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Old 08-08-2006, 04:01 PM   #10696
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Reasons why I changed to mugen mtx-3 clutch system.

1. I got tired of filing down flywheel pins.

2. I hated that my clutch setting would fluctuate.

3. I would either slip or finally get good engagement, only to find it would change a few qualifiers later or rev way to high to be useful.

4. Always seemed like a bunch of shims everywhere, that like to crush at the wrong times or fly away.

5. Always having to ream a mugen shoe and notice how it was still funky fitment.

I set out to buy a bunch of new clutches for my cars and engines and I said screw it and went all mugen. Best choice ever.

I get nice hard engagement at low rpm. Its almost like something people said you couldnt have. Before I had even lower rpm engagement on the r40 clutch once I changed to the GS racing spring....but it was just too low and didnt give a good enough snap to get the car going. Otherwise the R40 with the stock spring just couldnt get me the low rpm engagement I wanted. It was more setup for some insanely fast high grip track or something.

I also know more people work with the mugen clutch so like amg has said you can borrow settings a little bit more and its just more of a standard. You can snag CRF clutch settings where If I wanted to run my new team orion motor I would have to guess around and hope I could come up with something similiar...even though the r40 doesnt even offer a different clutch shoe. So I would need to pray to the hpi gods that I could get the clutch engagement I wanted by adjusting a few shims or the clutch tension screw.

Where as the mugen , I have 3-4 shoes to choose from as well as 1-2 different springs. Its just much more tunable and a more superior system. I could tell right off the bat with really not a care for the shims I just slapped on a few here and there. Put in a yellow shoe , put it in the car and wow , best clutch engagement ive ever seen. Low Enough for smaller blips to get you going , hits hard and consistent. So to me it was a step up and I havent even begun to play with it , probably wont really , its great and I have a feeling its not just a lucky setup. I played with hundreds on the r40 and it just never felt right.
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Old 08-08-2006, 04:13 PM   #10697
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Interesting topic. When I ran my MTX4 last weekend it was hands down far more punchy than I ever was able to get my R40. I am not really sure why that is yet, I am still doing some investigation of final drive ratios and the like. The MTX4 uses a different internal gear ratio, and the clutch bell is a little smaller and lighter than the MTX3. I will post my findings on the FDR when I get them, I suspect it is mainly a gear ratio thing.

For the R40, the MTX3 clutch is the way to go for sure.
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Old 08-08-2006, 04:20 PM   #10698
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Yeah every mtx-3 / 4 I see just has this nice punchy snap to them. I always was jealous. I knew pretty much right it was the clutch.

Ive got my car on some super small pinoin gears the 0 and 5. Its definently much faster and on 59mm tires.

I would have gotten TQ , but did pull a lap about 1 second under everyone in my class this time around.

I think one reason why the r40 isnt punchy as the mugen could be possibly the flyweights , since they are lw on the r40 where the stock mugen runs them full. Theres also a few other elements and it seems just high quality on the mugen side which allows for just smoother more consistent action.

I found out the holes are meant for tuning though , so you can screw in some set screws to increase weight. But I was just fed up with the r40 clutch. I felt dumb trying to adjust it. As soon as I got the mugen I felt like what I was trying all along was right and I was smart again , the r40 doesnt function right in my eyes.
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Old 08-08-2006, 04:49 PM   #10699
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I'm going to remove that tension spring on the flywheel weights/shoes and bore them out to see how it'd respond. Most other centax clutches don't use that small round spring.
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Old 08-08-2006, 04:55 PM   #10700
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I tried it , couldnt notice much. I think its meant for pulling it back into the system. I just got tired of dealing with it and buying new ones. Left it out , never noticed a difference and it was cheaper.

Also hpi doesnt sell clutch kits , which was another thing that bothered me. If im going to buy a whole new clutch I want a bulk price and easy package to buy. Not go on a hunt and pay full retail price for every little bit and piece.

Yeah glad Im using the mugen clutch now. I can almost gurantee your times will improve in using one. Maybe a statement some think wont hold true 100%, but I bet its close.

Your r40 will feel much more....pro like.
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Old 08-08-2006, 05:30 PM   #10701
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Also while im here Ill post about my weekend.

Im now testing out the skyline VR12 plus pipe. So far very good. Highly durable , great price and probably the best power ive seen. All around probably the best pipe you can find. You can goto any track and perform well, since this pipe offers great torque and high rpm. It may not make the higest of them all, but its close enough and the good powerband it creates its just a great pipe. Ill be running this one all year for sure.

First time out with the hara edition. WOW , what car is this? I couldnt believe how it was handling. Not sure why but It was serious now, no playing around anymore. I noticed mid to low turns Id have to back off of steering since it was so direct feeling now. Just grabs into the turns much harder. Seemed much more precise , backed off the steering exp on the radio and it felt real nice. Normally I would just hold onto the wheel and hope for front grip , this time there was more than enough. Car was more on its toes , yet after a few laps got acustom to the r40 that was now in my hands and then proceeded to shred the guys who were giving me trouble last month.

