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Old 07-31-2011, 11:09 AM   #31
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This is just from what I was told....
Also confirmed on Uwe Baldes his Blog:
http://www.nitro-west.de/index.php?o...&limitstart=20

Quote:
... Italiener, die gehen jetzt zum Parkplatz, ziehen Handschuhe an ... und massieren ihre Reifen ...
Translated:
Italian people going to the parking lot, put on some gloves and rubbing the tires

Within the EFRA there is a 5 year ban on this so I hope to read more soon on the EFRA website. This discussion is sadly taking over the sports and I do not think it is wise to keep it behind closed doors.

The problem is that if it can not be detected or controled it is difficult to make rules, on the other hand the 5 year ban must be used as an example to the rest.
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Old 07-31-2011, 11:23 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wingracer View Post
Was it one of us evil Americans again?

Oh wait, this is the Euros.
yeah where are the people who were so quick to comment just hope thing work
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Old 07-31-2011, 11:35 AM   #33
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The only way anybody is going to control this is with spec tires that stay in the organizers hands until they are put on the car period. Yes EFRA will even need to true them. So as long as racers get to handle there tires in anyway it will happen. The "sniffer" waste of money. I'm sure the top teams would buy one just to figure out what it can't smell so there goop is legal. The sooner EFRA figures this out the less tainted the racing over there will be.
So start spraying the tracks and if they think they need tire goop(which will be always until you start traction rolling on 45 fronts and 50 rears) then let them goop. EFRA is in a situation where they are either going to spend a lot of money and manpower to attempt to control something thats uncontrollable, or just deal with it as part of racing.
ROAR figured this out along time ago...
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Old 07-31-2011, 11:39 AM   #34
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The only way to police this is to have a tire impound. Tires get shiped to the track a week in advance. Tires get handed to the drivers only when they need to be trued, in a closed off truing area, and they get handed to the pit man when they enter the track for each heat.
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Old 07-31-2011, 11:40 AM   #35
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They should just let the tracks be sprayed and get it over with!!!
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Old 07-31-2011, 11:59 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by nitrodude View Post
The only way to police this is to have a tire impound. Tires get shiped to the track a week in advance. Tires get handed to the drivers only when they need to be trued, in a closed off truing area, and they get handed to the pit man when they enter the track for each heat.
If something like that happens, I quit and go electric racing where I can sauce all I want. The only way to police it is NOT to. Allow it or spray the track.
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Old 07-31-2011, 12:27 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by MugenDrew View Post
So did EFRA or Ifmar actually put something in print, or is this still some mystery rule that gets past around the pit.
Yes they did. I can't seem to copy the pdf but it says additives are banned, anyone caught using it will be banned for 5 years (including IFMAR events) and it will be tested with a miniRAE lite sniffer.
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Old 07-31-2011, 12:32 PM   #38
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From what I was told is that there was a sauce which could not be detected and they have caught a driver on a parking lot sprankling his tires with tire sauce, a picture was hang up..
Not only that, they made pictures of the mechanics who were "saucing" their tires on the parking lot and also made pictures of the number plates and gave these pictures to the EFRA. EFRA did nothing. Except... plan a meeting which costs 4 hours and alot of driving time for the drivers.

Even after the controlled tire area Mr. de Graaff from EFRA caught an Italian by just touching the tires. he and other spectators saw white goop coming out of the tires that were underneath the starterbox in the prepare area. The tires on the car were "legal" I think it was Pirani.... however he could finish the race and no 5 year ban as was said in the meetings earlier... :S
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Old 07-31-2011, 12:48 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by wingracer View Post
If something like that happens, I quit and go electric racing where I can sauce all I want. The only way to police it is NOT to. Allow it or spray the track.
IMO they will still sauce the tires even of they allow spraying, but that IS a way to go, it just needs to be tried and see what happens. I really dont see why IFMAR/EFRA dont allow the tracks to be sprayed.
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Old 07-31-2011, 01:23 PM   #40
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If you watch the videos on www.efra.ws they did "respray the track after the rains came" . It's the video after the rain came.
The worlds in Miami was very educational for me. I spoke with a lot of the Europeans and they do spray. It seems a bit inconsistent from country to country. During the a-main I was standing next to Dankle and someone named "Mark" from Sweden where the polars bears eat people at bus stops(LOL). He was wearing a Serpent shirt if that helps. They both looked at me like I had lost my G. D. mind when I asked them why they did not spray. They both said they have never raced anywhere in europe that did not spray. Pietsch, Ilesi, Massimo, Armin, Patricio and Balistri (sticker man) etc....
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Old 07-31-2011, 01:39 PM   #41
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Maybe so but there is spray and then there is spray. Sugar water or other such things help but it's not what I would call high bite. Light VHT, that's high bite. Heavy VHT, break out the 8 year old 40s.
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Old 07-31-2011, 02:42 PM   #42
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Tire saucing and track spraying is not needed with most tracks in Europe, the tracks do contain lots of rubber and with 100 cars in 2 days of training on the track there is enough rubber on the track for grip.

Saucing on these events is not for getting grip but for the one to stay ahead of the others and for the others the way to close the gap, nothing more and nothing less.

Guys who are cheating on these events should be punished.

Also on Uwe Baldes Blog

Quote:
Shepherd-Boss Patrick Schäfer hat am Freitagmorgen all seine Teamfahrer zusammengetrommelt und unmissverständlich klar gemacht, dass die Verwendung von Haftmittel für alle tabu ist und dass er, sollte jemand anders handeln, sofort jegliche Unterstützung verliert und ggf. Auch das Auto eingezogen wird. Eine klare Position und ein Signal auch an alle anderen. Respekt!
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Quote:
Shepherd boss Patrick Schaefer has rounded up on Friday morning all of his team riders and unambiguously made clear that the use of adhesives for all is taboo and that he should act in someone else, immediately lose all support and possibly also the car will be confiscated. A clear position and a signal to all others. Respect!
This is something all the brands must stand for, let the driver know that the manufacturers wants to have a fair play.
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Old 07-31-2011, 03:18 PM   #43
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Question for people whom used additive in 1/8th ic where allowed....
so let say you put additive on 10/15min prior to your heat...hence would traction decreases mid way as tire worn away and no additive underneath ?
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Old 07-31-2011, 03:26 PM   #44
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Please forgive my ignorance but why do on road cars need sauce?Are the tracks surface bad?The cars don't grip enough?
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Old 07-31-2011, 04:30 PM   #45
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Please forgive my ignorance but why do on road cars need sauce?Are the tracks surface bad?The cars don't grip enough?
No car needs sauce. But if sauce is a just a few thousandths quicker, people will use it. And if some are to be believed, sauce is .4 or more quicker. That is a HUGE advantage.
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