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Old 07-22-2011, 08:12 PM   #1
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Default Not another noob needs help, and don't know ish

Proud owner of a HPI RTR Evo 3.







Still a Noob to the Nitro R/C world. The scene doesn't seem to be too live in Montreal. A Full time Track south of the City, but the Club that used to be active in the City doesn't have any new post on it's forum in over a year.

I'm interested in hooking up with some peeps for some racing, even if it's only cones in a Parking lot. Or drag dracing, anything. I don't have anything special, just an HPI Evo3 18ss. I'm looking for anybody in Montreal to Race with (nothing official, just for fun) I'm sure the scene is somewhere I just can't find it. Hopefully somebody on here knows about the MTL scene and knows a good local forum.

I'm also interested in chatting about my car and checking out what other people are Driving, how they have there suspension set up, you know, talk RC.

This board seams to be the Hot Spot Globaly to get the best info, very technical stuff. I wouldn't want to post a bunch of pics/specs/mods here if it's not accepted. Like I said I'm a noob, please bare with me.

Every question I have has lead me here for an answer. Already I have to thank you guys.

Last edited by Rac3rX; 07-31-2011 at 08:48 PM.
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Old 07-23-2011, 10:18 AM   #2
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It's odd that I'm having a hard time finding an active local group I'll check for info when picking up Nitro today. Be fun to spend some time with another car on the Track (placed cones).

Is this a dying scene. Everybody is into Helicopters.
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Old 07-24-2011, 12:39 PM   #3
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Im from Wisconsin also with an rs4 and it seems like the further north you go, the less popular on-road racing is.....especially nitro. good luck with your search, why not just spend more time at the track? I have yet to find a nitro onroad track in this state.
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Old 07-24-2011, 10:59 PM   #4
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Im from Wisconsin also with an rs4 and it seems like the further north you go, the less popular on-road racing is.....especially nitro. good luck with your search, why not just spend more time at the track? I have yet to find a nitro onroad track in this state.
As I'm learning, you hit the nail on the head. Everybody is into buggies & copters. I'm going to get a buggie but enjoy the on-road speed and crazy cornering. I'm pushing a bud to grab a used one so I can hopefully get racing, and searching for somebody who's ready to go.

Thanks for responding..

Here is a quick bid I took, brake is not installed, will do tomorrow, I took it easy but got some sweet spins in the end. Hotta Practice and get that brake in.

Working on adjusting the camber/toe not sure what's too aggressive an angle. Noticed that I had a soft spring on the rear (engine side) & a hard one on the front (opposite side) I swapped them back over and adjusted the ride height equal, seems the left side had more maximum extension then the right side (is that right?) adjustable shocks made it easy to level out but my engine side spring is slightly compressed to keep it at full extension, while the opposite side is slightly less compressed to have the weight bring it level with the engine side. Any stiffer would raise the ride height on the left making it a touch higher.

Any helpful hints, tools for measuring camber and toe angles? Also what would you say are good angles, and what is too aggressive?

Last edited by Rac3rX; 07-24-2011 at 11:11 PM.
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:22 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rac3rX View Post
As I'm learning, you hit the nail on the head. Everybody is into buggies & copters. I'm going to get a buggie but enjoy the on-road speed and crazy cornering. I'm pushing a bud to grab a used one so I can hopefully get racing, and searching for somebody who's ready to go.

Thanks for responding..

Here is a quick bid I took, brake is not installed, will do tomorrow, I took it easy but got some sweet spins in the end. Hotta Practice and get that brake in.

Working on adjusting the camber/toe not sure what's too aggressive an angle. Noticed that I had a soft spring on the rear (engine side) & a hard one on the front (opposite side) I swapped them back over and adjusted the ride height equal, seems the left side had more maximum extension then the right side (is that right?) adjustable shocks made it easy to level out but my engine side spring is slightly compressed to keep it at full extension, while the opposite side is slightly less compressed to have the weight bring it level with the engine side. Any stiffer would raise the ride height on the left making it a touch higher.

Any helpful hints, tools for measuring camber and toe angles? Also what would you say are good angles, and what is too aggressive?




Here, let me solve all your problems with 2 solutions.



Buy this..

http://www.amainhobbies.com/product_...rce=google_ext


or this..

