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Old 04-12-2006, 08:15 AM   #10036
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anyone have a part number for the grey and yellow mugen shoes?? (damn, I just want everything don't I )
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Old 04-12-2006, 08:42 AM   #10037
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Grey - # MUGH0765
Yellow - # MUGH0773
Red - #MUGH0769
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Old 04-12-2006, 08:44 AM   #10038
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Also remember guys on the mugen discs. Youll need to enlarge and adjust the holes a tad to get it to move smoothly on the HPI 4 flywheel shafts.
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Old 04-12-2006, 08:46 AM   #10039
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artificial-I
Grey - # MUGH0765
Yellow - # MUGH0773
Red - #MUGH0769
thank you, kind sir
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Old 04-12-2006, 07:14 PM   #10040
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Hey guys. Little update on a few things. I swapped my new AI Modified motor in the car tonight. Its my new d3r that Ive done an actual hard tweak to the crank Ill let you know how it runs vs stock.

I then went and got a full setup so I can swap motors very quickly in a race or otherwise. Motor mounts , flywheel , clutch , gears etc. Well this time I went to build the clutch and I figured I would use the black shoe from hpi. Since its given me trouble before. I sometimes like to conquer problems that Ive had. Just to do it. I also find this helps me learn more things about the car and helps point me in the right direction of whats wrong.

Well anyways it seems to be the lowest engagement ive gotten yet. Which is what a lot of us are striving for , heck a lot of us would be good with a medium to low....but I just cant stand getting on the throttle and just hearing the car rev real high and go no where.

Well Ive been reading the mytsn section over and over and over. This time I came back to it and its been said before. But why the heck does hpi put the shims behind the thrust bearing rather than in front of it?

Well I said screw it and just went for the mytsn style. Next instead of adjusting the stupid thing on the car. When assembling I went and loosened it as much as possible. What you want to look at is the screw , as soon as it shows up past the clutch adjuster nut. You stop. I then place a bearing on there to verify its not going to touch. I then this time put a shim on that spot to prevent it from rubbing.

Next. I kept adding shims , until it seems the gap wasnt decreasing. So Ive heard of this before but its not really right in my eyes or not explanitory enough.

But I then went and took the whole thing completely off and removed the flywheel. Then grabbed the hpi collet and used that instead of the one included with the motor. I then even placed another shim behind the collet to see if this helped.

I then went and reassambled the clutch again and this time used the same shims that were in it before and tada. The gap was reduced and it just felt very right.

Now I havent driven it on track but its spinning the wheels on the box at a much lower rpm and it sounds right for once. Its very nice to hear this.

I also went and installed the spool. Well see how it is to actually drive the car with brakes now...never done that before. LOL. I have the 2004 which includes the one-way so Ive never swapped....but it seems like its ready to go.

I also got 4 digital scales and went and checked tweak with my previous motor on and it was nearly perfect left to right.

But here is a quick list of how to get your r40 clutch right.

Step #1 - Trim flywheel posts to hide under the clutch shoe , not poke out.
Step #2 - Use hpi flywheel collet , I think it just gives you the correct spacing.
Step #3 - Make sure the clutch shoe can move up and down easily on the flywheel posts. Especially watch this if you use the mugen shoes.
Step #4 - Set the clutch adjuster screw as far out as possible , use a shim on top of it.
Step #5 - Make the gap (wobble back and forth) as close as possible.

Then go from there. Ive had success with also scaring up the CB and clutch pads. But this time didnt do it and I have a feeling you probably dont need to if its done right.
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Old 04-12-2006, 10:43 PM   #10041
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What servo's are you guys using in your R40? I am using a stock Airtronic's servo for the throttle and I am having troubles getting it set up correctly. When ever i touch the trigger on the Radio its seems like it goes to full throttle instantly and not smoothly. I tried changing the End Point Adjustments but that didn't seem to help much. Any suggestions? I am using a Airtronic's MX-3S. Thanks.

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Old 04-14-2006, 06:56 PM   #10042
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You must have a fast servo and no way to slow the servo speed. If you want slower movement though you would rely on your finger to get it to move slower. If your slamming full throttle and its moving quick , its actually kind of a good thing. You want it to follow quickly.

Also a little update. I ran the r40 some, seems like the black hpi pad is giving its classic signs. Slipping at first , then finally catching. Dont really understand this. Ive got almost zero gap. Ah well , Ill get it one day.

I might snag some video on the next run just for fun. Found a real nice spot by my house to do testing and break-in. Suprisingly looks like it didnt even get dirty.
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Old 04-16-2006, 04:03 AM   #10043
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I think AMG really hit the nail on the head. The black HPI clutch shoe just isn't soft enough for higher bite surfaces. I notice it on my car if I take it to the local permanent track. It just seems soft off the line. When I go back to parking lot racing though its fine.

Haven't been around for a week. Spent 6 days in the big apple and 3 days in Boston. Saturday I rented a car and drove up into maine for lobster and drove right by RC Madness and stopped in to look. I should have tried to find other racing while I was out there, but had a full schedule.
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Old 04-16-2006, 02:44 PM   #10044
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rapid Roy
I think AMG really hit the nail on the head. The black HPI clutch shoe just isn't soft enough for higher bite surfaces. I notice it on my car if I take it to the local permanent track. It just seems soft off the line. When I go back to parking lot racing though its fine.

Haven't been around for a week. Spent 6 days in the big apple and 3 days in Boston. Saturday I rented a car and drove up into maine for lobster and drove right by RC Madness and stopped in to look. I should have tried to find other racing while I was out there, but had a full schedule.
Yeah I have played with this badboy for ages (probably about 16 hours of just clutch tuning at the track) as well as enlisting the help of our local fast guys. The final verdict was the black HPI pad just wont work when you have decent grip and you want bottom end rip. Hara went to a Mugen grey shoe in 2004.

