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Old 06-27-2011, 10:38 AM   #151
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Mark,

The 1st thing you have to understand is the fast guys that race with Ipanema Slicks will not attend any race that won't allow them to be used on their GT cars.

Glad you had fun at the Byron's Fuels race, hope you make it to the 2011 Ipanema US GT Nationals in October; where any rubber tire is allowed.
Spec tires are used all of the time in rubber tire classes. We chose to have a spec tire due to tire availability and cost. We found various tires that worked good but are hard to get. We also found PMT tires. They work better than any slick but are $104 a set of four. We chose to run a "SPEC" class with a spec tire so that no one has an advantage due to availability or cost.


ENGINE: So far we have gone with the $200 rule but limited the .21 to 3 ports. The reason is the Werks B5. It is a 5 port .21 that is cheap at $199. This motor meets the rules but from what I have gathered is faster than everything else. It is the only .21 5 port that is below $200.

I am starting to agree with making the "spec" class just have a list of qualifying motors.


WEIGHT: I am all for a weight minimum. We have chosen 3500 grams as we just copied someone else.
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Old 06-27-2011, 11:01 AM   #152
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Troy,

There's no need to go round and round on the tire subject.

At Ipanema GT Only events we allow any rubber tire to run, even our competitor's products.

We want all GT racers to feel welcome and we're not scared or greedy.
Thats how our US GT Nats & GT World Championships are run. Period!

We've been racing GT for a very long time, most GT class rules are close or based on our GT Only event rules and we're all smart and brave enough to leave tire choice up the the racers.

If your track or event won't allow racers to run our slicks, don't expect the fast GT racers that have had great success with our products to attend.

Good luck with your race.
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Old 06-27-2011, 11:22 AM   #153
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As far as the TZGP, I am all for running Ipanema 50s and Sweep 50s. Having two options would be great assuming both are readily available to everyone at the track. Right now we have tried to get Ipanema 50s with no luck.


WEIGHT: I am all for a weight minimum. We have chosen 3500 grams as we just copied someone else.
To address both of your statments in bold text:

Last week the owner of the track/hobby shop was contacted and was told to forget it, didn't want to offer our slicks, said the "deal" was done.

So your availability issue is really a mute topic, as the inventory offer was attempted and declined by the owner.

The 3500 gram minimum weight limit is from the Ipanema Sports US GT Nats & GT Worlds rules. The same rules that give you the freedom to use what ever tire you think is best for you.

Good luck!
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Old 06-27-2011, 12:09 PM   #154
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GT8 and GT8 lite race this sunday July 3rd at TCHobby's "A Total COntrol Hobby's" in Oceanside, Ca. no. San Diego county off of I-5 on mission ave. TC Hobby's is going to have a big race on the sunday July 24th same location. PM me for more info. It will be electric only.
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Old 06-27-2011, 12:22 PM   #155
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I think a min weight rule is a fantastic idea.
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Old 06-27-2011, 01:36 PM   #156
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To truly do spec, you need to spec everything. Motor, tire, gearing , weight. That's why most tracks just run the open class only. I don't think tires should be an issue for you , most top brands should be allowed. engines are the hard thing to spec. You should have one engine only , or make it open. It's your race and I'll try to comply with whatever rules you decide on.
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Old 06-27-2011, 01:59 PM   #157
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I think the spec engines should be number of ports, and any other guide line for mfg's to have an approved engine for the class, just like electric motors. And Novarossi based motors by different brands.

My 2 cents
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Old 06-27-2011, 02:00 PM   #158
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Jeff: I would please ask that you not attack us as track owners or our event regarding your opinion on our spec tire decision for the Timezone GP. The tire decision was made by myself, Mark Day and Rick St. Cyr the owners of the two facilities, it was based upon our experience and 11 years as track owners and racers of multiple types of RC cars. We feel it is the best decision to insure this newer spec class (that we only added because local interest and request) is affordable and fair to all of those who do choose to attend our race.

Please do not refer to us as “afraid or greedy”

Also Troy is not affiliated with Timezone Racing and has only been working to get the class established in the NW were those core races had used the national guidelines to set our regional rules.

We would ask that you show at least a slight bit of professionalism in the way you portray yourself and your company. We are also very sorry your “fast guys” that choose not to attend will miss one of the best BBQ’s in RC racing
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Old 06-27-2011, 03:46 PM   #159
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Mark, I don't know who is involved with what in your area, but Troy claimed that "WE" chose a spec tire and cited "availability" as one of the reasons our tire wasn't considered. I was merely responding to him as that is totally incorrect, as you know from our discussion.

Let’s just call this for what it really is - We have a competitor that is trying to get more market share by excluding our products under the banner of "spec tires make it more fair," followed by a self-serving pitch to use their tires as the spec tire.

We strongly believe we have a superior product that's priced competitively, faster on the racetrack, and a better value. If this was really about the racers, then I would at least think that anyone (not just you) would consider all the options before making a decision.