Also this was the first time with the mugen clutch. Again another big positive for the car. Just gave that review on the posts above.

All in all my car is running amazing and weighs a few grams over legal weight. I just need to focus on my driving more now and hone my tuning skills.

But Im happy with the performance of my hpi and will be sticking with it.
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Old 08-08-2006, 06:29 PM   #10702
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artificial-I
First time out with the hara edition. WOW , what car is this? I couldnt believe how it was handling. Not sure why but It was serious now, no playing around anymore. I noticed mid to low turns Id have to back off of steering since it was so direct feeling now. Just grabs into the turns much harder. Seemed much more precise , backed off the steering exp on the radio and it felt real nice. Normally I would just hold onto the wheel and hope for front grip , this time there was more than enough. Car was more on its toes , yet after a few laps got acustom to the r40 that was now in my hands and then proceeded to shred the guys who were giving me trouble last month.
Told ya the Hara rocked it out huh :-) I love the handling of the Hara version. I found the MTX4 in stock form was a little more "hyper" than the Hara. The Hara drives really smooth and predictable, I really liked the way it felt. The Mugen has much more urge to it, dives into the corners, rotates hard and accelerates hard, but it has a far less smooth feel than the HPI. I suspect I will be faster with the Mugen in the end as it seems to enable more steering while gripping with the rear, but so far I am faster with the Hara.
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Old 08-08-2006, 06:53 PM   #10703
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Thanks for the great info guys. Looks like i'm going to be switching to the Mugen clutch. Is it a direct fit? Any modding whatsoever? Also, if you guys have the part # that would be great.

I'm planning to race the R40 or at least do small group practices to get my skills back from racing electric 1/10 TC so long. Is the R40 competitive at all in stock form? I heard when it was released, it was way too heavy. What parts from the Hara kit should I buy?

Thanks
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Old 08-08-2006, 10:55 PM   #10704
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hey guys.....umm couple questions..... does it matter if its the mtx 3 or mtx4 clutch system??? are they both the same???.....do the same hpi .8 M pinions still fit and work with the HPI spurs????........about how much is the mugen kit?

thanks

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Old 08-09-2006, 12:42 AM   #10705
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AMGRacer
Told ya the Hara rocked it out huh :-) I love the handling of the Hara version. I found the MTX4 in stock form was a little more "hyper" than the Hara. The Hara drives really smooth and predictable, I really liked the way it felt. The Mugen has much more urge to it, dives into the corners, rotates hard and accelerates hard, but it has a far less smooth feel than the HPI. I suspect I will be faster with the Mugen in the end as it seems to enable more steering while gripping with the rear, but so far I am faster with the Hara.
Hi AMG
Are you going to the worlds?

Cheers

Brett
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Old 08-09-2006, 02:03 AM   #10706
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Quote:
Originally Posted by factory racer
hey guys.....umm couple questions..... does it matter if its the mtx 3 or mtx4 clutch system??? are they both the same???.....do the same hpi .8 M pinions still fit and work with the HPI spurs????........about how much is the mugen kit?

thanks

mike
I got the mugen kit for like $48. The MTX4 kit is fine EXCEPT for the clutchbell and bearings. ONLY the MTX3 clutchbell fits, so the MTX3 kit is the best option, or MTX4 kit + MTX3 clutchbell.

It fits pretty well, the pinions dont quite fully engage the spurs, but I never had any problems.
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Old 08-09-2006, 02:06 AM   #10707
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brett.w
Hi AMG
Are you going to the worlds?

Cheers

Brett
I will be there on the weekend, I cant afford to take the week off as I am a contractor. I would lose way too much money, and would probably finish 150th anyway!! I will be there to watch the finals tho.
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Old 08-09-2006, 06:00 AM   #10708
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AMGRacer
I got the mugen kit for like $48. The MTX4 kit is fine EXCEPT for the clutchbell and bearings. ONLY the MTX3 clutchbell fits, so the MTX3 kit is the best option, or MTX4 kit + MTX3 clutchbell.

It fits pretty well, the pinions dont quite fully engage the spurs, but I never had any problems.
Did you shave the engine mounting holes a tad to get better fitment. I tried this a little and it helped. I saw you mention this.

But now that you say you cant get them full engaged. Do you mean like where you want them or they should be. I have mind kinda weird but it seems to be going ok. Allthough there is some funky stuff showing up on my spur gears.

Im going to try shaving the holes more , but do you think the shape of clutchbell could be making it impossible. I figure on the same center axis with the same r40 gears it should be able to match perfectly into the spur , just not perhaps tooth to tooth with each other , but depth wise into each other they should be fine right?
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Old 08-10-2006, 12:38 PM   #10709
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AI- this review is based on the 05 Hara right?
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Old 08-10-2006, 01:04 PM   #10710
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Yeah the 05 hara kit + my previous upgrades on my 04 kit and the extra 04 goodies ti screws and engine mount.
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