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Old 08-25-2005, 10:10 PM   #226
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Originally Posted by jiml
Guys didn't stop running mod because of the cost of the motors...they got tired of replacing half the front of the car every time they crashed. Back in the 90's 15 turn was the acccepted limit. Now unless you got an 8 turn you ain't got s***! Not to mention today's stock motors are as fast as the 15 turn motors from then.

15T was acceptable cause 1700SCE was all that was available.....

Same thing may be happening in 1/8. Continually faster engines means more tire wear and more breakage. People are turning away because they don't want to put up with that anymore. Its true

Hmmm, just though of something. Every form of full scale motorsports has some restriction on engines in order to control costs. There's also a safety factor in there. Maybe it's time for RC to consider the same thing. In other words, not just a separate spec class, but change the engine rules to make them more restrictive and slow the cars down. May lower the long term costs of racing. This would have to be a worldwide thing to work.
Yes look at how F1 has changed the rules for engines, basically to keep the cost down...A SPEC engine in 1/8th will do the same
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Old 08-25-2005, 10:12 PM   #227
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Rick, that's why the sedans should have even more restrictions.
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Old 08-25-2005, 10:14 PM   #228
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Originally Posted by ROARprez
I think I disagree with some of the direction this is going but I could be wrong.

But look at it this way. Let's say we restrict 1:8 to slow it down and let's say the speeds of Sedans are now the same as 1:8.

That would be the class killer in my opinion.

1:8 is all about speed. This is the true on-road open class for fuel racers.
Our goal with a SPEC engine is to help lower the cost to the average racer, not as a means to slow down the racing. Yes the average lap time may be a few tenths slower but the goal is to introduce an inexpensive form of 1/8th scale racing
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Old 08-25-2005, 10:19 PM   #229
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Perhaps Sal Defazio, Dave or someone from the Colorado area can provide some feedback as to their experience with a spec engine. If I remember correctly, at the GLC Dave mentioned to me that their local club in Colorado has a 1/8th spec engine.
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Old 08-25-2005, 10:29 PM   #230
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I've been driving 8ths less than a year, but I've had the chance to drive with 3 different engines, the 1st a well run RB C5, then the Murnan modded Mega ZX21R, and my friend wanted me to run in one of the top line JP's, the newest model. A new driver should NOT start off with one of those JP's, start with one of the mid power engines, the car is easier to drive, and you can learn to drive these badboyz better.

If you get one, or the chance to drive one, a few times.....God ! these cars are fun. And you really do hafta work on the touring cars more.
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Old 08-25-2005, 10:34 PM   #231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jiml
Rick, that's why the sedans should have even more restrictions.
1/8 scale has nothing to do with sedans
I never race an 1/8 scale just because the cost of the engines, I like the idea of the SPEC engine, it will help at least one person, my self
Thanks!!!!
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Old 08-25-2005, 10:49 PM   #232
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What is being said here is exactly what the spec class is all about. Just becasue a person has raced formany years doesn't mean he has the financial means to support a 1/8th competitive car. The spec class should be design to offer new hobbist an opportunity to get into the 1/8th class and be competive. It is also for the longer term racer to move to the 1/8th class and raace competively without the second mortgage.

I believe the ideas carl has mentioned above along with others are great ideas on the right track. We need to carry them to the next leveland have clubs begin developing this spec class also.
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Old 08-25-2005, 10:58 PM   #233
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Cost is uppermost in people's mind when it comes to 1/8, whether justified or not. On the same token, whether true or not, a "stock" class with apprant lower entry cost will bring people in to this class.

Why limit it to $350? I say $250 or less. Maybe even $200. Perhaps you can't get an Italian one for that price but what about some other Asian manufacturers? As long as we are on equal footing who cares if it's slower? And if we can bring the cost way down there would be more people getting into the class and creating a bigger market. With sales potential you might just see a $200 .21 RB in the near future.

As to modification, just take a similar path as the electric stock class. As long as the engine is x ports .21 and with MSRP of $250 or less you are in.