The easiest fix is simply getting a Mugen Grey shoe. I used that on a stock R40 clutch for 1 year or so with perfect results.

In fact I was seriously struggling to get the Mugen Yellow to have bottom end rip, seems that even it is tough to get decent bite out of when grip is high enough.

Here is a quick tuning guide for the R40 clutch from my research:

Clutch adjuster nut with stock spring, .7mm for low RPM engagement, 1.4mm is about as high as you can go without spring bind.

You can go as low as 0.3mm on the clutchgap, and up to perhaps around 0.8mm or mayby 1mm. At 1mm your bearings take a beating, over 0.5mm you want to try and reduce endplay as much as possible. Remember clutchgap is super important to how much bite your clutch can achieve. With clutchgaps of 0.3mm to 0.5mm you clutch shoe does not have enough time to accelerate and increase biting force, hence when it hits you get the classic, slip and bite, or "sobbing" noise from the clutch if you are trying for a relativly high RPM engagement. Remember Force = mass * acceleration. To increase bite force when the shoe hits the bell you need a greater acceleration of the pressure plate.
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Old 04-16-2006, 03:49 PM   #10045
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[QUOTE=AMGRacer]Yeah I have played with this badboy for ages (probably about 16 hours of just clutch tuning at the track) as well as enlisting the help of our local fast guys. The final verdict was the black HPI pad just wont work when you have decent grip and you want bottom end rip. Hara went to a Mugen grey shoe in 2004.

The easiest fix is simply getting a Mugen Grey shoe. I used that on a stock R40 clutch for 1 year or so with perfect results.

In fact I was seriously struggling to get the Mugen Yellow to have bottom end rip, seems that even it is tough to get decent bite out of when grip is high enough.

QUOTE]

Have you tried the Mugen red shoe? I had pretty good results with it when I had it my 2004 edition. However I just realiezed that I used the stock one in my 05 edition. I guess that explains the lack of bottom end this past weekend. I've been thinking of switching to the yellow shoe. You said you were struggling with the yellow shoe. I thought the yellow shoe was supposed to have more grip?
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Old 04-16-2006, 04:08 PM   #10046
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AMG Where do you shim your gaps at. Your running the full mugen clutch now a days right? Was there any quirks to running it. Do you use the hpi or mugen .8 gears? Do you feel the mugen is superior to the r40 , any idea why?

Also while on the subject of the r40 clutch. After trying the shims on the outside of the thrust bearing this looks to have just worn at the bearing and thrust bearing. Probably not a good idea to do this for those that havent tried it. I guess HPI did get there instructions correct on this one.

Also yes the yellow should have more grip red. Im seriously considering going the full mugen myself this month. Its just running me to the end of figuring it out. I still just bought some more stuff for the hpi clutch so see if I cant get it in gear.
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Old 04-16-2006, 05:44 PM   #10047
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With more grip on the yellow shoe than the red, you'd have to then loosen the adjuster nut especially on a high bite track. I'm with 8th onroad now, but the same rules apply. The stock mugen centax is on my MRX4. Due to the extreme power of the .21 I do have to tighten the adj. nut a bit more otherwise if loosened the car would really bog down on low end before picking up. Threadlock didn't seem to help too much so maybe the adjuster nut it stripped.
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Old 04-17-2006, 02:04 AM   #10048
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Proteus
Have you tried the Mugen red shoe? I had pretty good results with it when I had it my 2004 edition. However I just realiezed that I used the stock one in my 05 edition. I guess that explains the lack of bottom end this past weekend. I've been thinking of switching to the yellow shoe. You said you were struggling with the yellow shoe. I thought the yellow shoe was supposed to have more grip?
Yeah tried the red. As Artificial said, red and yellow just have less bite and more life than the grey. I personally think it is like this:

Black HPI -> Red/Yellow (hard to tell on the track for me) -> Grey

When I said "struggling" I am talking about getting wicked rip out of the corners that will break traction on a medium/high grip surface. The clutch works fine, it just does not rip like I would want it to. I suspect that I have hit the limit of what the yellow shoe can do grip wise and I really need to be using the Grey.
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Old 04-17-2006, 02:07 AM   #10049
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artificial-I
AMG Where do you shim your gaps at. Your running the full mugen clutch now a days right? Was there any quirks to running it. Do you use the hpi or mugen .8 gears? Do you feel the mugen is superior to the r40 , any idea why?

Also while on the subject of the r40 clutch. After trying the shims on the outside of the thrust bearing this looks to have just worn at the bearing and thrust bearing. Probably not a good idea to do this for those that havent tried it. I guess HPI did get there instructions correct on this one.

Also yes the yellow should have more grip red. Im seriously considering going the full mugen myself this month. Its just running me to the end of figuring it out. I still just bought some more stuff for the hpi clutch so see if I cant get it in gear.
Read above for my usual HPI settings. I am using the Mugen clutch right now, mainly because I can rip off peoples settings at my track. I use the HPI 0.8 module gears on a MTX3 bell.

On the Mugen I am using 1.1mm on the adjuster nut and 0.8mm of clutchgap. I use the serpent method of inner shimming to remove endfloat as I feel it makes the clutch bearings last longer.
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Old 04-17-2006, 02:56 AM   #10050
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Default getting my old rs42 running correct

hi can anybody please help ive got my old rc going again it hasnt been run for 9 month it all goes well given it a good run every time i open her up she dies on me can u please help THANKS ALL
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