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Old 11-23-2006, 06:05 AM   #8386
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wow! Thanks for the list. I agree about people telling me about purchasing mistakes - everyone has a vested interest in the chassis they possess so I take what people say with a pinch of salt. I reckon I'll go with my original idea and that's to get a spare RRR chassis. I was just wondering if anyone else raced both cars in the same season.

ziggy12345 - thanks again for the list ...I take it it's in no particular order ?

Would you agree that for immediate benefits I should start with:

The rear and front rollbars
Kfactory brake shoes
Kyosho long blue brake arm

I notice you reckon ceramic bearings are a waste of time ...is that because the standard ones that come in the kit are just as good? Or are the benefits so small that I should not care?
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Old 11-23-2006, 07:06 AM   #8387
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Originally Posted by johnypiston
So thanks to people on this forum I was able to sort out my "belt-touching-the-manifold" and "brake-not-releasing-after-being-pulled" issues out. I have now broken the engine in and have taken a few exploratory fast laps. Though the car feels great, it is quite clear that it requires a prepped surface in order for the suspension to work at it's best. On the low grip untreated track surface I did my prelim testing on, the front was ALL OVER THE PLACE. The track is tight and might have been a little too technical for the car. On the other end of the handling spectrum, the car would throw the rear out if you gave it even half throttle coming out of a corner. Line the car up properly (slowly), and hit the throttle at the apex of the corner and the rear would slide out ..to the point where correction is required.
All of your issues can be addressed thru tuning the suspension. The stock WCE setup is geared more for a high grip surface but there are many things you can do to set the car up for low traction. I don't think there is a car available that can handle a technical track better than the RRR.

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Not to worry though, nothing that thinner diff oil and a shock oil change cannot fix. But I will only try different settings when I get to try the car on a wide, flowing and prepared surface ...which will be when the racing season starts in January


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What I wanted to ask is; seeing as my car is 100% stock (pics: http://www.featuredalbums.com/kmonale/gallery204), what upgrades would you guys say I ABSOLUTELY have to have before the season starts? I already have high torque digital servos and the Novarosi N12LL3 should cope just fine. Anything else that you would recommend?
If you have the WCE I would say, no there isn't anything you "ABSOLUTELY" have to have. I use a hollow mid-shaft and the aluminum mid-shaft mount for durability and weight. I also use a Kawahara rear sway bar (very similar to the EVO) and a K-Factory rear mount. I would recommend upgrading the brake disk and pads. I use the APP stuff... works very good. The only other things I am adding to my car will be for weight savings or to make the car more efficient, like ceramic bearings and titanium screws and other misc. parts. I don't completely agree with Ziggy but he has very good input. We all have our opinions on the value of things. The only other things I would suggest are some of the EVO parts like the 2-speed shaft/brake hub.

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Also, a large number of racers in my country drive the Mugen Seiki MTX4. They assure me I made a mistake with the RRR. Since I will be racing, I was going to buy a spare V-One RRR chassis for spares. Would it be better to rather buy an MTX4 and then keep switching between the two ....depending on the difficulty of getting parts? In other words, if my LHS can only get a specific RRR part next month ...I know I can at least race the MTX4 ...would that make sense?
I don't think that would be a good idea. You need to learn one car. Don't listen to those Mugen guys... they are just scared. You did not make a mistake. The RRR is the best car out there. You will see once you start racing. If you need help, just ask. There are many people here that can help you.
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:08 PM   #8388
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Thanks jag! I must say I cannot wait for the season to start. I've been driving an HPI RS4 and the difference in performance and chassis dynamics is just ...well
It takes hours to wipe the smile off my face. I agree on the Mugen ..make no mistake, it is good. But I have yet to see anything that makes it better in any way whatsoever.

Tell me ...do you guys "park" your cars and not touch them until official races? Do you not occasionally take your cars to the track and do a couple of laps ...even though the surface is not treated? The guys at the LHS told me to put the car away (because of the costs and the risk of breaking something on a low grip surface) until race week ...that KILLS ME!! Though I could drive the RS4 intead ...it's not quite the same thing is it?
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:18 PM   #8389
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You aint going to get better if you dont practice!
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Old 11-23-2006, 11:28 PM   #8390
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That's what I wanted to hear!! I cannot wait to get a base setting for the track. The track where I am going is massive ...they host a national there every year.