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXRTZ9&P=7



Put 50 weight shock oil in shocks

put all 4 stock black springs back on car making sure all 4 shocks are even length...( screw the ball cup up to the last showing thread)


set the camber to 2 degrees front and back, set toe in to 0...

set your ride height to 5.5 MM rear, 5 mm front...

invest in a good set of tires...(90 percent of car handling)


Drop the car on the tweak station and adjust your tweak using the shock collars....Google articles on how to set tweak and learn to understand the principle of adjusting the opposite corner to level car...




follow this advice from my site...

And speaking of chassis tuning here is the biggest thing we have learned. No matter how the car is set-up, conditions always change. If you are running heats during the day by the time the mains are run the track temp has changed, there is more fuel on the track, and conditions for driving are very different. So the best thing we have ever learned is to learn to drive your car under any condition and circumstance. We try to stay with a neutral handling chassis and just learn to drive it. The best practice is setting up cones in a parking lot and running figure eights. But don’t stay in one spot. Move around the track and learn to drive the car from every visibility angle. Learn what the car is doing and become one with the car.

Buy the book listed on this page..


http://fastharry.com/2011/06/16/radi...tips-and-info/






Follow this advice and you will have a car capable of winning the HPI challenge, placing in the A Main in any worlds event, and out running any of your buddies with practice...



or just buy my evo 3 for 400 dollars...as it has done all of the above....(just kidding, would never sell it..)
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Old 07-26-2011, 10:08 AM   #6
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Great info, much thanks. Taking time to analyze it all.

I have a few initial questions.

I should swap back in my stock springs removing my progressive springs. Why exactly, should I not Tune with them?

Until I pick up a "Tweak Station" can I check ride height with my digital micrometers depth gauge? If so where is the measuring point?
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Old 07-26-2011, 10:27 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rac3rX View Post
Great info, much thanks. Taking time to analyze it all.

I have a few initial questions.

I should swap back in my stock springs removing my progressive springs. Why exactly, should I not Tune with them?

Until I pick up a "Tweak Station" can I check ride height with my digital micrometers depth gauge? If so where is the measuring point?



You can tune with them but I have always found a neutral spring set up is the best...

and the black springs work great. Very rarely have I used a different front and back spring as I like all 4 corners the same so I can tell the difference in other changes (like tires) that I make..


that being said, I have changed complete sets harder or softer...but, I will tell you I have raced my car in almost every condition including rain and the black springs work great....Tires are a better thing to tune with...Finding a neutral, drive anywhere anytime set-up is the best advise I can give...


From Losi's website, also applys to any touring car..


Following the first two steps of setting your droop and your ride height, you are now ready to set your tweak. You start by finding a flat area to set your car on. Make sure not to use your pit table because the wood is usually warped and not very flat. A lot of the team drivers use a set up board or a 3/16" thick piece of glass as a flat surface. Set your car on the board or glass upside down and find the center of the front and rear of the car. After finding the centers, mark it with a small drill mark or a score from your hobby knife on the center-edge of the bumper. This will make it easier to located the center of the car the next time you are setting the tweak. Now take your hobby knife (a lot of the top racers like to use a hobby knife to find the perfect center on their car. Please use caution when using a hobby knife for this exercise) or 1/16” Team Losi Allen wrench and push up on the center in the rear of the car with your tool. This is done on the rear bumper. If your car is not perfectly tweaked, one tire will start to rise before the other. In the picture below we find that the left tire rises before the right tire. This means your car is not TWEAKED properly. To fix this problem you will want to apply pressure to the left rear side and relieve pressure from the right rear side of the car. This is done by putting more preload on the right front shock (adjusting collar clockwise) and taking away a small amount of preload on the left front shock(adjusting collar counter-clockwise). Keep in mind when doing this you will only need to adjust the preloads of your shocks slightly to get the tweak corrected. You now have the front of your car tweaked flat with the rear. Now we are going to "tweak" the front end of the car. This is done the same way as in the previous steps. With the front end of your XXXs facing you, find the center of the car (use the bumper) and score or mark it like we did the rear. Now take your hobby knife or 1/16" Team Losi wrench, and slowly push up on the front until one or both of the tires come off the ground. If both front tires come off the ground simultaneously, your car is tweaked perfectly flat. If the left front (with the front of the car facing you) comes off the ground first you will need to apply more preload to the right rear shock (adjust collar clockwise) and reduce the preload on the left rear shock (adjust collar counter-clockwise). Check your tweak again until you get both front tires to rise off the ground simultaneously.
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Old 07-27-2011, 04:14 PM   #8
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Im heading over to the Hobby shop tomorrow to look at some Tweak Stations. I did my initial tuning based off ride height and compression. Trying to have them sit level & if pressure is applied to the center each side bottoms out at the same time. I did the Tweak check and get both wheels lifting at the same time.

