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Old 02-22-2002, 07:08 PM   #256
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Originally posted by kansasracer
Just finished the TC3 and I have only one question:

Should I fit the tuned pipe with a pressure fitting? I have never just stuck fuel tubing into a tuned pipe...

Any thoughts?
no problem, follow the instruction. But What I found better is to wrap the tube around the fuel tank, instead of the handle. This is what Barry barker did anyway

I haven't experience with the lenght of the tube yet as this is very different to the V0neR that I used to run. This pipe seem to create a lot more pressure on the fuel tank.

Any thought ??
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Old 02-22-2002, 07:21 PM   #257
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Originally posted by kitracer


no problem, follow the instruction. But What I found better is to wrap the tube around the fuel tank, instead of the handle. This is what Barry barker did anyway

I haven't experience with the lenght of the tube yet as this is very different to the V0neR that I used to run. This pipe seem to create a lot more pressure on the fuel tank.

Any thought ??
in fact this fuel tank has poorly designed as the pressure return fitting is under the top fuel level which will really stir up the fuel. Almost all of the current fuel tank design has the pressure fitting right onthe top of the fuel cap which avoid from the return pressure stirs up the fuel.
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Old 02-22-2002, 07:29 PM   #258
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So what happens when you come in for fuel, your pit guy opens the tank, and your engine goes lean and dies because all the tank pressure just went out the cap? I think it's better to have the pressure from the bottom of the tank. Associated and Losi tanks have been this way for years....and they work just fine.
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Old 02-22-2002, 07:34 PM   #259
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kevin P.
So what happens when you come in for fuel, your pit guy opens the tank, and your engine goes lean and dies because all the tank pressure just went out the cap? I think it's better to have the pressure from the bottom of the tank. Associated and Losi tanks have been this way for years....and they work just fine.
i never experience problem on engine dies when refill the fuel tank on my MTX2 and V1R, provided that the action is not done slowly. However, when I try to refill the NTC3 fuel tank, a lot of fuel goes outside when I open the cap due to high pressure (make the fuel tank act like a washing machine).
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Old 02-22-2002, 07:55 PM   #260
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kevin P.
So what happens when you come in for fuel, your pit guy opens the tank, and your engine goes lean and dies because all the tank pressure just went out the cap? I think it's better to have the pressure from the bottom of the tank. Associated and Losi tanks have been this way for years....and they work just fine.
you need to review your physic on pressure !!
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Old 02-22-2002, 07:58 PM   #261
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Originally posted by ernestf


i never experience problem on engine dies when refill the fuel tank on my MTX2 and V1R, provided that the action is not done slowly. However, when I try to refill the NTC3 fuel tank, a lot of fuel goes outside when I open the cap due to high pressure (make the fuel tank act like a washing machine).
yeah you right, exactly how it looks like when the engine runs.
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Old 02-22-2002, 08:25 PM   #262
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The fuel isn't going out of the tank because of the pressure...it's because of the vibration. My 1/8 scale does the same thing...and the pressure line is on the cap. Unhook your pressure line and open the tank...I bet you'll still have fuel coming out.

And to review my "physic" on pressure....what happens to the pressure in the tank when you open the cap? Where does the pressure go? If the pressure is coming from the top side, like if you have the pressure line on the cap, and you open the lid...what happens to the tank pressure? It doesn't just sit there and wait for you to close the cap...it goes right out the hole! And what happens to the fuel flow when the pressure goes away...it slows down. And what happens when it slows down? The engine leans out.

If the pressure is coming from the bottom of the tank, when you open the cap, what happens to the pressure? Nothing. The fuel flow stays constant. The engine tune doesn't change. Don't believe me? It's easy to check...try blowing through the pressure line with the tank closed...fuel flows out the carb. supply line. Open the tank and see what happens. With the pressure line on the cap, fuel flow stops. With the pressure line as it is...the flow doesn't change.
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Old 02-22-2002, 09:09 PM   #263
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kevin P.
The fuel isn't going out of the tank because of the pressure...it's because of the vibration. My 1/8 scale does the same thing...and the pressure line is on the cap. Unhook your pressure line and open the tank...I bet you'll still have fuel coming out.

