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Old 03-11-2004, 08:05 AM   #1
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Default Nitro Touring setups - help me please

I come from a Mini-z background, and I am pretty good at identifying and interpreting what my car needs to handle the way I want it. In mini-z first I start with tires then if I feel I need more grip in the front I will change softer springs. – or if my rear is pushing, I will put a harder spring in the rear. In a nut shell at the end I end up with a combination of tires and springs.

For example:

Tires 10degrear / 20 deg front Medium springs rear / soft front springs.

However, I noticed that the guys who run their S710 (the car I have also – my first nitro car) use the same tire compound all around 40/40 and the same springs hard all around or soft all around.

Can someone please tell me then how is it that they set up their cars based on if they need more steering or more rear grip?

My take on this would be to find a good tire combination, -- doesn’t running the same shore all around produce traction roll?

Please help me because I know feel loss as nitro touring cars are much more complex than my little mini-z
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Old 03-11-2004, 08:43 AM   #2
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Without changing tires and springs continuously, don't underestimate how much affect droop settings can have.
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Old 03-11-2004, 10:24 AM   #3
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so if I have a stock car with the stock setup, where do i beging to make changes?

I have a710
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Old 03-11-2004, 10:24 AM   #4
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kmac is right
droop can play a huge effect on car handling/mishandling
also another quick easy adjustment is changing the caster on the
front of the car this can give you some amazing results while still leaving the tires and springs constant (provided the other settings on your car like camber and toe are in the ball park of being correct)
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Old 03-11-2004, 10:27 AM   #5
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btw your 710 manual has a great chart for changing the setup to get the car to handle how you want, also the xxx main book is a great tool for explaining the changes and how they work.
And follow the rc golden rule = one change at a time this way you know the exact effect of the single cause/change
good luck
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Old 03-11-2004, 10:33 AM   #6
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I will read that chart, I forgot about it...

but my question is.. is it wrong to have different springs and tires?
or is that something I should keep constant.

like if my car is pushing for instance, I would reduce my toe (rear) then if it still does then I would put harder springs in the rear, or should it be theother way around? or should I not thouch my srpings at all? and play with the pistons?
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Old 03-11-2004, 11:23 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by Profoxcg
so if I have a stock car with the stock setup, where do i beging to make changes?

I have a710
i have a 710 and i have been running the stock set up with 37 shore tires all around and have done very well with it.
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Old 03-11-2004, 11:33 AM   #8
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Don't forget that the 710 has the adjustable shock dampening. This is a very quick, easy and cheap way of fine tuning the suspension.
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Old 03-11-2004, 12:14 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by Profoxcg
I will read that chart, I forgot about it...

but my question is.. is it wrong to have different springs and tires?
or is that something I should keep constant.

like if my car is pushing for instance, I would reduce my toe (rear) then if it still does then I would put harder springs in the rear, or should it be theother way around? or should I not thouch my srpings at all? and play with the pistons?
No, it is NOTHING wrong if you can get your car dialed and WIN the race.............if MICHAEL SALVEN suddently drives for HPI and the only car he can use is the first gen RS4 racer and he WIN the WORLD CHALLENGE.......does that make the RS4 the wrong car to race...? Hardly.....

Don't forget, you are using the S710, probably by far the most adjustable RC car in the market, thats why you have that 40 pages setup booklet to study (yes, study)........technology has change so much that S710 can handle great with same springs, same shores tires, same shock oils...........except different damper openings and different droop/ride height setting front and rear......THOSE are the factors that make the car still running good with the same shore of tires.

Try to do that when IMPULSE came out 5 years ago with their rubber tires....you can barely run a full lap on a real race.

I rememeber MS said when he was in Indonesia for the Asia Serpent Challenge.......he tried all the different setting (but still using same springs and same shore tires) and try to gain more steering................at the end, his solution is softer tires (37 front and 40 rear)........unfortunely, he doesn't have 37 shores........that tells you 1 thing, even a PRO driver like MS will run different shore tires F/R or springs or some other weird setup AS LONG AS he can win the race...........did you realized that sometime they have more negative camber on 1 side of the car then the other side....?

For you (and me too with the S710).........I found that the 40 pages setup booklet especially that RED GREEN chart is the MOST EXPENSIVE and MONEY WORTH item............start from #1, then follow the rest of the step........

Again, as long as the car win the race.......thats all matter.
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Old 03-11-2004, 01:04 PM   #10
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Guys ,

Thank you so much for such great and encouraging response !!

that is what I needed to hear, becuase I felt that the knowledge I had gained through mini-z and micros was a waste, so I am glad I can apply some of those principles.

and yes I will STUDY the booklet
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Old 03-11-2004, 01:26 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by Profoxcg


that is what I needed to hear, becuase I felt that the knowledge I had gained through mini-z and micros was a waste, so I am glad I can apply some of those principles.

and yes I will STUDY the booklet
LOL...... Don't get me wrong, I am not laughing at you, but you compared the 710 setup bible vs your MICRO Mini-Z...? That is like comparing a Rocket Science Degree VS Algebra 101....

p.s. I wish Nitro Touring can be as easy as Micro.....
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Old 03-11-2004, 09:04 PM   #12
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One of the worst things you can do when you're just satarting its to copy what another driver or drivers are doing.

In your case I sugest that you start with the basic set-up included with the car, and go from there. Drive the car for a few tanks and evaluate what the car is doing, is it pushing, is it loose in the back, is it loose under breaking. Get a feel for the car.

Then, make changes accroding to what YOU want the car to do. I personnally choose to change tire hardeness as a last resort. First I change springs. I find that a lot of times all a set-up needs to make the car drive the way you want it to is a spring change.

Like someone else said, one change at a time. Also, dont constantly make changes to the car. When the car handles the way you want it to, drive it like that for a few months, and only then try other things. You want to get used to the way the cars is handling.

One thing I have learned over time (i have been driving for 2 years) is that as your drivng avility evolves, you will want the car to handle differently. I used take steering out of my cars, the front suspension was much harder than the rear suspension, but now I use the same springs and oil on all 4 shocks.

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Old 03-11-2004, 09:45 PM   #13
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thank you for the responses,

well, wouln't i want to change something if the next time i go to the track it feels different?

I find appealing how hard it is to race nitro touring.
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Old 03-11-2004, 10:30 PM   #14
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It only takes a few minutes to change the rear springs, just try it.
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Old 03-16-2004, 12:35 PM   #15
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Thumbs up Please help me.

I wanted to confirm what was the direct effect of body roll in a car. I was reading the 710 setup book and it talks about changing to a harder set of springs or lowering the roll center to reduce body roll. My questions are:

1) what does body roll do ? (many people like to stiffen up their cars and run red springs all the time)
2) does changing the roll centers have the same effect on body roll just like springs? If so I can go either way?

For instance:

Lets say that I need a little more steering mid out of a corner, then I have the following choices, first I have to chose if I want to work on the rear or the front of the car,

So lets say I want to work on the front… I am running 40deg tires, so I would change to 37deg. So now I have 40R /37F

And this fixed my problem….

Or

I could have kept 40deg all around and placed softer spring on the front and angled my shocks if the spring change needed a little help, and even then change my pistons.

Or

I could’ve added more caster.

Or I could’ve done nothing to the front and worked on the rear and play with the roll bars? And change to 45deg tires? Or maybe a harder springs?

In other words what I am tying to get at, is there a specific order to make changes or do I want to change what I think will solve my problem at once even if it involves changing the front and back? – I can get the same effect/ result many different ways I just need to find out that works out for me?

Thanks
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