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Old 08-27-2005, 12:28 AM   #286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Francis M.
Re: CP toys for tots. I'm glad someone is willing to try this out even though it is still unproven. I can't speak for everyone but i will be joining this race on december.

Also thanks to Robbie C. and Mike S. for supporting a class the would allow a lower cost of racing for the Club racers and making the rules simple, 5 port and store price limit on engines so it is practical to get it started.
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Old 08-27-2005, 04:36 AM   #287
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike jones
what about pull starts
Hahahaha......... nice trick, if you can afford to play 1/8, you can afford starter box too
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Old 08-27-2005, 04:41 AM   #288
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Here my suggestion to make 1/8 racers don't run away :

1. Free choice of cars, radio gears, hop up options.
2. Limited choice / regulated choice for engines, tires, and fuels ?
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Old 08-27-2005, 06:03 AM   #289
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Hi All

In our region the circuits are biased more and more toward 1/10th which is good from the point of view that a monster motor is not necessary and can be a liability. But it is hell on the tires even with a std motor. So tire cost is the scare factor here.
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Old 08-27-2005, 06:32 AM   #290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wad
Count me in
At least two drivers will be fun. Let's go, Let's go
Me three
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Old 08-27-2005, 06:59 AM   #291
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I'll be there......Daniel Alvarado and I talked about this a good 2 years ago....never thought it would happen though!! Worth a try I say. Spread the word people.
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Old 08-27-2005, 01:30 PM   #292
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I would have to agree with jrabbito on a coulpe points he has made regarding a new "Stock Class" for 1/8. Adding a new class will take away from the number of racers who race on a regular weekend by separating them. This has been proven over the years with electric and gas racing in both on and off-road. 1/12th started it, then 1/10 pan was added, formula 1, front drive, all-drive, 19-turn, modified, brushless, 200mm, 235mm 2 and 4WD, 1/5 bla bla bla. The same goes for off-road. Buggy, truck, 4WD, monster truck, Truggy, 1/8th, 1/18 ...... what next? Did you know there was an actual National event for 1/18th cars? Maybe next year there will be a 1/8th, pull-start Nats too!

Introducing a "Stock" class will not reduce the cost of racing 1/8th on-road. I am not bashing here, merely commenting as everyone else has. If there is a push for a Stock or Spec class, I donít feel "factory" drivers (drivers that have sponsors), should be allowed. Those guys will be fast and win regardless of the rules. Why would a sponsored driver want to race a Stock class? I think the idea might be to show the rest of the racers that a 5-port used by a factory driver are faster than you and your 11-port. That's great; show us how slow we really are. Most sponsored drivers get parts at a great discount, and those that are professional get them for free. I think there must be a separation between the "Pro" drivers (or anyone that has a sponsor), and all the others who pay for their parts, tires and motors. Just because there are limitations to the motor to reduce cost, doesnít mean racers will not push the envelope of the rules for speed. Stock crank does not mean stock sleeve and piston.

I will not buy a 5-port motor just to run in a Stock Class. I already have 3 motors that have 7+ ports. I would rather spend my $300 on new tires and race against those that pay for their parts (regardless of the cost). I donít think the cost of the motor is the issue here. Practice eats tires, and tires are expensive. If you race on a surface that is abrasive, you will be spending a bunch of money (not to mention chunked tires). Practice alone wears out parts on the car increasing cost. If you practice frequently, the piston/rod and sleeve take a beating too (even a 5-port piston/sleeve is around $100). 1/8th is not an entry-level class, and it will never be cheap. How about the tire manufacturers drop tire prices? Maybe bring back the 2-wheel drive class again? You can run a junk motor in 2-wheel drive and have too much power.

Entry level RTR is not going to make this class larger. The beginners that buy these cars are usually not racers. How many RTR buyers have you seen at the track? I think more of the RTR customers will get frustrated with the engine tuning (maybe burn their motors up), bend the chassis hitting a curb, break parts and not have a clue how to fix them..... and after all the frustration, they will leave the hobby and never return.

