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Old 06-23-2002, 07:37 PM   #796
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I'll tell you what guys,

If you see me on the podium at cincy, you know it was the car!!!!

I'll be there Tues. so I'll shoot reports on over to ya all
!!!!
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Old 06-23-2002, 08:50 PM   #797
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See ya guys Tues morn

We had a good last race Sat. Blackstock TQ,d 13 5:20, Eli 5:21 Me 3rd 12 5:01, Connely 4th and Doseck 5th. Connely won the main, I was 2nd and Jesse Robbers 3rd.

Fastest run on the track has been from Josh, Blackstock, Rott and Eli - all right around 13 5:20. I predict we will see a 13 5:10 maybe lower at the nats. A 23 second lap is really good but 24,s are the norm.
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Old 06-24-2002, 06:28 AM   #798
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woody,

thanks for the update...look us up when ypu get there...red RV, boys from KS...we'll give ya a burger!!!!
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Old 06-24-2002, 08:29 AM   #799
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you got a deal - Kansas
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Old 06-24-2002, 08:51 AM   #800
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Talking Yaahooooo!!!

Hey guys,

Ran my NTC3 for the second time yesterday and with some luck and clean runs- I TQ'd both heats and won the A-main!!! YAAHHOOO!!!

But, I still fought an on power push and a small lack of high speed steering. I did what I could do before the main, but in the end, I think some more thought on tire choice, diffs and sway bars may solve it.

Man does this car have great brakes!!! You can turn and brake hard at the same time, at least with two diffs!!!

I'll post set-up and some description of track so y'all can help me out!!!

Ray
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Old 06-24-2002, 09:14 AM   #801
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Ray - run your diffs just like the book - 1/4 out in front and 1/2 in back. Maybe jst a bit tighter. Do not - and I say do not - spend your hard earned money on one ways and solid rear axle. Yea I know some guys swear by it - but it is not worth the effort for the gain. Yea ya might go into the corners harder but you got 1/2 the brakes. Nobody down hear at the Cinci track has been successful except for Josh and he has always run it that way and is used to it ( in a belt car - which slows down faster). Not good in a TC3 - which doesnt slow down (hence apears to push).

Run a softer front spring and lower the front 1/2 mm more than the back. Yellow and red springs work well down here.
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Old 06-24-2002, 10:12 AM   #802
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Arrow Woody-Hey there!!!

Woody-hello-Good luck this weekend!!! I'll be rooting for you!! BTW-I am running Masters next year. Need to fill the last spot in the N-Main they told me!!! hahaha!!!!


Excellent advice!!! This is my firstGTS car-so its all new to me!!!


Track is a 1/8th style track. Large sweepers and slow switchbacks. A little of everything. Bumpy sealed asphalt with traction compound. ~200' x 80'

Set-Up.
Front:

Shocks-60 wt with #3 pistons, outer hole on bottom, inside hole on tower. Purple Spring.
1.5 degrees camber (set for tire wear).
1 degree toe out.
Camber link long.
9 degrees Caster
Sway bar set flat.
42 Shore 28mm Ellegis. 2.38" (started day at 2.45")
6mm ride height.
Diff 1/16th out.

Rear.
Shocks-40 wt. with #2 pistons, outer hole on bottom, middle hole on tower. Red Spring.
3 degrees camber (ditto).
1 degree toe in.
Camber link long.
Bud's 0.078 sway bar.
~6.8mm Ride height.
40 Shore Techno grip 30m rears. 2.38" (started day at 2.45")
Diff 1/4 out.
HPI Stratus.

Motor:
Nova Mega EV1 Rear Exhaust with stock gearing. Ran ~ 230 temp. Faster the hotter we got it (245), but ran it a little cooler to be safe. 30% Nitro O'Donnell.

Changes:
Diff changes per Woody. Also-add a tooth to second gear pinion. leave first as is for now.

Run 30mm fronts or try 42 shore rears.
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Old 06-24-2002, 01:18 PM   #803
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The way your front is set it sounds like you are tring to make it push. Go down to yellow springs, 60w with #2 pistons. Move the shocks to the center hole on top - outside on a-arm. Camber and castor OK. Ya remember this is not like elec sedan. Get ready to let off early and roll into the corners and pull it coming out. Dont be afraid to get back into the habit of braking the car when going in - like off-road. When you get back to braking you will be able to run deeper into the turns. Dont be afraid to set in in drag brake if you not used to stabbing the brake. Drag brake is the best cheeter in town !!! When drag braking you just gotta stay into sometimes so the brake isnt used - like a carosell. In elec racing the cars slow down on thier own to make turns - in gas (especially NTC3) they dont - so they seem to push.