Sure people will find loopholes and try to get around rules, but so what? As long as we have lots of people running in this class we can always find a better way to regulate it later.
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Old 08-25-2005, 11:33 PM   #234
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No one is talking about getting rid of the current 1/8th rules. I think everyone is talking about starting a new spec class for 1/8th that will at
least get people started on this class. I know there are already a whole
bunch of lower priced engines but runnning one of the budget engines against the JP's and Rody engines is just crazy. I think that the people who beleive that 1/8th is the pinacle of r/c racing will not be affected since they
won't even join this class but it will get alot interest from people like me and wad and a few others to run 1/8th and probably join the current 1/8th class after a season in 1/8th since its easier to upgrade engines eventually than buying everything at once.

This thread is a pretty good example of interest. This has to be one of the most active threads on the Nitro forum since it was started.

i'm actually gonna ask dana at revelations race way to promote this idea at a club level and see if it draws new blood at least at our track.
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Old 08-25-2005, 11:49 PM   #235
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Spec class would help introduce others into this class. Bring down the prices on tires and engines, I am pretty sure more will join. The 2 engines that is competetive under $300 are Sirio PR pro and OS turbo version 2.
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Old 08-26-2005, 05:15 AM   #236
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One of the tracks I regularly visit had decided to use a 'spec' engine for all its 1/8 club competitions, mainly in an attempt to level the playing flield and encourage people to join the competition. There have never been LESS drivers for the class. It may or may not work for some tracks...
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Old 08-26-2005, 06:57 AM   #237
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In my opinion 1/8 is the pinnacle of r/c. Runnning slower, less competative, lower cost engines to me is a dangerous road to travel.

There might also be reliability issues with some of those lower cost alternatives. Forcing people to run these engines could also back-fire.

In my opinion someone new to the class shouldn't expect to run in the A main of the bat. One of thos cost effective motors in the right hands is more than enough to start with.

Dividing the class up into a spec and open class will only reduce numbers further. Educate new-comers.

In my opinion 1/8 has never been less expensive. There are alternatives out there. OS, Mega, Picco, Sirio, Novarossi all have non modified engines which are competative. Especially to someone starting out.

Get a "decent" motor and work on the car.

My 2cents....
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Old 08-26-2005, 07:06 AM   #238
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I have been running a Cipolla that retails for $215! It has been very competetive. Hangs with (or past) engines costing 2-3 times as much.
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Old 08-26-2005, 12:08 PM   #239
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I have raced 1/8 for a number of years and have never bought a modified engine due to cost. I regurlay make the A main with stock engines like the OS VZ-r, Serpent Evo5, and RB C4. Of course I will never win the A main but I still have fun beating guys that run JP, Collari, and Rody's. I still have fun running 1/8 without buying and running high dollar motors. In your mind if you can justify to yourself the cost of one of the high end motors....then buy it and run it.....it's your money. I see nothing wrong with a spec type class for 1/8....I would defintely run it. That way it's not all about the engine and more driver skill and setup. In electric racing why is there always a bigger stock class than modified??? I can't agree with the notion that running spec in 1/8 will kill the class or drive racers away....I just don't buy it. The bottom line is most that run 1/8 don't have the driving skills to take advantage of a modified engines potential and would/might actually have faster lap times due to more control. You see it all the time at the races. Now if you want to go fast down the straight...get a ballastic modified motor and get ready to pay big dollars.....and when it's time to rebuild....again get ready to pay as piston and cylinder sets sometimes run more than a new stock engine. Stringing a bunch of consistent fast lap times with a modified engine is out of reach for most except for the normally fast drivers. Just my opinion of course. Have a great day.
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Old 08-26-2005, 12:17 PM   #240
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrabbito
Forcing people to run these engines could also back-fire.

Dividing the class up into a spec and open class will only reduce numbers further. Educate new-comers.

My 2cents....
The formation of a SPEC class does not "force" anyone to run these engines. If someone wants to pay big $$$ for the latest and greatest modified engine, that's fine.

What the SPEC class does it allows the guys who purchased a SPEC engine to race with guys running the same type of engine thereby making him feel like he is not at a disadvantage.

Also, there is no rule which prohibits a guy running a spec engine to race with the modified engine. The only rule is modified engine are restricted from racing in the SPEC class.
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