, and a 2.5 mm spacer put behind the arm on the hinge, that뭩 how I have always run my car and it just makes the car rotate quicker.
  • Using plenty of rear camber (3 to 4 degrees) and the use of overdrive also can improve rear traction.
-> is relation to more steering/rotation?
Hey! That is not what I wanted you to read.

Okay, let's review camber setup theory for rear tires. What is the purpose of adjusting the camber? To ensure maximize contact patch with the track during cornering. Maximum contact patch = most traction. Too small a camber angle (tires cone out) or too large a camber angle (tires cone in too much) means you do not have maximum contact patch, so you want only slight cone in. This type of camber adjustment is referred to as static camber.

When the car is turning, you have to worry about camber rise (aka camber intake). This is dynamic camber while cornering. You can adjust camber rise by changing the length of the camber link, which may also change the angle of the camber link - which will change the amount of static camber required, roll center and body roll. Does body roll affect steering and rotation?

So what does all of this mean? You want to change the length and angle of the camber link, while maintaining the maximum contact patch, to find the right amount of body roll, that will give you the best traction, steering and rotation given a track's layout and traction, knowing that these are not the only factors that affect steering and rotation.

Man, I sure hope I got this right. If not, someone please correct me!
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Old 06-19-2007, 12:56 AM   #7212
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Originally Posted by rmdhawaii View Post
Hey! That is not what I wanted you to read.

Okay, let's review camber setup theory for rear tires. What is the purpose of adjusting the camber? To ensure maximize contact patch with the track during cornering. Maximum contact patch = most traction. Too small a camber angle (tires cone out) or too large a camber angle (tires cone in too much) means you do not have maximum contact patch, so you want only slight cone in. This type of camber adjustment is referred to as static camber.

When the car is turning, you have to worry about camber rise (aka camber intake). This is dynamic camber while cornering. You can adjust camber rise by changing the length of the camber link, which may also change the angle of the camber link - which will change the amount of static camber required, roll center and body roll. Does body roll affect steering and rotation?

So what does all of this mean? You want to change the length and angle of the camber link, while maintaining the maximum contact patch, to find the right amount of body roll, that will give you the best traction, steering and rotation given a track's layout and traction, knowing that these are not the only factors that affect steering and rotation.

Man, I sure hope I got this right. If not, someone please correct me!
Kinda twisty, almost like the track I just raced on ... but you got there in the end.
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Old 06-19-2007, 01:30 AM   #7213
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Kinda twisty, almost like the track I just raced on ... but you got there in the end.
Thanks Slow.
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Old 06-19-2007, 02:32 AM   #7214
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Originally Posted by gansei View Post
i will test front solid system from this week.

i remember front soild is slower than diff system in cornering.

But front diff system is slower in corner-out.


so i must find good more-steering/rotation setup in front solid system.

maybe.. it will not be easy.

if i get good setup.. i will use solid system mainly
with the mods that you have done to the front of your car with much much reduced wheel track, find it interesting you need more steering on the front, does it push wide like under steer?

i know its a stupid question, thou do you have max steering on RADIO? i once found that i had 60% on radio then added 95% and boo ya i got lots of steering!

I feel my front is fine on a low grip into corners as spoke before its more rear traction issues for me!!!

question do you race on a preped track surface, or does your grip rise as you race on the day, plus is the track flat? or off camber or even yet like ours on a slant slop due to having track on a hill!!!
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Old 06-19-2007, 06:07 AM   #7215
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Originally Posted by Kodak Hodak View Post
with the mods that you have done to the front of your car with much much reduced wheel track, find it interesting you need more steering on the front, does it push wide like under steer?

i know its a stupid question, thou do you have max steering on RADIO? i once found that i had 60% on radio then added 95% and boo ya i got lots of steering!

I feel my front is fine on a low grip into corners as spoke before its more rear traction issues for me!!!

question do you race on a preped track surface, or does your grip rise as you race on the day, plus is the track flat? or off camber or even yet like ours on a slant slop due to having track on a hill!!!
1. i always using max steering.
(if rear grip is unstable, then reduce dualrate)

2. i feel push under steer in corner-out.
But it can be fixed by front droop setup (reduce front downstop)

3. i did off camber in over traction
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