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Old 06-12-2004, 11:49 PM   #12466
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So what are you saying "D"?? That your front wheels never turn all the way to the left or right even when you turn your steering wheels on the controller all the way over?? And it still makes the 180 degree corners????? I must play with my setup then because I don't have that kind of steering! If you put your car on the Hudy setup board, how mny degree's do your wheels turn at full lock? Thanks...
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Old 06-12-2004, 11:59 PM   #12467
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Default Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Some testings...

Quote:
Originally posted by Julius
That depends on your defenition of best. I think with heavier flyweights and the yellow shoe you'd be stuck with a way too grippy clutch. Which will be very agressive if set late and would bog the motor when set too early. But testing is better than theory
True. I've already tested using the black shoe and with 2 set srcews on each weight that was modified. I'm just looking forward to testing the yellow shoes with the same clutch setup and see for myself. I believe Goldfinger mentioned that was the most grippy clutch setup.

I would also agree with you on how the clutch setup will turn out. I guess some people look to solving the problem differently. For me, I'd prefer to get the clutch engage as efficient as possible (by all means if it translates to be too grippy). I'd adjust the spring pre-tension nut and perhaps the engine tuning (LSN) slightly richer to get a "softer" clutch engagement. For me, clutch has to be as close to 100% efficient. But like I mentioned, that's just me.
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Old 06-13-2004, 12:08 AM   #12468
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Default Re: Re: Weight imbalance

Quote:
Originally posted by GoldFinger
Yes, we discuss this issue on earlier stage.
1st was Mark Green, he put 60 gram on tank (left)side.
My car feels better too with that addition.
Well, like what Julius mentioned, I did not feel a thing when I put weights on the left side of the tank. I put it there because I just wanted to try it out and left it there because the car was toio light to pass tech inspection !

I found out that I needed to put 80 to 100 grams to get the chassis to balance left to right. I'm at 80 grams. But I guess it's where I put the weights which is closest beside the tank on the CF radio tray and chassis. This is with Futaba S9451 steering servo and KO 2144 throttle / brake servo.

Quote:
Originally posted by GoldFinger
Later on we found that its not that imbalanced is making the car tends to pointing 1 direction.
It was unperfect diff that could caused that, especially when diff adjuster bolt is used (IMHO)
You are right. That's because the diff adjuster PREVENTS the left side of the rear axle to slip making the rear end of the car sweep to the left side. Taking off the diff adjuster just lets LEFT and RIGHT side of the rear wheel axle to slip at the same rate. So you actually don't see the rear diff slipping problem but it's there !

To solve the problem completely, you need to TIGHTEN the inside screw in the diff TIGHTER.

Quote:
Originally posted by GoldFinger
Then Julius came up with perfect tweaking methode to compromise that, it is awesome - in the bench.
On track condition ?? different story
(Me+Pyramid realise this later on..)
Can we brake a car when it has a diferent preload (front) shock spring ??
How did it make the front shock preload different? Mine's the same with same shock lengths.
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Old 06-13-2004, 12:13 AM   #12469
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Quote:
Originally posted by SupermaxxRich
So what are you saying "D"?? That your front wheels never turn all the way to the left or right even when you turn your steering wheels on the controller all the way over?? And it still makes the 180 degree corners????? I must play with my setup then because I don't have that kind of steering! If you put your car on the Hudy setup board, how mny degree's do your wheels turn at full lock? Thanks...
Yes, the wheels on my 710 does not turn fully to the left / right when I turn my steering wheel on my 3PK.

I use to set my left / right wheel steering lock to about 20 ++ degrees on the Hudy setup when I first set the car after the build. That was with 90 odd percent on the dual rate. I'm now down to 50 to 60%. I have not checked how many degrees that translates on the Hudy though.
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Old 06-13-2004, 12:32 AM   #12470
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Quote:
Originally posted by InitialD
an EDM machine, the process will only take a couple of minutes.
wow, this is really really really fast.
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Old 06-13-2004, 01:28 AM   #12471
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Quote:
Originally posted by InitialD
Yes, the wheels on my 710 does not turn fully to the left / right when I turn my steering wheel on my 3PK.

I use to set my left / right wheel steering lock to about 20 ++ degrees on the Hudy setup when I first set the car after the build. That was with 90 odd percent on the dual rate. I'm now down to 50 to 60%. I have not checked how many degrees that translates on the Hudy though.
20 only?...Wow, I've got mine to 25.
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Old 06-13-2004, 02:24 AM   #12472
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I'm going to give 20 degrees a try "D". What are the benefits to running such little steering "D"??
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Old 06-13-2004, 07:50 AM   #12473
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Default FISH TAILing REAR and its solutions.....

last saturday i ran my 710. GOT a bit TWITCHY at the rear wheel. FISH TAILing all the way... coz we played at the new track... still have a lot of dust.

one of the racer there do something to his 710 also. i asked him how to go about the problem.... how to make the FISH TAILing rear becomes planted on the dusty surface.

he mentioned this to me:

1) he will make the shock softer by using the 5th 'click' for the damper.
2) he will change to WHITE spring (softer than yellow spring) if necessary.
3) he will increase the ride height so that the car have more ...... emmmm.... roll more so the tyre will be more planted.
4) he will put MORE TOE in for the rear tyre so that he will have more responsive/faster cornering.
5) finally........ emmmm... AARRRRRGHHHHHHHH i forgot!!!! shucks!


so.... after that i didnt do anything to my car.... becoz i am confused. WHICH ONE OF THOSE setup need to be done FIRST and so on..... which one comes first and second and third and so on?

