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Old 09-17-2010, 09:08 AM   #2401
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Does anyone have an insight of why 2 speed clutches in some cars need several laps before they start working properly? We have had this in a TM G4RS, and now the same in our Kyoshos. I have also witnessed the same in some MTX4s, one of my mates has a MTX4 that doesn't start changing properly until after about half a race. This seem to be an issue in some cars only, and not all.

Our RRR and VoneS both need more than half a dozen laps each time to work properly; and its not really a problem, but it would be nice to understand why. We have had a couple of instances where the the car didn't change because a little oily fuel got into the 2 speed housing, so I clean it with methylated spirit after each race now. But some cars other brands that have aluminium 2 speed housings that still work if fuel gets in it, also need time before they start changing properly.
if, your not shiffting consistenly after the engine warms up, then you may consider checking that the setting screws haven't wandered and thrown the shift-point off. The shoes may have worn too low, also. I've seen this cause my two- speed to not shift properly. The shoes had too much space between them and the gear housing it sits in.
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Old 09-17-2010, 09:12 AM   #2402
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Make sure the two-speed shoes aren't glazed over. This causes them to slip instead of grabbing right away. Scuff them with fine grit sand paper. You don't want to take away too much material. This works for the clutch shoe on your engine, too.
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Old 09-17-2010, 02:08 PM   #2403
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Make sure the two-speed shoes aren't glazed over. This causes them to slip instead of grabbing right away. Scuff them with fine grit sand paper. You don't want to take away too much material. This works for the clutch shoe on your engine, too.
Many thanks for all, the help with this, I appreciate that it would seem to most that its the engine that needs warming up, that is what I also would think if wasn't there to watch it. We usually go out with engines that are hot before we put them on the track; and you can hear the engine scream for a few laps, and then all of a sudden we get a very late gear change with gear changes then steadily improving to perfect after a few more laps. Experienced people often ask me why, or advice me that the car is not changing in the beginning when we go out.

We have 2 cars that both do the same, and one has new 2 speed shoes in it, but the gear shift is consistent once it starts working properly. I'll take note of the comment about worn shoes or shifting set screws however, if we start to get inconsistent gear shifts.


After considering all the responses; I'm inclined to agree that the most likely explanation is probably shoes that are glazed. Perhaps cleaning them with methylated spirit between races causes a bit of glaze. I've used methylated spirit because the shoes look dry after using it, and I have found that they don't grip with any any oily film at all on them. I'll use a bit of fine sand paper from now and see how that goes.

I'll give an update as soon as we've tested it to those that are interested. Unfortunately the update may be a few weeks off; it's raining here now, and today was to be the last race day before we hit the road to travel more than 2000 Km to the Australian Nats (starting in 2 weeks time).

Kindest regards,
Lars.
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Old 09-19-2010, 03:40 PM   #2404
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Many thanks for all, the help with this, I appreciate that it would seem to most that its the engine that needs warming up, that is what I also would think if wasn't there to watch it. We usually go out with engines that are hot before we put them on the track; and you can hear the engine scream for a few laps, and then all of a sudden we get a very late gear change with gear changes then steadily improving to perfect after a few more laps. Experienced people often ask me why, or advice me that the car is not changing in the beginning when we go out.

We have 2 cars that both do the same, and one has new 2 speed shoes in it, but the gear shift is consistent once it starts working properly. I'll take note of the comment about worn shoes or shifting set screws however, if we start to get inconsistent gear shifts.


After considering all the responses; I'm inclined to agree that the most likely explanation is probably shoes that are glazed. Perhaps cleaning them with methylated spirit between races causes a bit of glaze. I've used methylated spirit because the shoes look dry after using it, and I have found that they don't grip with any any oily film at all on them. I'll use a bit of fine sand paper from now and see how that goes.

I'll give an update as soon as we've tested it to those that are interested. Unfortunately the update may be a few weeks off; it's raining here now, and today was to be the last race day before we hit the road to travel more than 2000 Km to the Australian Nats (starting in 2 weeks time).