Do you feel the equal lift is more important than equal compression?

I'm running around -1.5 degreese camber in the rear with the default unadjustable toe-in around 1-2 degreese.

Up front is another story...

I'm running currently around 2-3degreese negative Camber and about 1 degreese toe-in. I'm running the toe in because I'm trying to open it up and see some top end, just having trouble getting a long enough stretch to max out 2nd gear.

I'm going to return the toe to 0 after but find it very controllable with it. It takes a lil throttle at apex but I find if you hit your marks it makes throttling out of the corner more controlled. I was backing off to straighten out with it at 0, where I can get into it with a more consistent controlled line with it as throttling out of the corner is more controlled. It oversteers less, and will understeer if you give it to much. Using that understeer to exit corners is fast, you find the throttle point and let it pull you out, instead of steering out while worrying about getting into the throte to much and oversteering the corner.

Is there any Logic in the R/C world to what I'm saying?

I still have the progressive springs in, I want to get comfortable with the Tune on them, then see if I can improve upon it with the stockers.

Last edited by Rac3rX; 07-27-2011 at 04:26 PM.
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Old 07-27-2011, 04:26 PM   #9
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Im heading over to the Hobby shop tomorrow to look at some Tweak Stations. I did my initial tuning based off ride height and compression. Trying to have them sit level & if pressure is applied to the center each side bottoms out at the same time. I did the Tweak check and get both wheels lifting at the same time.

Do you feel having equal lift is more important than having equal compression?

As far as my ride height is, it's crazy (I think) Based on chassis height, I'm higher in the front than the rear. My rear is at near max that the springs will allow using the carbon fiber base & the springs are connected to the middle of three locations. I drive it on the street and leveling it out had the front too low, oddly while the chassis sits a touch higher up front, but the body sits level.

I'm running around -1.5 degreese camber in the rear with the default unadjustable toe-in around 1-2 degreese.

Up front is another story...

I'm running currently around 2-3degreese negative Camber and about 1 degreese toe-in. I'm running the toe in because I'm trying to open it up and see some top end, just having trouble getting a long enough stretch to max out 2nd gear.

I'm going to return the toe to 0 after but find it very controllable with it. It takes a lil throttle at apex but I find if you hit your marks it makes throttling out of the corner more controlled. I was backing off to straighten out with it at 0, where I can get into it with a more consistent controlled line.
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Old 07-27-2011, 05:12 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rac3rX View Post
Im heading over to the Hobby shop tomorrow to look at some Tweak Stations. I did my initial tuning based off ride height and compression. Trying to have them sit level & if pressure is applied to the center each side bottoms out at the same time. I did the Tweak check and get both wheels lifting at the same time.

Do you feel having equal lift is more important than having equal compression?

As far as my ride height is, it's crazy (I think) Based on chassis height, I'm higher in the front than the rear. My rear is at near max that the springs will allow using the carbon fiber base & the springs are connected to the middle of three locations. I drive it on the street and leveling it out had the front too low, oddly while the chassis sits a touch higher up front, but the body sits level.

I'm running around -1.5 degreese camber in the rear with the default unadjustable toe-in around 1-2 degreese.

Up front is another story...

I'm running currently around 2-3degreese negative Camber and about 1 degreese toe-in. I'm running the toe in because I'm trying to open it up and see some top end, just having trouble getting a long enough stretch to max out 2nd gear.

I'm going to return the toe to 0 after but find it very controllable with it. It takes a lil throttle at apex but I find if you hit your marks it makes throttling out of the corner more controlled. I was backing off to straighten out with it at 0, where I can get into it with a more consistent controlled line.


What brand shocks are on the car?
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Old 07-27-2011, 06:48 PM   #11
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What brand shocks are on the car?
The Springs are HPI Blue Progressive (13x29x1.65) Second hardest spring availible from HPI. Part number 6838. With the threaded aluminum shock set. The Stockers are 13x29x1.55

Keep in mind Im also running the front One-way differential, running a full SS suspension, light weight flywheel, racing clutch, & on the Super Chassis. I got the Green Sway bars installed currently.

I'm currently on the Super Radial Tire Pro Compound Tires and Mesh Wheels (going to paint my custom Rims before setting them in some new rubber.

Any suggestions for tires? I'm currently a Parking Lot Driver most often running on pavement. I do have this stuff called "Parma Tire Traction" Pink Thin Edition #730, it's a liquid you apply to the tires to add grip. I'm sure it's probably illegal in competitions though, so I havent used any yet.

