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Old 06-17-2004, 04:21 AM   #12661
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Quote:
Originally posted by InitialD
Changing to that higher rear roll center makes the rear end swing easy. It makes the car have a lot more steering and responsive.
Bro, find yuor time to download AMCClaps by Mark Green from uncle Sow. It change my own basic rule to setup a car.
Watch carefully his car "sways"(??) into corner.
I believe he was using LB, last week I try that and my car react just like his car. Unfortunately my finger did not..
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Old 06-17-2004, 04:30 AM   #12662
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Quote:
Originally posted by InitialD
What shore do you use with the Speedminds? 37? Why not try 40?

If you find the Speedminds wear fast at 37 shore, then you'll see the GRP ones wear faster.
I use 35's and the grip is fantastic, but obviously I will have to live with high tyre wear. The order I am waiting on are 37's and that is what I will try next. From my experience you are correct about the tyrewear on other brands, I find the same thing. But the wear on the sato's is very impressive. Having said that your theory about the shore's between Sato's and speedmind would explain the great wear I get out of the sato's. In theory I am running 40's, compared to 35's speedminds. When I get the speedmind 37's I will see how they wear.
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Old 06-17-2004, 05:27 AM   #12663
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Default Re: Re: ATTENTION: TRACTION ROLL...Help!Help!

Quote:
Originally posted by InitialD
Mario, have you tried using higher front roll center? How much of shims do you have below the front upper arms? Stock is 2 mm. Taking out the 2 mm shim would raise the front roll center.
ALREADY DONE
SEE MY SETUP HERE : www.mytsn.com/setups/setup.asp?sid=2350
any GOOD IDEAS????
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Old 06-17-2004, 05:32 AM   #12664
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Default Re: Re: ATTENTION: TRACTION ROLL...Help!Help!

Quote:
Originally posted by Proficar403
The setup that I posted above works well in high and low traction. This is on a short track with a few 180s as well as sweepers and straights. Even with 37 front tires in very high traction, the car does not want to lift.

What springs are you running? I have found that at my home track, it is very easy to over-stiffen the car, causing it to bite too hard and want to lift. This is why I am running predominantly yellows and whites. All of us here have run the car with reds at some point, and we are all prefering yellows and whites now.

Any of us who have traction rolled have solved the problem by softening the car.
THank You PROFICAR BUT.....
I have already tried your setup with 37front and 40 rear and yellow spring all around.....
The results is that the car roll-over after5-10 minutes of race (instead of after 20 minuts of race)..
....If you drive "HARD" YOUR CAR YOU WILL ROLL OVER
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Old 06-17-2004, 05:42 AM   #12665
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No ... it is quite true...
I have tried 37fr /40rear but I didn't tried yellow spring togheter....

It works on a Small technical well gripped TRuck???
Or it makes the car too glued to track and low to react (sluggish)????
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Old 06-17-2004, 06:38 AM   #12666
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Hi. Where can I buy on the internet the serpent 710 ?
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Old 06-17-2004, 06:39 AM   #12667
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Quote:
Originally posted by Juan C Munoz
Hi. Where can I buy on the internet the serpent 710 ?
www.rc-mushroom.com

I find them very good
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Old 06-17-2004, 06:42 AM   #12668
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Quote:
Originally posted by mariochi
No ... it is quite true...
I have tried 37fr /40rear but I didn't tried yellow spring togheter....

It works on a Small technical well gripped TRuck???
Or it makes the car too glued to track and low to react (sluggish)????
I aggree with you mario, I have found that I have too much grip at the moment and it it washing away speed through the corners of my track.

I am trying a few different things this weekend (Higher shore tyres and different roll centres)
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Old 06-17-2004, 07:18 AM   #12669
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Quote:
Originally posted by InitialD
Sorry. Forgot about this reply.

Roll-center position upper: low inner (UBI)
Roll-center position lower: low (LB)

That would be stock out of the box setting.
Thanks D,
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Old 06-17-2004, 07:26 AM   #12670
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Default Re: Re: Short track setups

Quote:
Originally posted by Proficar403
Here is "about" what I am running with good success. Car goes in and comes out very well on a short track. Sometimes I run with white springs in lower traction. I also sometimes do without the front roll bar.

Thanks Proficar, is this the setup you use at TFB? I am going to be in Kennesaw the 2nd weekend in July and I am bringing my gear so hopefully the weather is nice and I can run with you guys.
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Old 06-17-2004, 09:41 AM   #12671
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Default Re: Re: Re: ATTENTION: TRACTION ROLL...Help!Help!

Quote:
Originally posted by mariochi
THank You PROFICAR BUT.....
I have already tried your setup with 37front and 40 rear and yellow spring all around.....
The results is that the car roll-over after5-10 minutes of race (instead of after 20 minuts of race)..
....If you drive "HARD" YOUR CAR YOU WILL ROLL OVER


Here is the picture of the track that "PROFICAR" mentioned. There are around 5 or more 710s racing every week. I haven't seen anyone has a problem with traction roll. We all have the front one-ways locked....we drive very hard.....even harder for PROFICAR (16.7s laptime).....he is one of the fastest guys at our track.....
I also copy his setups and.....my 710 getting faster and faster....