The "afraid or greedy" comment wasn't directed at you - but more at the campaign to "spec" our product "out" of as many races and series as possible.

If you think that reflects on my professionalism, that's unfortunate. I don't have any desire to have that kind of relationship with any dealer. The response given when I called to just "forget it" and how basically that the deal is done, wasn't really expected.

I was hoping for an honest opportunity to tell you about the value of my products and how we believe they're better for the GT racers, but I wasn't given the same consideration that was apparently given to our competitor.

We've worked very hard to get this category off the ground for the last six years, putting together the first big event of its kind featuring only GT cars. We had a chance to "spec" our tire, and was even told I'd be crazy not to, so we could recoup the big investments made to help get this category going.

Although some racers were in support of a spec, I was called "greedy and afraid" by team drivers that represented other brands. Even though that's a hollow claim coming from the people who were making it, and the reasons behind why they said it. We didn't want to give the appearance that this was all about selling our products, so tires were and are left open for all brands to compete.

Our products end up winning races anyway, but that isn't the point. It was more about promoting the class because it's one that we particularly enjoy and would like to see become even more popular.

All I ask is that our products that have won just about every race where there are equally talented drivers are in attendance representing the two or three brands of tires in this market, are given equal consideration.

We would rather leave rubber tires open, because there no other product in the GT class where it's limited to one brand. That's anti-competitive and doesn't give the racers the choice to decide which is best for them.

Racers get to choose their $190 servos (each), and they get to choose which engine they're running, they have a choice of fuel, radios, bodies, clutches, etc., etc.

Why is it that the only product in this category in which racers won't have a choice at your race, is tires?

It's because our competitors are trying very hard to make it that way, and it's because many GT racers feel Ipanema has a superior GT racing product. The only way they can "compete" is by not allowing the competition.
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Old 06-27-2011, 06:43 PM   #160
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I agree that a spec class should at least have 1 brand/type engine/clutch only. Cuts out any speculation. Everything else is setup.
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Old 06-27-2011, 08:33 PM   #161
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Interesting reading today guy's. I know Mark Day and the other Time Zone guys and they are pretty up front people to deal and race with. On the rubber tire side, in touring cars you know the little electric brothers to our GT cars, every major event has a hand out tire that you must purchase at each event when there. You will sometimes not even know the brand until you get there.

So the chassis is open, motor open (well ok it must be the correct turn), open esc and open to bodies approved for the event. We should all know this. It is not a fully spec class, as that would have to be the same car, body, esc, motor .................

If the event is that tire only, then that is what it is.

Our club track runs Solaris tires on our carpet, and I know John from Sweep would love to have us use his tores and we keep talking, but we have not made the change. Our two day carpet race, did the hand out tires that they purchased at the track 2 sets and a third if they made the main. So what Time Zone is doing is the same, but Cleveland, IIC, Novak, Snowbirds, ROAR Nationals .......... all do this.

This is new ground for the nitro pavement side, as I do not remember in over 20 years of RC Racing having a spec tire but based on the Worlds Race for 1/8 scale and "Sauce Gate" we may have spec tires for nitro, but I for one hope we don't end up with spec tires in any class ...... my 2 cents.
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Old 06-27-2011, 09:42 PM   #162
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When I posted earlier I used the term "WE". I understand how there can be confusion but I was referring to our club members at Rose City Scale Racing. A few of us have been defining and adopting the rules for the gt class in our area. We typically race twice a month. Half of these race days are at Timezone. We have chosen a spec tire to run for our club to keep cost low.


As far as the TZGP, the rules and all decisions are made by the owners Rick St. Cyr and Mark Day.


Thanks,

Troy
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Old 06-28-2011, 09:43 AM   #163
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Pardon me for asking, but how many sets of tyres do you guys use at a wkend race? Do you guys pull out a new set for each race and scrap the others for practice??? Just out of curiosity, considering you want to keep cost low, why not con't w/ the same set of tyres for the whole race wknd or 2 race wknds? I have been known to use the same tyres up to 3 wknds in a row.

I will tell you that performance wise, as long as the tyres got rubber they will hold up well, and I don't think I loose too many seconds, almost always in the amain and many TQ's on the same tyres. Shoot, there are times I think that I may not have the same luck with a new set so I don't change even though they may look bad.
That's the beauty of the rubber tyres in this class. These aren't foams and unless you hit a board and crack a rim, don't be afraid to use the tyres up... I don't think they will fail you...have faith my children, if the rubber is there, it will hold up more than one race wknd!

(if they don't, then you're using the wrong tyre, because traction w/ what I've used has not required me to put on a new set for each race)

Another 2 cents,
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Just another 2 cents.
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Old 06-28-2011, 10:06 AM   #164
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Quote:
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We have chosen a spec tire to run for our club to keep cost low.

Troy
Troy,

How much are are you selling that low cost tire to your customers for, how low cost is it?
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Old 06-28-2011, 10:35 AM   #165
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I concur with Havy . I have run as much as 8 weekends on the same set of Sweeps. One set will handle that weekend with ease.
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