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Old 10-30-2002, 11:30 AM   #1696
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Default Re: Sirio 12TRP

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Originally posted by tomato
Hi Corse-R, is your new Sirio a 5port turbo or 3 port?? Might get one of those if the performance is good.....
Is the 3 port version. Disassembled and cleaned completely, ready to bolt on my NTC3. Sirio 12 3port seemed to be a good performer (in words of some people is a complete nightmare for MT12 and Nova S3 owners.... )
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Old 10-30-2002, 08:29 PM   #1697
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Anyone try a oneway on their ntc3? How does it handle compared with the ball diffs?
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Old 10-31-2002, 12:14 AM   #1698
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Quote:
Originally posted by WeatherB
Anyone try a oneway on their ntc3? How does it handle compared with the ball diffs?
The main and most important handling difference that you notice is a much quicker off-power steering when entering the turns and some kind of understeering when going out the turns (not as much as when you install solid axle on front) and other more important: the lack of front braking action when you yank the brakes.

Beware about this, I have seen many people a pretty 360º slide before entering a turn because it pushed so much the brakes. Removing almost all of them (I adjusted the brake dual rate to a 30% on my Mars) or just a little of drag brake to help to being accustomed to it (beware on overheating the disk).

Yesterday I did some testing with solid axle in front. I didn't went to a much extensive testing, but got massive traction coming out the turns (with a massive understeering on all the turn sections). Anyone can give their feedback or confirm this about solid axle on front? Seemed that need extensive suspension tunning rather than a quick swap.
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Old 10-31-2002, 10:49 AM   #1699
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Quote:
Originally posted by Corse-R
The main and most important handling difference that you notice is a much quicker off-power steering when entering the turns and some kind of understeering when going out the turns (not as much as when you install solid axle on front) and other more important: the lack of front braking action when you yank the brakes.

Beware about this, I have seen many people a pretty 360º slide before entering a turn because it pushed so much the brakes. Removing almost all of them (I adjusted the brake dual rate to a 30% on my Mars) or just a little of drag brake to help to being accustomed to it (beware on overheating the disk).

Yesterday I did some testing with solid axle in front. I didn't went to a much extensive testing, but got massive traction coming out the turns (with a massive understeering on all the turn sections). Anyone can give their feedback or confirm this about solid axle on front? Seemed that need extensive suspension tunning rather than a quick swap.
Concerning one way front diffs, yes, they are tricky. Most of the time, your car tweak needs to be set right. ANY slight irregularities in the car tweak will be greatly amplified when using one way front diffs.

This is where the braking action and throttle / brake servo endpoints need to be adjusted so that the brakes are set mild enough not to get the rear wheels locking. Just enough brakes to make the car stop. Then again, driving styles need to change i.e. earlier braking etc.

Most of the time, to offset the sensitive behaviour of the one way front diff, a rear solid axle combination is often used. It somehow makes the car more forgiving to drive with a one way front diff installed. Else, you can opt for very tight rear diff action.

A tighter rear diff or a solid rear axle will enable you to dial in more brakes on the rear wheels of the car. However, not to the extent you would dial in brakes for a car equipped with a solid front axle or a car euipped with a front diff. The car will stop better and still track in a straight line without the rear end swapping when used with a front one way diff provided there is no tweak in the car.

With regards to solid front axle, yes, you need to alter the front suspension just as you would if you use a front one way diff. You need to set the shocks softer to increase front traction in order to compensate for the lack of front grip and steering. Whereas if you use one way front diff, it's the opposite. You would want to dial out the excessive steering but putting stiffer front springs or a front sway bar.

Putting it simply, the one way has the benefits of the solid front axle as you get lots of on power steering but DOES NOT have the front solid axle's downfall which is lack of steering. But as you are aware, you don't get the benefits of 4WD braking with one way front diff.
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Old 10-31-2002, 11:05 AM   #1700
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Hey guys, quick question about cutting the manifold. After you guys trim it, do you put it all the way back into the muffled (like suggested in the manual) or do just put it into the coupler and tighten it down? I can't see there being a benefit unless you put it all the way into the muffler, but I just wanted to double check. Thanks.
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Old 10-31-2002, 11:34 AM   #1701
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Default Re: 5 tooth split???

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Originally posted by Corse-R
This weekend I used my RB X12 and needed some advice from yours (if anyone is using them (I suppose...).

20/26 with 54/48 were too short on the first and the second went ok. 21/27 with 54/48 was good on the first and a little large on the second and don't get all the rpm's that should get. Tried to adjust too the shifting but none helped (I'm a little p*ssed...).

