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Old 12-17-2007, 03:47 AM   #1
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Default NT1 drive train installed in the MTX4?

Hi i was wondering if any xray owners can tell me if the NT1 has the same front and rear diff bearing sizes as the MTX4?

if so, would the drivetrain from the NT1, (ie rear diff, brake disk pulley, front and rear side pullies, front oneway, as well as front side and rear belts)
fit the MTX4R?

if so this would allow the MTX4 to have the lower internal ratio the Xray has as well as a lower rotating mass due to the xrays smaller rear diff

my main concern is the bearing sizes for the diffs, are they the same as the mugen (which is 12X18)

Last edited by TomB; 12-17-2007 at 04:01 AM.
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Old 12-17-2007, 04:47 AM   #2
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Default NT1 drive train in MTX-4

When I ran the MTX-4 I lowered the internal ratio of the mtx-4 to 2.05. It definately seemed to help acceleration. It required using a 20tooth brake pulley from a G4S......and running a 19tooth side pulley. With the G4S 20T brake pulley(it's an optional pulley) you will need to chop the pins off of it. Next you will have to lathe off the pulley holder from the MTX-4 brake pulley, and grind a new flat onto the 2speed shaft. I have a lathe and mill at home so it wasn't to bad to do all of that. Then you will need to buy a Kyosho RRR rear belt, and fashion a belt tensioner for it. The mtx-4 rear belt will not work. That's the cheapest way I found to convert it.

Trying to put an NT1 drive train into the MTX-4 would be a nightmare. If you don't own a lathe and mill don't attempt it. After you spend all the money on the drive train parts, you will have to reshim and refit everything. Next you will need to experiment with the belt lengths. Trust me it's not worth it.

I solved the problem very nicely. I got the Xray NT1. The MTX-4 is a great capable race car. ................However the fit and finish on the Xray is absolutely awesome. The drive train components are way lighter, and I'm very glad for me I made the change.
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Old 12-17-2007, 06:28 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by RayJ View Post
When I ran the MTX-4 I lowered the internal ratio of the mtx-4 to 2.05. It definately seemed to help acceleration. It required using a 20tooth brake pulley from a G4S......and running a 19tooth side pulley. With the G4S 20T brake pulley(it's an optional pulley) you will need to chop the pins off of it. Next you will have to lathe off the pulley holder from the MTX-4 brake pulley, and grind a new flat onto the 2speed shaft. I have a lathe and mill at home so it wasn't to bad to do all of that. Then you will need to buy a Kyosho RRR rear belt, and fashion a belt tensioner for it. The mtx-4 rear belt will not work. That's the cheapest way I found to convert it.

Trying to put an NT1 drive train into the MTX-4 would be a nightmare. If you don't own a lathe and mill don't attempt it. After you spend all the money on the drive train parts, you will have to reshim and refit everything. Next you will need to experiment with the belt lengths. Trust me it's not worth it.

I solved the problem very nicely. I got the Xray NT1. The MTX-4 is a great capable race car. ................However the fit and finish on the Xray is absolutely awesome. The drive train components are way lighter, and I'm very glad for me I made the change.

don't say that man lol yeah, i'm trying to string along the mtx4 R...even the RRR has a lower internal ratio

i've actually considered geting the RRR! due to the internal ratio of the RRR being similar (i believe) to the NT1

only thing stoping me going to Xray is the inflated prices they have.
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Old 12-17-2007, 08:57 AM   #4
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Looking at the manual the Nt1 uses 10x16 rear diff bearings prt# 941016
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Old 12-17-2007, 05:06 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomB View Post
don't say that man lol yeah, i'm trying to string along the mtx4 R...even the RRR has a lower internal ratio

i've actually considered geting the RRR! due to the internal ratio of the RRR being similar (i believe) to the NT1

only thing stoping me going to Xray is the inflated prices they have.
Hey Tomb,why dont you try this? Take a LARGE container, add front end from a NT1, Throw in the rear end from a RRR, chuck in the mid section of a MTX-4R, couple of hand fulls of assorted cvd's drive sharfts, sideand front ,rear belts,from the 4 top brand cars.Then shake really well,pour into a MTX-4R box, cut 4 GQ 37shore wheels, place on edge of box with a large aireal wire. Allow to dry 24 hours. But remember, if you bring it to the track, and it gets off it's transmitter,and BITES some one, you'll be in deep SHIT!!!!!
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Old 12-17-2007, 05:34 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Gseventeen View Post
Hey Tomb,why dont you try this? Take a LARGE container, add front end from a NT1, Throw in the rear end from a RRR, chuck in the mid section of a MTX-4R, couple of hand fulls of assorted cvd's drive sharfts, sideand front ,rear belts,from the 4 top brand cars.Then shake really well,pour into a MTX-4R box, cut 4 GQ 37shore wheels, place on edge of box with a large aireal wire. Allow to dry 24 hours. But remember, if you bring it to the track, and it gets off it's transmitter,and BITES some one, you'll be in deep SHIT!!!!!
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Old 12-17-2007, 06:31 PM   #7
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Nice one Gseventeen... hehe

