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Old 05-08-2004, 10:15 AM   #9826
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Hi Glenn,

Really like the equipment list article - this is for me, as I always forget something. I'm getting better, though! This week I only forgot my crystal! but, I had my spare set This is a big improvment for me
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Old 05-08-2004, 10:21 AM   #9827
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Koool! My order is already in for my 705 GTP conversion - I've ordered a Lola shell, too.

Maybe we should all turn up at MACH Heemstede and make, like what D says, an impromptu RCTECH-Serpent Worlds - sounds good to me
That's not a bad idea, especially if we can twist Michael, Julius and Rene to show up at the same time!

Let me know if the weather forecast from 3Hobby.Com was right!
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Old 05-08-2004, 11:06 AM   #9828
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Ok, followed Glens notes to the letter - will be keeping an eye on the grease in the thrust bearing from now on Seem ok after build - left the clutch gap at 0.7mm and about 0.1mm end-play. The clutch bell spins for 5 seconds with everthing in place and greased - seems ok

Cheers, Mark.
Mark, in my opinion if you can spin the bell 5 seconds with the thrust bearing greased, than the grease isn't good enough. I used to check all the gaps with caliper but still cooked 2 bearings until I started using mugen Super grease. Now I have the same TB for 30 tanks and it looks as new.
The secret is the grease and re-grease it at least once in a race day
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Old 05-08-2004, 11:29 AM   #9829
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I've got Mugen Super Grease on there - I smeared a coating onto the two bearing carriers (i.e. a blob onto each bearing carrier and then wiped it round until the whole carrier had a coating) and not onto the balls themselves - how much did you put on.

I think last time I used an Assos grease which isn't as sticky as the mugen.

Cheers, Mark.
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Old 05-08-2004, 11:38 AM   #9830
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Quote:
Originally posted by markp27
I've got Mugen Super Grease on there - I smeared a coating onto the two bearing carriers (i.e. a blob onto each bearing carrier and then wiped it round until the whole carrier had a coating) and not onto the balls themselves - how much did you put on.

I think last time I used an Assos grease which isn't as sticky as the mugen.

Cheers, Mark.
Than you should be safe mark. maybe I'm a little paranoid after going through 2 bearings in 2 races and use more grease than necessary but my bell won't spin freely more than 1 second "after" I grease it
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Old 05-08-2004, 11:46 AM   #9831
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Here's a pic of the smearing - see what you think - I'm already paranoid after one bust thrust bearing
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File Type: jpg bearing.jpg (94.1 KB, 109 views)
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Old 05-08-2004, 11:53 AM   #9832
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Looking at it again, if I push the bell in, then it spins more than 5 seconds and if I pull it out (even though the gap is only about 0.1mm or 0.05mm) the bell only spins for about a second.

Cheers, Mark.
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Old 05-08-2004, 11:53 AM   #9833
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Great I ordered some more the otherday and they should be here in a day or 2.Hope its nice tomorrow so I can sneak out to get some playtime.
good , have fun!
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Old 05-08-2004, 12:07 PM   #9834
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Quote:
Originally posted by markp27
Here's a pic of the smearing - see what you think - I'm already paranoid after one bust thrust bearing
Perfecto! Mark, add that pic link to the FAQ.s the TB is a real issue for Centax beginers so looking at how it's supposed to be greased is going to be useful!
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Old 05-08-2004, 12:12 PM   #9835
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Quote:
Originally posted by cox049
Perfecto! Mark, add that pic link to the FAQ.s the TB is a real issue for Centax beginers so looking at how it's supposed to be greased is going to be useful!
It'll be part of the next update Actually I did as you suggested and checked my gaps again - I found my end play was larger than what I had thought - now the bell just say moves in and out when I push and pull, and the spin time is down to under a second

Thanks for the advice
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Old 05-08-2004, 12:27 PM   #9836
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Hey BaxterC , i see that you changed your avatar
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Old 05-08-2004, 04:19 PM   #9837
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Problem with thrust bearings. I've done a little studying on this thrust bearing thing and this is most lilkey the issue as I have been asking racers how their clutches are working. The 710 seems to exibit the following condition.