and anybody help me to give the fifth or the sixth way to reduce FISH TAILing REAR wheel on a dusty / low traction surface.

thanks!


mop
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Old 06-13-2004, 08:04 AM   #12474
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Default Re: Re: Re: Weight imbalance

Quote:
Originally posted by InitialD
How did it make the front shock preload different? Mine's the same with same shock lengths.
If you tweak your car using shock collar method
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Old 06-13-2004, 08:04 AM   #12475
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Default DOG BONE SAVER

Quote:
Originally posted by Sow&Steady
I'm beginning to wonder that either I'm lucky and got longer dogbones or there is something in the way others are assembling their cars. I have never lost my dogbones ................
i have TIP how to save your DOGBONE.....

use ZIP TIE....

but dont ZIP too tight around the dog bone....

so far i have no problem in terms of DRAG from the ZIP TIE.


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Attached Images
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Old 06-13-2004, 08:22 AM   #12476
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Quote:
Originally posted by kreidel
The car is practically brand new and I just checked again to see if anything was broken or bent up front and it was fine. My car setup is the default one the send with the kit so it is not some exotic setup that might be the issue. My MTX3 cannot use dogbones either, I had to purchase the universals, so maybe it is just my style of driving. I repeat that when the bones came out I made contact with absoutley nothing.
Like Sow&Steady mentioned about the tubing... it is all correct. You need the dogbones inside the axle more. You could also remove someplays on axle vs knuckle using precision shims. If you shimmed inside, it will aslo make the axle hold the dogbone deeper.
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Old 06-13-2004, 08:23 AM   #12477
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Default Re: FISH TAILing REAR and its solutions.....

Quote:
Originally posted by mop_iko
last saturday i ran my 710. GOT a bit TWITCHY at the rear wheel. FISH TAILing all the way... coz we played at the new track... still have a lot of dust.

one of the racer there do something to his 710 also. i asked him how to go about the problem.... how to make the FISH TAILing rear becomes planted on the dusty surface.

he mentioned this to me:

1) he will make the shock softer by using the 5th 'click' for the damper.
2) he will change to WHITE spring (softer than yellow spring) if necessary.
3) he will increase the ride height so that the car have more ...... emmmm.... roll more so the tyre will be more planted.
4) he will put MORE TOE in for the rear tyre so that he will have more responsive/faster cornering.
5) finally........ emmmm... AARRRRRGHHHHHHHH i forgot!!!! shucks!


so.... after that i didnt do anything to my car.... becoz i am confused. WHICH ONE OF THOSE setup need to be done FIRST and so on..... which one comes first and second and third and so on?

and anybody help me to give the fifth or the sixth way to reduce FISH TAILing REAR wheel on a dusty / low traction surface.

thanks!


mop
I've suffered the same problems on my earlier days with the 710...try this

1. Use the inner position for the rear roll bar...inner on the lower arms

2. Loosen you rear diffs..loosen the friction collar screw.

3. Use softer rear shock setting...4 or 5 holes on the piston.

Hope it helps.
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Old 06-13-2004, 08:42 AM   #12478
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Quote:
Originally posted by InitialD
42 shore front and 45 shore rear with 40wt Serpent shock oil and 4x1.2 holes.
Be aware when running softer front. If the track/tarmac temp for the whole final is not changing fast (within 15degree C) it is ok. Otherwise, when temp greatly change, between softer and harder tires will react vice versa at different temperature... much differently until it remind me driving my 705 for the first time

Quote:
Originally posted by InitialD
My end point travel on my 710 steering never exceeds to the max. Mostly at 50% to 60% on the dual rate with the left / right travel set to max 120% on the 3PK.
Just another healty-meaning different point of view.. at that much DR, it might be ok when maintainning enough speed on corner but it defenetely suffer on low speed and or off throttle. Try to make 180 going out from the pit lane.

Quote:
Originally posted by InitialD
If you need to max out your steering end point just to get enough steering for your 180 degree apex turns, then there is something wrong with the car setup. That's what me thinks...
With the above point in mind, I always use 90-100% DR. As of my 3PK, if I use 100% DR, it would leave my EPA to only 95 before the servo start to make sound since L/R radius on the car already at its max point..

D... I tought you are using Helios.. I'm just about to try it because I find it lighter than the 3PK since I always get spiderweb above 30mins mark
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Old 06-13-2004, 08:52 AM   #12479
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Default Re: FISH TAILing REAR and its solutions.....

Quote:
Originally posted by mop_iko
and anybody help me to give the fifth or the sixth way to reduce FISH TAILing REAR wheel on a dusty / low traction surface.

thanks!


mop
The 5th one as being roll centre?

Try the setups I put on S710 Black Book but using 50 Trinity Oil, 2 holes, and stock Yellow Springs... I believe the car would still have enough rear grip even with 100% locked rear diff. Tires brand also plays important part as well. In my prefferences, if I could not run my car with shore 37 both front and rear, setup is wrong. Higher shore will make your car easier to drive as it tends to understeer.
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Old 06-13-2004, 09:36 AM   #12480
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Quote:
Originally posted by crashed_1
20 only?...Wow, I've got mine to 25.
Less steering will do the exact same as more steering.

With more steering when you go into the corner the front end slides away from the apex giving the feeling the car has little steering. By reducing the throw and using smaller controlled inputs on the steering the car will turn in a lot faster and carry more speed while at the same time reducing the overall tire wear.
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