See ya at Clevland - I dont whoop me your first year in Master's - I am a lot older - LOL
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Old 06-24-2002, 01:25 PM   #804
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Re reading you post - I run Calandra Tires - not the yellow rim tires - he also has gas rubber - white solid rims. They are 45 fr and 37 rear. Actual durometer readings 52 front and 37 rear. This is a gas rubber like Eligi or the new pro-lines. If at all possible get these over any red, dbl purp, purp ect. Those tires work but dont last as long. Trc is coming out with some also. Calandra's yellow rim tires are typical carpet rubber.

You will probably want more toe in the back - closer to 3 degrees per side.
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Old 06-24-2002, 02:49 PM   #805
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Now some more QQQ??

Woody,

Thanks for the help!!!

Some more questions for you!!!

On the front Spring and piston combo. A stiffer front spring will lead to more steering? #2 pistons I was thinking about anyways due to parking lot tracks (i.e. bumpy).

On the rear toe, I know more rear toe helps car rotate better, but I cannot get it out of my head-MOre rear toe-more push!!! I guess its an electric touring car mentality. Is that what you are proposing by going with more rear toe in? Better rotation around big sweepers?
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Old 06-24-2002, 04:24 PM   #806
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Stiffer front spring = more push. The secret of the game is make the suspension give you the steering not the the front tires being softer or cranking it the radio. Once you get the front steering you need then the backend will probably be loose hence the 3 degree toe in for the rear.

Always remember to make the suspension do the work then your able to tune with tires. Most people try to tune the car with tires without a working suspension. Get the car to turn with 50% or less steering in the radio. Give the chassis room to work. Then when you change tire types you can really feel it.
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Old 06-24-2002, 05:48 PM   #807
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Woody: Good job on the tips and keep it up!!!!!! Yours and my thinking is on the same deal with the let the suspension work instead of the tire deal. I have been working with the CRC foams for over 6 months now and I'm having pretty good results other than tire wear,. I was not and at anytime told about the gas rubber!!! I have only been working with the yellow rim rubber and have finaly found you have to get down in the 35 to 37 shore for the rear to get it the rear really hooked up. I finally got my hands on the white rim rubber and there's diffently a diff. The car now will run almost all day on a set of new rubber verus 1 heat on electric foam. Thanks for the info and keep us posted on the nats, but most of all good luck!!!!!!!!!! Kick some Butt!!!!!!!!!! East Coast Style!!!!!!! BB
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Old 06-24-2002, 09:44 PM   #808
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I have been running this NTC3 for some time now on ruber but it is finally time for foams.I am close to the set up you mentioned Woody but I run the GH chassis on my car.I have been told it takes away from steering by a couple of people.
Have you or anyone else had any experience with this chassis and what help could you give me on a set-up that is with no front one way.(I hate one ways cuz I like brakes)
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Old 06-25-2002, 01:01 AM   #809
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Quote:
Originally posted by Woody
Always remember to make the suspension do the work then your able to tune with tires. Most people try to tune the car with tires without a working suspension. Get the car to turn with 50% or less steering in the radio. Give the chassis room to work. Then when you change tire types you can really feel it.

So does that mean that I put on a set of same compound tires with same inserts to get cranking into this "suspension business?

Or was it the other way around?

I normally starting building my car (remembering my last TC3 electric) with 50wt front & 35wt rear for shock oil. Everything else is stock. Then I will play with the compound of the tires after finishing the assembly of the car and run.

Please help.
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Old 06-25-2002, 08:55 PM   #810
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Talking Set-up

Okay-car is ready for next race!! But I again have another question for the foam tire racers. I usually just set droop by feel and then measure it for the records. But I looked at the standard foam set-up from manual and Barry Bakers droop numbers from Sugar Bowl. Well-someone is lying!!!

I am running 2.35" to 2.45" (62mm) tires and I am at -2 on back and 0 on front using the droop guage. What size tires would you need to run 4 front and rear??? At least 2.55"!!!

If anyone is willing to give away there droop secrets-I'd love to know what droop you foam tires guys are having luck with and at what diameter of tire!!! I usually set car up for a few mm of front uptravel and about 4 to 6mm of rear uptravel. But I may try it with 1mm front and 4mm rear.

Thanks all!!!
Ray
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