Kindest regards,
Lars.
Good luck in Australia, Lars. Go Kyosho!
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Old 09-20-2010, 12:58 AM   #2405
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how smooth does everyone rear diff spin (no axles, wheels etc attached)?

i cant seem to get it spin freely, unless i shave about 1mm off each eccentric, and give the bulkheads some dremel work to widen it out.

atm i got the serpent rear diff in it.. but i tried putting the stock rrr diff in there and it span awesome, compared to when it was left stock without the dremeling.
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Old 09-20-2010, 04:17 AM   #2406
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how smooth does everyone rear diff spin (no axles, wheels etc attached)?

i cant seem to get it spin freely, unless i shave about 1mm off each eccentric, and give the bulkheads some dremel work to widen it out.

atm i got the serpent rear diff in it.. but i tried putting the stock rrr diff in there and it span awesome, compared to when it was left stock without the dremeling.
It is very important that all drive train parts spin freely, and that the car rolls without impediments. You need to find the cause of it.

Kindest regards,
Lars.
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Old 09-20-2010, 04:36 AM   #2407
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Good luck in Australia, Lars. Go Kyosho!
Many thanks for well wish.

To anyone that may be interested; it seems that the cause of the need for prolonged running before the 2 speed works properly may have been glazed clutch shoes. It didn't rain, and we raced on Saturday. This time I did not clean the 2 speed shoes with Methylated spirits between each race; and the 2 speed started work after the first laps, and were working properly after only about 3 - 4 laps. I only cleaned the inside of the housing, which is always a little oily after running the car. Cleaning with Metha must cause the 2 speed clutch shoes to slip, and I'll just scrape any oil on the shoes off with a knife from now on. Also the gear changes were a lot harsher than what they used to, the car used to change gear with a lot more slip before. But we don't mind that, Kyoshos don't strip gears like some other makes of cars often do with harsh gear changes.

Kindest regards,
Lars.
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Old 09-20-2010, 06:09 AM   #2408
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It is very important that all drive train parts spin freely, and that the car rolls without impediments. You need to find the cause of it.

Kindest regards,
Lars.
i dont have the problem anymore since i run a serpent rear diff.

but when i had the RRR diff, iv tried about 3 different sets of bulkheads.. and they all kind of bind.
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Old 09-21-2010, 06:36 AM   #2409
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rebuild almost done .

the car looks really narrow now that everything has been squeezed inside the chassis and nothing sticking out the side.

also instaleld the new bumper


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Old 09-22-2010, 08:52 PM   #2410
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yes it works.... and i got it to work, but came across a few issues and took it apart at the end. was too much headache.

i may give it another try in the future, but would need the parts machined out for perfect fit.

1. was too unstable. too sloppy even when i tried to eliminate the slop from all the linkages.

2. if i grab one wheel and rock it back and forth (with enough pressure), i was able to make the opposide move.

I guess this is the reason why the serpent dls runs the linkage from the a-arm to the upper-arm. to prevent ^ from happening and the only way it would work is if lower arm is compressed.

i found a solution to fixing this, which is running a spring which prevents it from happening

3. made the rear end too stiff, too much 'sprung' mass

at the end it just looked like there was too much going on..
Keep trying and keep us posted! A few serpents in the bay area are SO much faster with the new rear end...would be good to have something that we can try
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Old 09-22-2010, 11:56 PM   #2411
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i can get it to work, just not going to bother with the hassle.

i got a serpent as a spare, and it would be easy to put the dls on that than modify my rrr.

plus the rrr seems to be dead.
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Old 09-23-2010, 01:32 AM   #2412
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Default Kyosho News

http://rcspecial.com/news/?p=57272
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Old 09-23-2010, 01:56 AM   #2413
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omg , is that a new car?????? finally, i hope its a revolution and not an evolution, pisses me off most people think my car is just a rrr evo..... its a rrr evo 2 WC dammit!!!
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Old 09-23-2010, 02:50 AM   #2414
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hm nice. from what i cantell

looks like laydown servo . valvet coated shocks, and there going with a gold/yellow theme and ditching the blue.

kinda looks like they did something to the rear end - shocks sit inside the tower, not outside.

new front bumper

i wonder how compatible it will be compared to the RRR. any bet it will look like the RRR at the worlds with the new top deck.

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omg , is that a new car?????? finally, i hope its a revolution and not an evolution, pisses me off most people think my car is just a rrr evo..... its a rrr evo 2 WC dammit!!!
and so is mine. people look at it and is confused what it is.
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Old 09-23-2010, 05:58 AM   #2415
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finish rebuilding the rrr.

the weight of my rrr is 1390g. :|

time to weigh it up.
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