Last edited by kumpol; 06-17-2004 at 09:49 AM.
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Old 06-17-2004, 09:53 AM   #12672
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Quote:
Originally posted by mariochi
No ... it is quite true...
I have tried 37fr /40rear but I didn't tried yellow spring togheter....

It works on a Small technical well gripped TRuck???
Or it makes the car too glued to track and low to react (sluggish)????
I saw on your setup that you run the DRS in the up position. You may want to try the lower position. That might create a little more rear grip in the second part of the corner.

Did you try the front shocks more vertical?

It is important to find out if just before rolling the rear slides or that the car just rolls because of too much side grip.

If it happens after running 15-20 minutes that may suggest running a slightly harder tire all round. They may be heating up too much. Running 37/40 may make things worse as the grip on the front will increase more than rear.
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Old 06-17-2004, 10:26 AM   #12673
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Default Need help with setup - car pushes

Below is the setup I am currently running on a relatively short, technical track. The car has push into and through corners, but comes out very well.

I would like to get some advise on things to try to get more steering at corner entry and mid-corner.
At the bottom are a few things that I am considering changing to improve steering.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Suspension Geometry – FRONT
Downstops/Droop: set to get 3mm of up-travel (depends on tire diameter)
Actual ride height: 6mm
Camber Left: 1.5-2 degree
Camber Right: 1.5-2 degree
Track-width: 199mm
Toe-in: 1 degree out
Caster setting: 3mm shims in front of upper arm
Roll-center position upper arm (mm): 2mm under upper arm block (stock)
Upstop (mm): None

Suspension Geometry – REAR
Downstops/Droop: set to get 3mm up-travel (depends on tire diameter)
Actual ride height: 6mm
Camber Left: 2.0°
Camber Right: 2.0°
Toe-in: +2.0°
Track-width: 199mm
Roll-center position upper: UBI (stock)
Roll-center position lower: LB (stock)
DRS arm position (low-mid-up): mid…no bump steer (stock)

Shock Absorbers – FRONT
Springs: yellow
Oil: Serpent 30W
Holes: 3
Shockbody type: alum
Shock-tower position: 2

Shock Absorbers – REAR
Springs: red
Oil: Serpent 30W
Holes: 3
Shockbody type: alum
Shock-tower position: 1
Lower shock position: outside

Anti-Roll Bar – FRONT
Position: flat

Anti-Roll Bar – REAR
Thickness: standard
Position: end of bar
Position on lower arm: outside

Tires – FRONT
Make: Jaco Nitro Shoes
Width: 26mm
Hardness Left: 40
Hardness Right: 40
Diameter: 61mm

Tires – REAR
Make: Jaco Nitro Shoes
Width: 30mm
Hardness Left: 40
Hardness Right: 40
Diameter: 62mm

Transmission
Pinion 1st: 16T
Pinion 2nd: 22T
Gear 1st: 60T
Gear 2nd: 56T

Axle - FRONT
Type: adjustable ball diff
Diff. setting: med-tight

Axle – REAR
Type: adjustable ball diff
Diff. setting: med-tight

Aerodynamics
Body: Kyosho McLaren F1 GTR
Wing: Kit standard

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

THINGS I WAS THINKING OF CHANGING:
1) Front roll center - lower
2) Front caster – less
3) Front track-width - narrower (will also help with dogbone issue)

Last edited by GlennCauley; 06-17-2004 at 10:50 AM.
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Old 06-17-2004, 11:16 AM   #12674
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Hey Glenn,

You should try lower the front top arm holder. That will increase the camber gain and improve traction in the corner. Take off your front roll bar! Try to use less toe in the rear too and use red sprints.

I was having the similar problem but I improve it by what I said above. I am runing 1 degree toe in in the rear. I also use 42 all around all day. I think this setup will work better with 40 front and 42 rear as the car still push a little more then I like. Beside, 40 42 combo will make the tires wear more even.
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Old 06-17-2004, 11:39 AM   #12675
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Default Re: Need help with setup - car pushes

Quote:
Originally posted by GlennCauley
Below is the setup I am currently running on a relatively short, technical track. The car has push into and through corners, but comes out very well.

I would like to get some advise on things to try to get more steering at corner entry and mid-corner.
At the bottom are a few things that I am considering changing to improve steering.


THINGS I WAS THINKING OF CHANGING:
1) Front roll center - lower
2) Front caster – less
3) Front track-width - narrower (will also help with dogbone issue)
If you haven't tried it yet try running your front diff really loose, but not slipping or it will push severly on throttle as well as running the rear diff a little tighter than the front will help the car rotate on small tracks. You nay also want to run a different body.
I tried a saleen at a non sactioned race and it pushed really bad as well. If you are not running sedan put a lola on it, it will turn then. 37 Fronts will usually give you the off throttle steering your looking for as well.
Just a cuople of things to try if you haven' t allredy.

Brad
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