And to review my "physic" on pressure....what happens to the pressure in the tank when you open the cap? Where does the pressure go? If the pressure is coming from the top side, like if you have the pressure line on the cap, and you open the lid...what happens to the tank pressure? It doesn't just sit there and wait for you to close the cap...it goes right out the hole! And what happens to the fuel flow when the pressure goes away...it slows down. And what happens when it slows down? The engine leans out.

If the pressure is coming from the bottom of the tank, when you open the cap, what happens to the pressure? Nothing. The fuel flow stays constant. The engine tune doesn't change. Don't believe me? It's easy to check...try blowing through the pressure line with the tank closed...fuel flows out the carb. supply line. Open the tank and see what happens. With the pressure line on the cap, fuel flow stops. With the pressure line as it is...the flow doesn't change.
buddy...you need to get your physics straighten out!! how could the fuel come out when theres a pressure nipple on top of the tank?? it doesnt force pressure into the fuel but ontop of the fuel...no fuel is going to come out when you open the lid!! the pressure is just going to escape!! and the fuel would stay where it is!! and as for the fuel not going into the carb if no pressure is going into the tank...that is wrong too!! when fuel is being burnt inside the engine..it creats a vacuum because the fuel turns into exhaust and out the pipe!! that vacuum would just suck in the fuel!!

as for the NTC3...the fuel tank is like any other AE fuel tank..the pressure goes right into the fuel...just like a air pump in water!! it bubbles up the fuel...spashing it everywhere....and when you open the cap...the fuel is going to go everywhere because of the air being pumped into the fuel!!

i dunno about your 1/8 scale tank...but i think you fitting an AE tank in your car cuz it would never happen when you have a pressure going in from the lid!!
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Old 02-22-2002, 09:12 PM   #264
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kevin P.
So what happens when you come in for fuel, your pit guy opens the tank, and your engine goes lean and dies because all the tank pressure just went out the cap? I think it's better to have the pressure from the bottom of the tank. Associated and Losi tanks have been this way for years....and they work just fine.
and y did everyone...even the ppl from RCCA that supports losi and AE suggests the readers to change the postion of the pressure nipple to the top of lid??
because fuel does splash everywhere when you open the lid! ruining your paint job...your receivers!!
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Old 02-22-2002, 09:13 PM   #265
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kevin P.
The fuel isn't going out of the tank because of the pressure...it's because of the vibration. My 1/8 scale does the same thing...and the pressure line is on the cap. Unhook your pressure line and open the tank...I bet you'll still have fuel coming out.

And to review my "physic" on pressure....what happens to the pressure in the tank when you open the cap? Where does the pressure go? If the pressure is coming from the top side, like if you have the pressure line on the cap, and you open the lid...what happens to the tank pressure? It doesn't just sit there and wait for you to close the cap...it goes right out the hole! And what happens to the fuel flow when the pressure goes away...it slows down. And what happens when it slows down? The engine leans out.

If the pressure is coming from the bottom of the tank, when you open the cap, what happens to the pressure? Nothing. The fuel flow stays constant. The engine tune doesn't change. Don't believe me? It's easy to check...try blowing through the pressure line with the tank closed...fuel flows out the carb. supply line. Open the tank and see what happens. With the pressure line on the cap, fuel flow stops. With the pressure line as it is...the flow doesn't change.
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Old 02-22-2002, 09:19 PM   #266
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Quote:
Originally posted by Disaster999


and y did everyone...even the ppl from RCCA that supports losi and AE suggests the readers to change the postion of the pressure nipple to the top of lid??
because fuel does splash everywhere when you open the lid! ruining your paint job...your receivers!!
i think it is his freedom to do whatever he wants. for example, he like to desmonstrate his theory by BLOWing the tubing !

