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Old 06-04-2012, 08:42 AM   #676
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Default WT and CST (cps) ... silicone oils

Was just brousing the thread and seen the comments on shock/ diff oil earlier and felt I needed to say something ..........

Don't compare the two ratings of oil being used, Wt was used by the US originally when they grade motor oil and has no relevence to silicone oil. It is a figure set by the manufacturing company and does not follow thickness lineally at all. So Serpent 40WT may well be far thicker then Trinity 40WT where as Serpent 70WT could be slightly thinner then Trinity 70WT !!

CST on the other hand is the Nationally recognized grading of oil viscosity and can be compared from brand to brand. It also alters lineally as the oil gets thicker.
Be careful though. Silicone oil is always a blend of oils. So when a bottle says 600cst, it could be 598, 628, 610 etc. But the manufacturer will get as close as feasable to the bottle description.

Companies that use CST(cps) in their oil description and manufacture it to the standard and hence are the same (similar?!) oil thickness are,
Kyosho, Mugan, Capricorn (Although a little confusing when they put 60 for 600cst on the bottle?!), XRay, Team Magic and GS Europe. There may be others too that use this grading that I do not know about.... sorry. But they do put it on the label that they use this grading and hence, as has been said can be compared to others using CST(cps)

As DS Motorsport has said and I agree with. Keeping to one manufacturer is the best way to stay consistant.

By the way DS. Did you get my email on more parts? Waiting to hear from you

Don't forget also. Silicone oil will get thinner (Substantually!) as the temps go up!
EX: A 600cst at 20 Degrees C could well be 480 to 500CST and will act like 480 to 500CST in the shock at 30 Degrees C !!

Just something to bear in mind.

Sorry for the long post but I hope this helps.

BM
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Old 06-04-2012, 11:49 AM   #677
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DJ,

Do you have a setup sheet from L.A.? At least shock pistons, oil springs?

Thanks,
Brad
For the shocks I would try 1 hole in the front and 2 in the rear with 55 wt oil. Just add a little travel to the front droop to help where there are bumps.

DJ
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Old 06-04-2012, 12:11 PM   #678
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Originally Posted by dj apolaro View Post
For the shocks I would try 1 hole in the front and 2 in the rear with 55 wt oil. Just add a little travel to the front droop to help where there are bumps.

DJ
Thanks DJ,

I need to order springs, which ones do you use most of the time? LA?

Thanks, again!
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Old 06-04-2012, 01:10 PM   #679
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Thanks DJ,

I need to order springs, which ones do you use most of the time? LA?

Thanks, again!

I would say you will typically use stock rears at almost every track and mugen white front springs. I would have in your bag stock fronts and rears, blue fronts and red rears from Capricorn. A set of progressive springs also. Then have mugen whites for the front. If I were to back to LA and race I would start with the Progressive all around with 1 and 2 hole and 55wt oil.

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Old 06-04-2012, 01:15 PM   #680
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Originally Posted by dj apolaro View Post
I would say you will typically use stock rears at almost every track and mugen white front springs. I would have in your bag stock fronts and rears, blue fronts and red rears from Capricorn. A set of progressive springs also. Then have mugen whites for the front. If I were to back to LA and race I would start with the Progressive all around with 1 and 2 hole and 55wt oil.

DJ
ok, perfect I will order blue frt, red rear and progressive set, I have everything else.

Thanks
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Old 06-04-2012, 01:22 PM   #681
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Hi Guys
Is this how the clutch works.

The further you screw in the clutch nut (putting on more pressure) the higher the RPMs will be to get moving.

The lesser amount of screw in on the clutch nut the less rpms you need to start moving.

I'm trying to adjust the clutch but having a few difficulties.

When I put .35mm between the flywheel nut and clutch nut as per DJs post, I put the clutch bell on but it can't touch the clutch as it is hitting the clutch nut.

To get the clutch bell to touch the clutch (so i can then use shims to set the clutch gap)I have to screw in clutch nut so I have 2 mm flywheel nut to clutch nut gap, that then lets the clutch bell touch the clutch so i can use shims to set the clutch gap. But then i need enormous rpm to get the car to move and then it's so violent it's uncontrollable.

Any ideas why the clutch bell hits the clutch nut?
Thanks Trevor

In the "KYOSHO Tech Tips - EVOLVA 2005" (by Josh Cyrull?)
you will find a very good explanation of what all components in a clutch will
do.

The clutch bell hits the clutch nut because of the different nut diametre.
The original Capricorn spring nut has a diam. of +- 13mm and is smooth and chamfered. For example, the Kyosho spring nut has about 13.5mm and is fluted.