Attracting spectators will increase awareness and help the hobby grow, regardless of the class.

I enjoy 1/8th and would like to race every couple of months with a large gathering of racers. In CA, there are 2 tracks within reasonable proximity to one another. I donít race now because nobody shows up, not the cost. Do the track owners get together and talk about non-conflicting races? If there was only 1 race each month, you would get a larger turnout, and many of us that have cars collecting dust would bring them out to race.

If cost is the issue, there are other motors (as jrabbito mentioned) that are less expensive. I have seen guys run O.S. Motors with excellent results, and Tower has them for $299 (7 port).

Sorry for the novelÖ. I want to race!
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Old 08-27-2005, 02:43 PM   #293
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Sooo....you would rather leave things as they are and race the same few drivers every race? Something has to be done. Cost if not the boredom of racing the same ole guys surely will kill 1/8. You mentioned entry level RTR...who said anything about that. Look at Champ Car racing now...it's just getting back on it's feet...they all run the same engine. Makes it a little easier to compete. At least you know you are not going to be at a power disadvantage to start with. As far as sponsored drivers......how many of us that race 1/8 are sponsored? At one time that seemed to be the goal of all was to be sponsored... an ego thing. How many drivers that are sponsored are truly 100% sponsored. I have friends that are 50%....they still pay for parts. Many can't commit to the travel....time off...as well as the pressure of doing well for the sponsor to be truly a team sponsored driver. Very few make a living out of racing r/c cars.....at least I think that. Correct me if I'm wrong. But that's not even the point here. For those who are resistant or against it.....at least give it a try before you condem it. I think it would be fun to be in a close race at a slightly slower pace than have gobs of horsepower and have drivers be seperated by laps as is the usual case. Either way this is gonna happen and we'll all see if it takes off or if it dies. The Serpent spec class looks interesting. Makes you wonder why is Serpent pushing this if there wasn't a valid reason. Just rambling here and stating an opinion.....but if something different doesn't happen in 1/8..this will surely be my last year.
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Old 08-27-2005, 03:30 PM   #294
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Onthegas, You say that this new class will separate an already small class but in the same sentence you want a separate class for sponsored drivers.

This class is not just intended to get newbies that don't know how to work on thier cars, but it is also to encourage the club drivers to make the jump to 1/8th or even for guys who already have the car but has a busted up engine and cannot afford to get one of the high end motors that they think they need to keep up on an open class.
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Old 08-27-2005, 04:02 PM   #295
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I think some of the guys against the idea are missing the point. The SPEC CLASS idea is not only to reduce cost to the guys running 1/8th allready. I think its more to allow the guy running TC that wants to make the jump at a lower price. To bring neww blood into the class, without it being so intimidating. This way they can get their feet wet in the class and get a feel for how the cars drive and how they like to be driven. Eventually the SPEC CLASS drivers will save enough money to buy a better engine (or maybe not) andmove into the full on class. With the spec enigine, a driver looking to make the jump wont feel he has to spend $800, plus the car, plus the pipe.

About tires, if you look hard enough and do your homework, you can find a set of tires for $35 shipped, so the price of tires has come down.

About the 5 port rule. I dont think we should limit the # of ports, I think we should limit the cost, to $350. Because like Onthegas said, you can get a very good and reliable O.S. VZ-RII for $300. When I start racing again (soon hopefully XXXX) this is the engine I want to get.
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Old 08-27-2005, 11:37 PM   #296
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"The Serpent spec class looks interesting. Makes you wonder why is Serpent pushing this if there wasn't a valid reason"

...why, like almost every other manufacturer in the R/C industry, to sell their own cars, or, if there is more than one class to suit their car to sell more of them to everyone, of course. As has been proven in various full-size racing classes and is now trickling down to the model-car level. We are racing model cars, after all. It's all about money on any level, be it consumer, racer, hobby shop, distributor, or manufacturer. Oops, pointed out the obvious again...
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Old 08-27-2005, 11:58 PM   #297
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Manufacturers marketing thier products or trying to sell thier products is obvious but When manufacturers actually support anything that helps to lower cost of racing so that people in this hobby can participate more and maybe support thier product is O.K. by me.

