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Old 04-04-2003, 08:39 PM   #1
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Default novarossi EXPERTS only - precisely what is this motor?

my lhs sold me this engine for 185$ - said it was a TURBO.

http://www.hobbypeople.net/gallery/838230.asp

RS12S1TR

is this a TURBO motor or not? what do the designation characters AFTER the RS12.... mean? what does the 'TR' mean? what does the 'S1' mean?

what does "TURBO" mean? does it mean turbo BUTTON/PLUG? does it mean turbo CRANK? WHAT is turbo about THIS EXACT motor?

other NR .12, 2.1cc designations;
rs12t
rs12s1
rs12s2
rs12t5s2

WTF??

why the @[email protected]% do they have to make it so [email protected]%^#*& complicated!!??

now i have to go BACK to the dick heads at the lhs and tell them what they TOLD me was a turbo is in fact NOT A TURBO.

QUESTIONS:
1. can i switch to the turbo head with THIS motor? i have turbo head from my trusty STS12 - it FITS this motor.
2. can i switch to the turbo CRANK with this motor - why would i WANT to do this?

frustrated r/c wannbe
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Old 04-04-2003, 08:58 PM   #2
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I am not an expert but here is an expert of Novarossi


http://www.novarossi.com/motori_ing/12/rs12tring.html
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Old 04-04-2003, 09:17 PM   #3
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http://www.novarossi.com/Listino/pubblic_price_list.htm
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Old 04-04-2003, 09:19 PM   #4
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BTW, its in Italian, but just click onto the Novarossi logo then on the left menu click on the 2.1cc link
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Old 04-04-2003, 09:47 PM   #5
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RS12 - the engine
S - Slide carb (R - rotary)
1 - SG crank (2 - standard/threaded)
TR - truck(offroad) cooling head.

Newer, next generation, versions of the RS12 have been referred to as S3, S5 and T5. In this case, the S or T would indicate standard or turbo engine. The number (3 or 5) indicates port configuration. I have an RS12 T5 Race engine but the head on it is stamped S5. It's a 5 port RS12 with a turbo button and a turbo crank. It's basically the same engine as the S5 but with those 2 turbo parts. My box has RS12 T5 S1 on it. Slide carb, and SG shaft. Confusing...I know.

Your engine is basically the Mugen MT12 engine with a taller head. If the pictures in Manticore's link are what you have in your engine, then you have what Novarossi considers their "turbo" crank. It has a scoop some material removed from the crank face. As for the plug, you can check to see if it is a turbo plug or not by taking it out. I'd have to believe that it is just a standard plug.

That's pretty much all I know...which isn't much. Hope it give you some insight though
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Old 04-04-2003, 10:21 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by Manticore
I am not an expert but here is an expert of Novarossi

http://www.novarossi.com/motori_ing/12/rs12tring.html
thx - of course i have BEEN here -
a. nothing about what kind of PLUGS the motors use - what is and IS NOT "turbo";

b. nothing about what the 'TR' means or anything about any of the other designations...

Quote:
Originally posted by Novarossi
BTW, its in Italian, but just click onto the Novarossi logo then on the left menu click on the 2.1cc link
thx - a little more info here - the data for the kinds of plugs used in the motors is listed - that helps;

also note that the CARB dia. listed on this site shows as 5.5mm for the RS12S1TR - whereas the other site (above) lists the carb as 5.4 dia for the same motor - which is ACCURATE?

here's what i have been able to figure out;

'TR' designation means Truck - NOT repeat NOT turbo!
'T' means Turbo
'S' means Slide
'R' means Rotary
'1' means 5M shaft = threaded??
'2' means SG shaft
'3' means 3 ports - but MOST of them HAVE 3 ports - wtf??
'5' means 5 ports - ?? what about 4??

next - it is the ORDER in which the designators are listed that is CRITICAL; the 'T' for turbo must come directly AFTER the '12' - if it doesn't = non turbo. for example,
RS12S1 = non turbo
RS12TS1 = turbo;

i can see why it was easy for the guys at the lhs to get confused - just the ITALIAN way. i guess they don't have any difficulty with this extremely confusing naming scheme at Novarossi.

SO - what about wether or not i can use the turbo head in THIS RS12S1TR motor? - it fits - that's for sure - the parts listed with the motor show TWO diff part numbers for the std and turbo heads - i believe that it's simply switching to the turbo head - just like on my sts12 - that's all i did to go turbo on my sts12. i just want to be sure i have it correct. damn Italians....



same thing for the crank - TWO part nums;

the question IS - what is DIFFERENT about the two cranks? what makes one crank a turbo and the other non-turbo? the crank on the motor i bought (the motor which is NOT turbo - even though it SAYS it is tubRo!) has the shark groove in the face of the crank... what else does a 'turbo crank' have? a widened inlet port?

still confused...
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Old 04-04-2003, 10:36 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by rod_b

Your engine is basically the Mugen MT12 engine with a taller head. If the pictures in Manticore's link are what you have in your engine, then you have what Novarossi considers their "turbo" crank. It has a scoop some material removed from the crank face. As for the plug, you can check to see if it is a turbo plug or not by taking it out. I'd have to believe that it is just a standard plug.