Anyone has tried with a 5 tooth split? planning to test 21/26.

Another: I got a brand new sirio 12TRP, anyone use it? just looking other motors rather than JP12's (too expensive to rebuild).
Mark Pavadis used the 21/27 with 54/48 combination with the Rody tuned RB if I'm not mistaken.

Rody Roem noticed that other cars besides the NTC3 seemed to be able to run at higher engine RPMs than what you get when you put the same engine in an NTC3.

It seems that the problem lies in the stock manifold/pipe that it cannot be shortened enough to achive high engine RPMs. He said that to solve this problem, playing around with the right gear-ratio is what is probably needed on the NTC3.
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Old 10-31-2002, 11:37 AM   #1702
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Quote:
Originally posted by bbntc3
Corse-R: My rod also should have been changed around 1.5 gallon of fuel but I pushed it to the limit!, well alittle over the limit I got lucky, crank was ok for another rebuild. RB knows their stuff, rod change in the x12 by the manual is supposed to be changed every 5 litres of fuel.
1.5 gallon is a little excessive I think. Just a personal opinion. But some drivers in Japan change the conrod right after break in !!
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Old 10-31-2002, 11:59 AM   #1703
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Quote:
Originally posted by Aeon Racer
Hey guys, quick question about cutting the manifold. After you guys trim it, do you put it all the way back into the muffled (like suggested in the manual) or do just put it into the coupler and tighten it down? I can't see there being a benefit unless you put it all the way into the muffler, but I just wanted to double check. Thanks.
On normal cars (not NTC3), I'm told that when you cut to shorten the muffler, never insert the muffler end back into the pipe.

Even if you didn't cut it, never put the muffler into the pipe. Leave a gap and let the silicone coupler be the join for both the muffler and the pipe.

It could be different on the NTC3...
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Old 10-31-2002, 12:45 PM   #1704
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Nope, it's the same.

The metal-to-metal contact will cause MAD glitching
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Old 11-02-2002, 09:43 AM   #1705
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Default Re: Re: 5 tooth split???

Quote:
Originally posted by InitialD
It seems that the problem lies in the stock manifold/pipe that it cannot be shortened enough to achive high engine RPMs. He said that to solve this problem, playing around with the right gear-ratio is what is probably needed on the NTC3.
Uhm... seemed that AE guys were running the O'Donnell RB, who, frankly is quite different to the 1700-210 model.

I tried this motor and found a massive low end, but needed more punch at high rpms, this is why I asked if someone has tested a 5 tooth split on their NTC3... Is quite strange b/c a 'stock' Novarrosi S3 worked flawlessly with the same config and manifold/pipe.

Tomorrow I'll continue the break-in of the Sirio, what I've seen by the moment promises good...
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Old 11-02-2002, 06:50 PM   #1706
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I followed the manual, against conventional wisdom, and ran my manifold completely inserted all season. I didn't have any problems with glitching. I have a hard time believing you can't get enough rpm out of this pipe combo if you cut the manifold. I ran MT-12's, and JP's all season and they screamed with 1/2" removed and the manifold completely inserted. I also tried both team pipes, and ended up sticking with the dual chamber.
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Old 11-02-2002, 06:51 PM   #1707
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Here's a sample of cut & non-cut.
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File Type: jpg mods 004.jpg (50.0 KB, 168 views)
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Old 11-02-2002, 06:52 PM   #1708
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Here's an "inside" shot, ported & non-ported.
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Old 11-02-2002, 07:37 PM   #1709
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I have plenty of RPM, so that wasn't my problem. Anyhoo, I ended up just doing as the manual said and inserted the manifold all the way into the pipe after cutting about 1/4" off. It ran it fine last night with no glitching what so ever and PLENTY of low end power now. It really is amazing how much of a difference it makes vs the stock manifold. I think I'll try porting the manifold as soon as I can get my hands on a dremel.

I was thinking about doing some sleeve modding, but I'm a little afraid to do anything to this engine. It's already ballistically fast, and now with the cut manifold, it almost perfect. I'll probably stray away from hacking away at the sleeve for now, and just wait till the motor is scrap and then try playing with it. I'll just get that CrazyNut Racing head and just leave the car be from then on.
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Old 11-02-2002, 08:44 PM   #1710
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nice...I've finished racing 2 tc3s for 5 months in NJ,the cars keep geting better and better,Arash is gone,and even though HPI''s paranoia has gotten rid of their forum,we have a great forum here..does life get any better?....


BTW,new issue of extreme has Pavidis's car in it......and all the little mods he made....and to think you can buy a world championship car for 270.......
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