Last edited by Francis M.; 08-28-2005 at 12:47 AM.
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Old 08-28-2005, 12:33 AM   #298
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Here is a little confusion I think. Who is talking about divide the 1/8 class?
This new class is for drivers who likes 1/8 scale and want to be competitive, we all know that you can buy a cheap motor for 1/8 scale, the problem is that the chances that you have to win the A main are none. So if I race, I normally try to win, but if I need to buy a motor for $800 to be competitive and win the A main, I definetely will be out of it. In my opinion, buy a cheap motor to race and have no chances to win, is not fun. That's why I never raced 1/8 scale.
This new class is to get people like me, Francis & Jeffrey, joining the 1/8 scale racing, buying a motor for $300 and be plenty of chances to win the race, just depends on you, not the motor. If you have three motors already, don't think that you need to spend $300 more to buy a new one, because you already are into 1/8 scale racing, you may not interested in the new class. But in my case, I don't have any motor, I need to buy one, so I am happy that I only need to spend $300 and I will have no motor problems to win the race
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Old 08-28-2005, 01:04 AM   #299
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That sounds extremely nice for rookie like me Still waiting on my car and motor
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Old 08-28-2005, 02:29 AM   #300
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The problem with low turnouts is not due to the cost of the motor. Anyone that wants to get involved in 1/8th can do so with reasonable cost...... comparitively. Lets take the nitro sedan guys for instance. These guys have the starter boxes, servos etc. The can buy a used roller (MRX-3's handle excellent), a motor for $300, some spare parts and tires, and they are racing for the cost of a new MRX-4 or Evola. The nice part about this.....they can compete (yes, against the new cars). I think too many just give up becasue they cant win. This hobby is about having fun! If there were 3 mains, and you were dicing with a few guys in the C main, you would still have fun. If you knew there were going to be 30 or 40 guys to race, you wouldnt care if you were in the B or C main. 1/8th cars are intense. I dont care how fast the 1/10 sedans are, they dont compare.

Dont blame the lack of racers on the cost of the motors. If you can set up your car and drive, you will be able to compete with an inexpensive motor. Im not talking about those "unknown" motors sold at some of the hobby shops. The better quality motors like RB, O.S., REX (I will not touch another Picco, just my opinion from experience). The motors for the 1/10 sedans are near $300, and I dont hear them complaining about cost. Their tires are less expensive, which I still feel is a problem here. Racers that are curious about 1/8 on-road always ask how long the tires last. When they hear you need 2 sets per weekend, its over. What entry level racer can fork out 70 bucks every time they race? At the excellent discounted price of $35 bucks shipped per nitrodude's comment (excluding chunked tires), that is no bargain. Electric sedans can use a set of tires for 5-7 races.

The motors last far longer than the tires do, lets do the math. If you smash your car into the boards, you will chink tires and break part$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ If this is you, race electric sedans (no, race 1/18th.... Li-Poly's are cheap). Lets see..... 2 sets of tires ($70), twice a month..... hey, 140 bucks! Add the cost of fuel (not to mention the unleaded for your SUV with the super-low gas prices lately), and you have a nice bill on your hands (forgot race entry and lunch).

I dont show up to local races becasue there are about 6 to 8 guys at Crystal Park or Revelation. Racers in Southern CA are lucky. We have 2 tracks within 50-60 miles (maybe less). Why do they both feel the need to put on a race twice a week? The cost of tires alone is close to a car payment. If a guy wanted to race 2-4 times a month, it is possible here in Ca. I would rather race once every 2-3 months with 50 to 60 racers, rather than show up twice a month with 6-10 racers.

On the topic of splitting racers. Lets just say 20 racers show up for a weekend race, and 10 of them signed up for the new Stock Class. Are you going to tell me this will not split the racers?

Why dont you start a thread explaining why you dont race 1/8th On-Road (if you have a car already)?
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