That's pretty much all I know...which isn't much. Hope it give you some insight though
man - i love this fourm - thx - u r exactly correct rod! i think i have this figured out;

a. i DO have a turbo crank
b. i need to get the dopes at the lhs to give me a turbo head and plug (for free!!) - then i'm set.

now - the MT12 is rated at 1.12hp - correct? this is 1.35 so it's quite a bit better than a basic MT12 i think.

the clowns at the lhs have ur exact motor rod - RS12T5S1.

haha they list it at about 350$ - i bitched at them about their screw up and told them they need to give me that 5 port job for my trouble - didn't get very far needless to say! he said 'our cost is 264$' - well, that's crap because i see plenty of ebays for the RS12T5S1 for a lot less than 264$ !!
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Old 04-04-2003, 11:33 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by rod_b
I have an RS12 T5 Race engine but the head on it is stamped S5. It's a 5 port RS12 with a turbo button and a turbo crank. It's basically the same engine as the S5 but with those 2 turbo parts. My box has RS12 T5 S1 on it. Slide carb, and SG shaft. Confusing...I know.
mind me asking what u paid? - i'm trying to find out how far down i can work my lhs 'cause they screwed me.

going to sleep now - 'nuff r/c bs for 1 day....
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Old 04-05-2003, 06:54 AM   #9
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Actually, I got mine from an online shop in HK for $199. I think shipping was $9. If I can find the link, I'll post it.

Oh BTW, you probably aren't gonna get a great deal on that engine from any LHS just because they're being distributed by Trinity now. Best bet is eBay.

Last edited by rod_b; 04-05-2003 at 07:06 AM.
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Old 04-05-2003, 07:06 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by cybertoolzz
here's what i have been able to figure out;

'TR' designation means Truck - NOT repeat NOT turbo!
'T' means Turbo
'S' means Slide
'R' means Rotary
'1' means 5M shaft = threaded??
'2' means SG shaft
'3' means 3 ports - but MOST of them HAVE 3 ports - wtf??
'5' means 5 ports - ?? what about 4??
Some corrections:

For example RS12 T5 S1
Engine name first (RS12)
Engine configuration next (T5 - Turbo engine, 5 intake ports)
Carb and crank config (S1 - Slide, SG)

On the first generation engines, there was no turbo or 5 port configs so you will not see T5, T3, S5 or S3 on the label. Just engine name and carb/crank config. Example: CX12 S1, S2, R1 or R2.

The TR on the very end is new and indicates that the engine has the taller truck/offroad cooling head.

Ports - 3 ports is legal. More than 3 is not. There are actually 4 ports in a 3 port engine. People only refer to the intake ports (3) and exclude mentioning the exhaust port (1). So when you hear people say 3, 5 or 7 ports, the are referring to how many intake ports there are in the engine.

You now have enough info to be dangerous.
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Old 04-05-2003, 07:43 AM   #11
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The RS12S1 is the same motor as the MR12S1, and RBX12,except the RB's crankshaft has no work done to it. The "S3" designation in the RS12S3 means that the engine has the light weight milled piston, raised exhaust port and increased timing. The Mugen MR12S3 should be available sometime in the near future.
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Old 04-05-2003, 07:53 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by cybertoolzz
SO - what about wether or not i can use the turbo head in THIS RS12S1TR motor? - it fits - that's for sure - the parts listed with the motor show TWO diff part numbers for the std and turbo heads - i believe that it's simply switching to the turbo head - just like on my sts12 - that's all i did to go turbo on my sts12. i just want to be sure i have it correct. damn Italians....



same thing for the crank - TWO part nums;

the question IS - what is DIFFERENT about the two cranks? what makes one crank a turbo and the other non-turbo? the crank on the motor i bought (the motor which is NOT turbo - even though it SAYS it is tubRo!) has the shark groove in the face of the crank... what else does a 'turbo crank' have? a widened inlet port?

still confused...
excellent info here - thx guys! but still no answer to using the turbo head in this rs12s1tr...
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Old 04-05-2003, 10:08 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by rod_b
Actually, I got mine from an online shop in HK for $199. I think shipping was $9. If I can find the link, I'll post it.

Oh BTW, you probably aren't gonna get a great deal on that engine from any LHS just because they're being distributed by Trinity now. Best bet is eBay.
Very true. I got my T5 off ebay last year for $150. Still brand new in the box. It runs sweet and I use the button and head one of my RB12 3-ports to make it a Turbo for championship racing.
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Old 04-05-2003, 03:00 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by rod_b


Your engine is basically the Mugen MT12 engine with a taller head. If the pictures in Manticore's link are what you have in your engine, then you have what Novarossi considers their "turbo" crank. It has a scoop some material removed from the crank face. As for the plug, you can check to see if it is a turbo plug or not by taking it out. I'd have to believe that it is just a standard plug.

That's pretty much all I know...which isn't much. Hope it give you some insight though

the scoop does not make it a turbo crank later no turbo mt12's came with the scoop and were NOT turbo Cranks.
turbo crank has a larger bore in the center
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Old 04-05-2003, 06:51 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by Cartman
the scoop does not make it a turbo crank later no turbo mt12's came with the scoop and were NOT turbo Cranks.
turbo crank has a larger bore in the center
thx - this is what i needed to know. i can't say much for your english sentence structure skills tho.... that first sentence just makes no sense.

how much larger is the bore of a turbo crank?

can i use the crank i have - that is, apparently NOT a turbo crank, with a turbo head/plug?

what would happen if i were to use just the turbo head/plug and keep the standard crank that is on this rs12s1tr?
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