I use the original settings for the capricorn clutch and they work well for me.
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Old 06-04-2012, 04:16 PM   #682
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Originally Posted by dj apolaro View Post
I would say you will typically use stock rears at almost every track and mugen white front springs. I would have in your bag stock fronts and rears, blue fronts and red rears from Capricorn. A set of progressive springs also. Then have mugen whites for the front. If I were to back to LA and race I would start with the Progressive all around with 1 and 2 hole and 55wt oil.

DJ
Where do the Progressives fall, compaired to kit rears and white fronts.

Thanks
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Old 06-04-2012, 07:52 PM   #683
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Where do the Progressives fall, compaired to kit rears and white fronts.

Thanks
I think they are softer at the beginning portion of the compression, but then they stiffen up.

DJ
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Old 06-06-2012, 12:44 PM   #684
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Hi, to all, am currently running this car and seem to be having a few problems, first problem is power-on under steer, am running 60 oil all round as per kit, white mugen fronts and Capricorn red rears, running short wheel base, front caster clips all at the front, did try 2mm at the the rear with the same problem, droop 0 at front and 7 at rear, 1.5 toe out at front and 2.5 toe in at rear, camber at front 1.5 rear 3. the second problem is have tried to use the new front anti roll bar and there seems an excessive movement between left and right hubs lifting, the movement seems to come from the plastic ball links ?, any one else had the same issues and what did you do to get rid of it.
AM
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Old 06-06-2012, 01:02 PM   #685
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Sounds like you have too much rear end traction. The good thing is this is easy to fix. I have one question first. Are you running the front eccentrics so that the axles are all the way down?

To help with the on power push you can

-take out rear toe (try +2 or +1.5)
-also use the stock rear springs and lay them down all the way
-you can add shims to make more angle in the rear camber link
-I think you have too much caster, move 2mm back in front, as with the changes you need it. This will help keep the car balanced
-raise rear lower roll center pins to the middle position if they are not already there

Hope this helps,

DJ Apolaro
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Old 06-06-2012, 05:10 PM   #686
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Originally Posted by dj apolaro View Post
Sounds like you have too much rear end traction. The good thing is this is easy to fix. I have one question first. Are you running the front eccentrics so that the axles are all the way down?

To help with the on power push you can

-take out rear toe (try +2 or +1.5)
-also use the stock rear springs and lay them down all the way
-you can add shims to make more angle in the rear camber link
-I think you have too much caster, move 2mm back in front, as with the changes you need it. This will help keep the car balanced
-raise rear lower roll center pins to the middle position if they are not already there

Hope this helps,

DJ Apolaro
Hi DJ,

How does the front eccentrics (axle up or down) affect the car handling?

Thank You
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:17 AM   #687
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Originally Posted by dj apolaro View Post
Sounds like you have too much rear end traction. The good thing is this is easy to fix. I have one question first. Are you running the front eccentrics so that the axles are all the way down?

To help with the on power push you can

-take out rear toe (try +2 or +1.5)
-also use the stock rear springs and lay them down all the way
-you can add shims to make more angle in the rear camber link
-I think you have too much caster, move 2mm back in front, as with the changes you need it. This will help keep the car balanced
-raise rear lower roll center pins to the middle position if they are not already there

Hope this helps,

DJ Apolaro
Hi, many thanks for the advice, am not yet running the eccentrics just standard kit, will give it a go and come back to you.

AM
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Old 06-07-2012, 04:43 AM   #688
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Originally Posted by HPC View Post
Hi DJ,

How does the front eccentrics (axle up or down) affect the car handling?

Thank You
If you are a driver that like steering than the front eccentrics are a must. Use them with the axle in the lowest position. This give the front end a lot more grip and gives better steering all around. Going in and coming out.

DJ
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Old 06-07-2012, 04:44 AM   #689
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Hi, many thanks for the advice, am not yet running the eccentrics just standard kit, will give it a go and come back to you.

AM
Definitely use the eccentrics before you start making to many changes. If you can get them in time.

DJ
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Old 06-07-2012, 09:49 AM   #690
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Originally Posted by dj apolaro View Post
If you are a driver that like steering than the front eccentrics are a must. Use them with the axle in the lowest position. This give the front end a lot more grip and gives better steering all around. Going in and coming out.

DJ
DJ,

Thank u very much for your explanation.Much appreciated.

How about the front track width? How does it affect On and Off Power steering?

Best Regards.
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