I have been told that the clutch set up properly has a very narrow sweet spot between bog and slip. once the happy spot is found the car leaps off the corner and after it shifts into second at about the 200 ft mark it acts like it shifts again. Its visible! The clutch is slipping as is the propensity with the little clutch setups like the Kawahara and 710. running a heaver spring makes the problem worse. the bell then overheats and literally melts the flyweights causing clutch bell endplay to grow which coupled with the heat cooks the thrust bearing. The solution is to run Glens setup with the Serpent Yellow shoe, heavy spring and weighted flyweights. Or the Red Rulon shoe (they are available) I make with a mugen hard silver spring and weighted flyweights. your thrust bearing issue will go away. My 710 has yet to hit the pavement but some of my friends have been running it for a while.

The 950R seems to do this to if you set it to loose on a high bite track without a high bite shoe. If the flyweights melt the shoe bites the bell at an angle and it cooks itself and throws its guts out on the ground.

Ive gone several races with my Mugen cars using the red shoes and literally ignored the thrust bearings and never had a failure all of last year. So Its not a lube issue its a heat issue.
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Old 05-08-2004, 05:20 PM   #9838
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Quote:
Originally posted by Motorman
Problem with thrust bearings. I've done a little studying on this thrust bearing thing and this is most lilkey the issue as I have been asking racers how their clutches are working. The 710 seems to exibit the following condition.

I have been told that the clutch set up properly has a very narrow sweet spot between bog and slip. once the happy spot is found the car leaps off the corner and after it shifts into second at about the 200 ft mark it acts like it shifts again. Its visible! The clutch is slipping as is the propensity with the little clutch setups like the Kawahara and 710. running a heaver spring makes the problem worse. the bell then overheats and literally melts the flyweights causing clutch bell endplay to grow which coupled with the heat cooks the thrust bearing. The solution is to run Glens setup with the Serpent Yellow shoe, heavy spring and weighted flyweights. Or the Red Rulon shoe (they are available) I make with a mugen hard silver spring and weighted flyweights. your thrust bearing issue will go away. My 710 has yet to hit the pavement but some of my friends have been running it for a while.

The 950R seems to do this to if you set it to loose on a high bite track without a high bite shoe. If the flyweights melt the shoe bites the bell at an angle and it cooks itself and throws its guts out on the ground.

Ive gone several races with my Mugen cars using the red shoes and literally ignored the thrust bearings and never had a failure all of last year. So Its not a lube issue its a heat issue.
Motorman, are you saying that running the 710 clutch using the MTX3 hard silver springs is good?
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Old 05-08-2004, 06:01 PM   #9839
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Only with a high bite Red Rulon AR shoe and weighted flyweights.
It wont work with the stock shoe. you could use weighted and non weighted flyweights with it depending on how you like it. The red shoe slips less reducing clutch bell heat. because of this the engagement point needs to be higher to eliminate low speed bog and by the time you get the stock spring adjusted into the window it is almost bottomed in coil bind.

If you don't have the shoe you could use glens setup with the yellow serpent shoe.

I will have a hundred red shoes finished next thursday.
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Old 05-08-2004, 06:20 PM   #9840
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Quote:
Originally posted by Motorman
Only with a high bite Red Rulon AR shoe and weighted flyweights.
It wont work with the stock shoe. you could use weighted and non weighted flyweights with it depending on how you like it. The red shoe slips less reducing clutch bell heat. because of this the engagement point needs to be higher to eliminate low speed bog and by the time you get the stock spring adjusted into the window it is almost bottomed in coil bind.

If you don't have the shoe you could use glens setup with the yellow serpent shoe.

I will have a hundred red shoes finished next thursday.
Ah I see ... thanks for the clarifications!
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