Tomb - If your loking to make your accelerate faster why dont you try the following:

1. remove those things you use for bearings and replace with metal shielded ones from avid racing. run a light oil to free your car up.
2. make your car lighter by removing all the bling aluminium hopups. Run the stock parts unless there is a reason to use aluminium. ie: stripping or wearing ot parts.
3. use the correct gear ratio suited to your engine / track.


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Old 12-18-2007, 06:40 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by mrgsr View Post
Nice one Gseventeen... hehe

Tomb - If your loking to make your accelerate faster why dont you try the following:

1. remove those things you use for bearings and replace with metal shielded ones from avid racing. run a light oil to free your car up.
2. make your car lighter by removing all the bling aluminium hopups. Run the stock parts unless there is a reason to use aluminium. ie: stripping or wearing ot parts.
3. use the correct gear ratio suited to your engine / track.


Johnny
i might actually try doing the G4S pulley mod as suggested above. I'd be keen to modify the internal drive ratio still, i mainly want to see what difference it will have on the cars accelleration.

i'm already running the right gearing for the CRF at Moorebank, so no need for this. the car isn't much hevier than standard. last time it got weighed at the qld states it was 20 or 30 grams over, depending on the tyre size.
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Old 12-18-2007, 06:49 AM   #9
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Are you guys saying that the MTX4 can't get the same final drive ratio or close as the other cars? What is so bad about the MTX4? I here a lot of people say it's just not good enough why? I'm not switching car but I'm am curious.
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Old 12-18-2007, 06:53 AM   #10
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Are you guys saying that the MTX4 can't get the same final drive ratio or close as the other cars? What is so bad about the MTX4? I here a lot of people say it's just not good enough why? I'm not switching car but I'm am curious.
there is nothing wrong with it, but the internal drive ratio on the mugen mtx4 is significantly larger than the RRR or the NT1, so the acceleration of the mtx4 is slower than these other two cars. It' just another element of the car worth considering.

i'm just curious as to how the 4 can be improved in this area.
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Old 12-18-2007, 07:04 AM   #11
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would anyone know if the mugen MRX4R brake pulley is the same as the mtx4? or is it a larger pulley? and by how many teeth?
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Old 12-18-2007, 07:47 AM   #12
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there is nothing wrong with it, but the internal drive ratio on the mugen mtx4 is significantly larger than the RRR or the NT1, so the acceleration of the mtx4 is slower than these other two cars. It' just another element of the car worth considering.

i'm just curious as to how the 4 can be improved in this area.
Thanks for the info.
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Old 12-18-2007, 01:29 PM   #13
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Someone summed up the issue a few weeks ago:

Serpent: 1.95
Kyosho: 2.05
Xray: 2.05
MUGEN: 2.15
Magic: 2.55

" Having a lower internal gearing ratio allows you to go lower on 1st and 2nd gear pinions, and at the same time keeps the final drive ratio the same. What this also means is that you get faster into the powerband of .12 motors and the spool up time of the drive train is also less. This translates to faster acceleration corner to corner."
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Old 12-18-2007, 02:08 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Novarossi View Post
Someone summed up the issue a few weeks ago:

Serpent: 1.95
Kyosho: 2.05
Xray: 2.05
MUGEN: 2.15
Magic: 2.55

" Having a lower internal gearing ratio allows you to go lower on 1st and 2nd gear pinions, and at the same time keeps the final drive ratio the same. What this also means is that you get faster into the powerband of .12 motors and the spool up time of the drive train is also less. This translates to faster acceleration corner to corner."
The mugen, is pretty close to xray and kyosho so what's all the hype about the internal ratio. Maybe the mugen drivetrain is just a little heavier.
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Old 12-18-2007, 02:47 PM   #15
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I always thought the lower the internal gear ratio the more top-end a car would have. IMO the mtx-4 would have slightly more accelaration because of a larger internal gear ratio but it would run out of gears before the NT1/kyo/serp cars. I would think this lower internal gear ratio would come in to play later in the powerband. Just my two cents.

To say a lower internal gear ratio is better I believe is mis-leading but a lower internal gear ratio is broader across the power band of .12 size engines.

Again gentlemen I'm no expert but that's the way I understand it. Or am I confused with final gear ratio?

Last edited by lil-bump; 12-18-2007 at 03:25 PM.
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