I'll post up pics when my post count allows me to.

Last edited by Rac3rX; 07-27-2011 at 07:01 PM.
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Old 07-27-2011, 08:08 PM   #12
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I guss I should of posted my set up.

Greedy 350Z/Fairlady Z Twin Turbo

HPI RS4 Evo 3 RTR

Super Chassis Upgrade
Outlaw .18ss Engine Swap
SS suspension shaft set W/rear brace.
Woven Graphite Upper Deck
Front/Rear Carbon Graphite Shock Towers
Heat Sink Engine Mount
Front one-way differential
2 piece Dogbones
Titanium Turbuckels
Threaded Alluminim Shocks
HPI Blue Progressive Springs
Green Sway Bars Installed
Light weight flywheel
Racing clutch
Fiber Disk brake
High Torque Gear Set (High Speed set uninstalled)
Super Radial Tires Pro Compound.
Mesh Wheels

I have a custom made Roll Cage, I need to drill mounting holes into the chassis to install it though, I've not come around to doing that yet, plus the cage needs to be painted.
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Old 07-28-2011, 08:13 PM   #13
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Took her out for 2 tanks full of fun. But holly crap the understeer. No fricken grip, tires are pretty much finished. I looked online to try and match my tread to what's available from HPI, not a thing is the same. The T-Grips come close, but nothings the same.

I'm ordering a rim & tire set next week, I have a new set of rims already, but I'm not feeling them, I need new tires and incerts so might as well grab a set.

What are your recommendations for Tires?

I'm returning the Toe to 0 for the next session, see if that relieves some of the understeer.

I'll also be looking for a way to seal the gap between the muffler and exhaust pipe. It's spraying too much unspent fuel on the inside of the car. It's angled up to go in the exit pipe. I'm gonna use a poxy or something, just need to find something that will take the heat, got to check if "Gunk" will work. Any suggestions there?
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Old 07-29-2011, 09:32 AM   #14
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Took her out for 2 tanks full of fun. But holly crap the understeer. No fricken grip, tires are pretty much finished. I looked online to try and match my tread to what's available from HPI, not a thing is the same. The T-Grips come close, but nothings the same.

I'm ordering a rim & tire set next week, I have a new set of rims already, but I'm not feeling them, I need new tires and incerts so might as well grab a set.

What are your recommendations for Tires?

I'm returning the Toe to 0 for the next session, see if that relieves some of the understeer.

I'll also be looking for a way to seal the gap between the muffler and exhaust pipe. It's spraying too much unspent fuel on the inside of the car. It's angled up to go in the exit pipe. I'm gonna use a poxy or something, just need to find something that will take the heat, got to check if "Gunk" will work. Any suggestions there?



you have no grip because the springs are too hard and the sway bars prevent the car from rolling..


try the black springs, set the car up like I recommended...including the chassis height..


get rid of the sway bars..


try these tires

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...597+&search=Go


and I would not run the one way on a nitro car...


and pick up the copy of the book on that link to my tech page...
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Old 07-29-2011, 06:51 PM   #15
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Proud owner of a HPI RTR Evo 3. Still a Noob to the Nitro R/C world. The scene doesn't seem to be too live in Montreal. A Full time Track south of the City, but the Club that used to be active in the City doesn't have any new post on it's forum in over a year.

I'm interested in hooking up with some peeps for some racing, even if it's only cones in a Parking lot. Or drag dracing, anything. I don't have anything special, just an HPI Evo3 18ss. I'm looking for anybody in Montreal to Race with (nothing official, just for fun) I'm sure the scene is somewhere I just can't find it. Hopefully somebody on here knows about the MTL scene and knows a good local forum.

I'm also interested in chatting about my car and checking out what other people are Driving, how they have there suspension set up, you know, talk RC.

This board seams to be the Hot Spot Globaly to get the best info, very technical stuff. I wouldn't want to post a bunch of pics/specs/mods here if it's not accepted. Like I said I'm a noob, please bare with me.

Every question I have has lead me here for an answer. Already I have to thank you guys.
Just FYI....

We are currently racing gas/nitro powered RC on-road cars at Sanair Raceway. We currently have 3 tracks that we run on.
Yes, Pike River has permanently closed and Sanair remains the only place to race Nitro cars (at this time, we are only racing 1/8th Nitro on-road, but would be happy to consider a new class if there was sufficient interest).

Hope this helps.
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