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Old 02-22-2002, 09:25 PM   #267
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and kevin...lemmie tell you one more thing about air pressure!! *hehhehe...throwing my school bag around!!*

AIR PRESSURE IS LIGHTER THAN THE FUEL....KEVIN...ARE YOU SUPRISED? theres a great deal of pressure going into the tank because where the pressure nipple is located on the pipe is where the pressure is the greatest!! its going to turn the fuel, like ernest said, like a washing machine!!

take about physics....i wander where did all yours go!
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Old 02-22-2002, 09:34 PM   #268
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Ok...if you think you're right..that's cool. But reread what I said. I said the fuel flow slows down if you have no tank pressure. I didn't say it would stop. You can run your car with no tank pressure at all, because like you say, the engine creates a vacuum, and the fuel will flow. You'll have to retune it to run correctly without any pressure, but it will run just fine. As for the fuel splashing out when you open the lid.....that happens on any nitro car, regardless of where the presure line is. Open the tank and rev up the engine. What happens? Fuel splashes out. Now how do you suppose that happens if the pressure line is on the cap? It's not the exhaust pressure blowing it out. Right? So what is it? If you guys think the small amount of pressure coming from the presure line is enough to blow fuel out of the tank...well....I obviously am not going to change your minds. But that's alright...a friendly debate is fun sometimes. Kinda makes you wonder how Associated can engineer such an awesome car as the NTC3, but "overlook" this tank issue.
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Old 02-22-2002, 09:34 PM   #269
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kevin P.
The fuel isn't going out of the tank because of the pressure...it's because of the vibration. My 1/8 scale does the same thing...and the pressure line is on the cap. Unhook your pressure line and open the tank...I bet you'll still have fuel coming out.

And to review my "physic" on pressure....what happens to the pressure in the tank when you open the cap? Where does the pressure go? If the pressure is coming from the top side, like if you have the pressure line on the cap, and you open the lid...what happens to the tank pressure? It doesn't just sit there and wait for you to close the cap...it goes right out the hole! And what happens to the fuel flow when the pressure goes away...it slows down. And what happens when it slows down? The engine leans out.

If the pressure is coming from the bottom of the tank, when you open the cap, what happens to the pressure? Nothing. The fuel flow stays constant. The engine tune doesn't change. Don't believe me? It's easy to check...try blowing through the pressure line with the tank closed...fuel flows out the carb. supply line. Open the tank and see what happens. With the pressure line on the cap, fuel flow stops. With the pressure line as it is...the flow doesn't change.
I must say this claim is interesting. The way the pressure in fuel tank works is like this. It is a sealed container with two "holes". One hole supplied a pressure from the pipe (which is not constant it is pulsing) and the other hole has a small natural suction drawing fuel from it because of the natural drawing effect of the carburetor. The pressure from the pipe gets into the tank and the medium is air plus a mixture of the exhaust vapours. This is being "jammed" into the tank. Since the medium is a vapour it will rise to the top of the tank, where there is an "air" gap, and actually apply a downwards force to the top of the liquid, the fuel. This downward force then forces the liquid finds a hole (the fuel line opening at the bottom of the tank) in which to escape. This is what forces the fuel through the fuel line, in partnership with the natural drawing from the engine.

Now if you think about it, the source of the input pressure is irelevant as the downward force comes from the "air gap" at the top of the tank anyhow, irrespective of where the pressure enters. So when you open the tank, whoosh out it goes, no matter where it comes in from.

So the associated tank design is not superior in any way IMHO. But you can do your washing and race at the same time
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Old 02-22-2002, 09:36 PM   #270
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kevin P.
Ok...if you think you're right..that's cool. But reread what I said. I said the fuel flow slows down if you have no tank pressure. I didn't say it would stop. You can run your car with no tank pressure at all, because like you say, the engine creates a vacuum, and the fuel will flow. You'll have to retune it to run correctly without any pressure, but it will run just fine. As for the fuel splashing out when you open the lid.....that happens on any nitro car, regardless of where the presure line is. Open the tank and rev up the engine. What happens? Fuel splashes out. Now how do you suppose that happens if the pressure line is on the cap? It's not the exhaust pressure blowing it out. Right? So what is it? If you guys think the small amount of pressure coming from the presure line is enough to blow fuel out of the tank...well....I obviously am not going to change your minds. But that's alright...a friendly debate is fun sometimes. Kinda makes you wonder how Associated can engineer such an awesome car as the NTC3, but "overlook" this tank issue.
i am not going to diss ASS o. but obviously you are giving too much expectation on your NTC3.....
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