I must be honest here, next year will be my first race season and I am scared s%^^less!! I went to the last leg of our nationals last month and OMG these guys are fast! ...or should I say YOU guys are fast!! The RS4 has not prepared me enough ...I need practice. Anyway, its going to be awesome. Here a shot of my weapons of choice for the season ...the RS4 for club racing and the RRR (in the Mazda6 body) for the national assault
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Old 11-24-2006, 12:17 AM   #8391
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hi...basically my current setup is good enough..but the rear tends to slide / drift when full throttle is applied coming out of corners ( i have to counter the steering to avoid too much of this drifting) ...other than that i am happy. so what simple solution should i take to reduce this rear drift/slides ?? i am thinking rear shock position and anti roll bar adjustment would help? thanks
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Old 11-24-2006, 06:50 AM   #8392
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnypiston
Tell me ...do you guys "park" your cars and not touch them until official races? Do you not occasionally take your cars to the track and do a couple of laps ...even though the surface is not treated? The guys at the LHS told me to put the car away (because of the costs and the risk of breaking something on a low grip surface) until race week ...that KILLS ME!! Though I could drive the RS4 intead ...it's not quite the same thing is it?
Drive the RRR every chance you get. Practice is the only way to get better. So what if you break something... it's eventually going to happen. Play around with the setup at different tracks with different conditions. That will help you understand how changes effect the handling.
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Old 11-24-2006, 07:19 AM   #8393
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Originally Posted by rcabj
hi...basically my current setup is good enough..but the rear tends to slide / drift when full throttle is applied coming out of corners ( i have to counter the steering to avoid too much of this drifting) ...other than that i am happy. so what simple solution should i take to reduce this rear drift/slides ?? i am thinking rear shock position and anti roll bar adjustment would help? thanks
Depending upon how the car is working, you can either take steering away or increase rear traction. My suggestions are: if you want to increase rear traction you can lay the rear shocks down, use black springs, remove the 2mm blue spacer from the upper links (lower the rear roll center), use 10k in the diff, increase rear toe-in, etc... You could also try taking away some steering by turning the front sway bar up. My last suggestion is to use some finess with the throttle. I would recommend making 1 change at a time.

I am not the most experienced driver but these are the areas I would work in. I hope at least some of this helps.
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Old 11-24-2006, 08:23 AM   #8394
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcabj
hi...basically my current setup is good enough..but the rear tends to slide / drift when full throttle is applied coming out of corners ( i have to counter the steering to avoid too much of this drifting) ...other than that i am happy. so what simple solution should i take to reduce this rear drift/slides ?? i am thinking rear shock position and anti roll bar adjustment would help? thanks
I am assuming your using the right rear tyres? 2mm offset. If not the rear end can be too narrow.

The rear end drift is a problem of missunderstanding on how the front and rear react with one another. As you turn right the car leans over to the left. This in turn loads up the front and rear wheels. If the front is too stiff the front outside wheel will see more load and turn in before the back wheel is loaded and therfore breaks away. To compensate you need to soften the front and stiffen the back.

This sounds like the exact opposite to what you would expect but makes complete sence and also works in practice.

Other things that help are:

Using the CVJs that extend the rear and use 0 offset tyres
Use thinner rear diff oil
Harder rear roll bar

Cheers
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Old 11-24-2006, 10:13 AM   #8395
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggy12345
I am assuming your using the right rear tyres? 2mm offset. If not the rear end can be too narrow.

The rear end drift is a problem of missunderstanding on how the front and rear react with one another. As you turn right the car leans over to the left. This in turn loads up the front and rear wheels. If the front is too stiff the front outside wheel will see more load and turn in before the back wheel is loaded and therfore breaks away. To compensate you need to soften the front and stiffen the back.

This sounds like the exact opposite to what you would expect but makes complete sence and also works in practice.

Other things that help are:

Using the CVJs that extend the rear and use 0 offset tyres
Use thinner rear diff oil
Harder rear roll bar

Cheers
Hey Ziggy....

do you happen to have the part number for those "extended CVJ's to make the rear wider. Seems strange to me coming from 1/8 that Kyosho and Mugen cars have to use a 2mm offset tires for the rear. Why not make it an indusrty standard to use 0 offset? Anyway any info is appreciated as I am converting my car now(WCE to EVO/WCE) and haven't bought tires yet. Thanks
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Old 11-24-2006, 12:21 PM   #8396
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http://rc-mushroom.com/product_info....ducts_id=11381

They didnt come with the little washer thats required to move the hex out by 2mm. Check the play and add a 2mm spacer before installing the hex drives
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Old 11-24-2006, 03:01 PM   #8397
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Can anyone tell me where i can get this recevier box ??
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Old 11-24-2006, 03:38 PM   #8398
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Tell me ...do you guys "park" your cars and not touch them until official races? Do you not occasionally take your cars to the track and do a couple of laps ...even though the surface is not treated? The guys at the LHS told me to put the car away (because of the costs and the risk of breaking something on a low grip surface) until race week ...that KILLS ME!! Though I could drive the RS4 intead ...it's not quite the same thing is it?
I think most of us on this forum are RACERS, and as such we consider our RC cars finely tuned racing machines and we dont dare BASH them. Sure I used parcking lots to breack in engines, but the track is where my RACE car belongs. As far as oficcial races and practice, thats all I do with my car, practice and race. I prolly run more tanks tru it on practice days than on race days. You will never get better if you dont practice. I consider going to the track my terapy, I look forward toit all week.
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Old 11-25-2006, 07:49 AM   #8399
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ziggy12345
The rear end drift is a problem of missunderstanding on how the front and rear react with one another. As you turn right the car leans over to the left. This in turn loads up the front and rear wheels. If the front is too stiff the front outside wheel will see more load and turn in before the back wheel is loaded and therfore breaks away. To compensate you need to soften the front and stiffen the back.

This sounds like the exact opposite to what you would expect but makes complete sence and also works in practice.

Cheers
That's an interesting theory. I will try it tomorrow.
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Old 11-25-2006, 08:27 AM   #8400
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris-steele
Can anyone tell me where i can get this recevier box ??
to me it looks like the one made for the MTX-4 by mid MUGEN germany http://www.mid-mugen.de/
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