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Kyosho Inferno MP9 TKI4 1/8 Buggy Kit

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Kyosho Inferno MP9 TKI4 1/8 Buggy Kit

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Old 11-05-2018, 09:06 AM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech ForumsThread Wiki: Kyosho Inferno MP9 TKI4 1/8 Buggy Kit
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Last edit by: 30Tooth
Picked up a TKI3 and want to upgrade to TKI4 ? Here are all the updated parts:

Shocks

IF347-155 1.5X5 Pistons
IF471-01 Front Shock Body
IF470-01 Rear Shock Body
IF470-03BK Shock Adjust Dial
IFW154 Boots
IF346-05C Shock End Set

Wing

IF491BK Wing
IFW460B Wing Mount/Stay

Rear End

IFH006W Wheel
IF490 HUB
IF490-01 Hub Insert
IF492 Shock Pin
IF423HB Rear Arm
IF287 Hard Upper Rod Rear

Front End

IF489 Steering Rod Set
IF488 Knuckles
IF487H Front Arm
IFW458 Hard Lower Pin
IFW425 93MM CVD
IF286 Hard Upper Rod
IF486 Lower Susp Holder
IFW459 Servo Saver (Hard)
IF446B Ackerman Arm
IF426-64.5 Susp Shaft


Other

IF469B Filter
97035LW-13 Clutch Bell
IF453B Body Mount
IFW107GM Hexes
W300910 Washer
IF443B Center Diff Plate
IF444C Tank
IF479B Radio Box
96772 13x16x0.15mm Shim
IF481B Fuel Tank Stay
IFW336GM Wheelnut
IFB008 TKI4 Body
IFD403W TKI4 Decal

---------------------------

Another option if you want TKI4 Durability but TKI3 geometry of the front arm is :

IF493 Front Arm (Updated MP9 front arms replaces IF427B as a direct fit. Left and right.)

They use the older TKI3 captured outer hinge pin and screw. But if you just reem out the the outer hole you can use TKI hinge-pin/nut (IFW458)
---------------------------

Optional Updates / New Parts:

IFW469 IFW469 Aeration Cap Set(Threaded Big Shock/MP9)

IFW473 New Brake Pads (Sept 2017)

Optional Alu front hubs:
- IFW412 - 13 deg (like stock plastic ones)
- IFW436 - 16 deg
- IFW474 - 17.5 deg
- IFW461 - 19deg

M2C 1mm engine spacer: M2C9610

Body Options
New Bitty Force Body

Tebo's Build Videos

Video #1

Video #2

Video #3

Video #4

Video #5

Video #6

Original Kyosho MP9 TKI Thread
_____________________

Baseline setups from Joonas.




_____________________

Shock build with vented cap and compensator.

You have to use the HC diaphragms (if346-09,stock TKI3 and if not mistaken TKI4 too, yes the thin ones no one likes), aeration caps without the bleeder screw or mod the stock caps by drilling a 1.5 or 2mm hole on the top facing up or at an angle (doesn't matter the size or angle, it just for bleeding pressure behind the diaphragm and allow the foam compensator to breathe) and a 10mm width x 3.5mm height dome shaped foam compensator made from old open cell inserts or dishwasher sponge. The foam compensator has to be soft enough not to add rebound but allow the diaphragm to regain it's shape.

Setup Sheet and Tuning

The setup sheet is getting crowded with all options but don't worry once you get acquainted with the parts will make sense.
Run the car as is, more than probably you won't need anything else. Using my setup as an example:

Diff gear has two options, normal and LSD. LSD stands for limited slip differential and is like using thick oils because you can't tune coast from locked.

Shock setup is a bit more confusing, you have two shock body sizes (S and M and truggy sized rear shocks that only the first version had so forget this one), three types of pistons (flat holes and surfaces, flat holes tapered surface and tapered holes with tapered surface): tapered have most pack, then black(simple piston) and then white because length of the holes. Then you have different length springs to account for different shock sizes, for a standard wheelbase/no weights car a good combo is Light Blue front and Orange rear, if you extend the wheelbase then I expect the included Light Blue rear springs be money instead of Orange.

Ride height is self explanatory, start always with lower arms parallel because good suspension geometry will be far easier to achieve. Rebound is used as total shock length no idea why they call it rebound, either use total shock length or maximum exposed shock shaft length. Camber self explanatory, run more camber in the front than the rear to make the car oversteer and more rear than front to make it understeer(grossly oversimplified).

Toe same deal as camber(again grossly oversimplified) but this you have to run the least amount you can. I use around 2-2.5 on my cars, never more as I can find traction by other means with way less impact on performance.

Wheelbase is a powerful setting, changes a lot of stuff. Let's just say that it can make the car behave neutral or not in that small range. Try for yourself. I like to use the longest setting and tune from there.

Shock position self explanatory, something most don't change and I don't play around with it. I do have a method but involves much work (with the car bottomed out, see which position places the shock 90 to the lower arm and then chose spring from a couple equations and bam done, I can do it easily so anyone interested just ask.

Rear upper arm position is again an important setting, you change both camber gain and roll centre. The rear roll centre should be higher than the front, that's why I use the middle hole inner row as a starting setup.

Suspension arm, self explanatory: there are two different length arms and each has a hard and a normal flex plastic.

Front suspension bushing is for upper arm alignment, also same deal as rear upper arm position changes both camber gain and roll centre.

Suspension holder is for kick up (pro dive is the correct naming). I believe tki4 9 of kick up to be better than 9 of kick up using the tki3 parts because you can run the car lower (26mm front ride height) and use the +2mm front shock tower if there's too much camber gain or it's stiff in roll. So use +2mm lowered roll centre to keep most stuff unchanged or use the bushings with the dot up to lower the roll centre a bit more, doesn't hurt anything.

Front hub carrier, self explanatory. I am trying to use the out hole on top of the carrier as it is better during braking and accelerating. Together with the higher front roll centre on the tki4 should provide enough camber gain during cornering if not then more caster will do.

Rear roll centre and anti squat(wrongly called skid angle). Again same thinking as the front, lower the car and keep roll centre in the same height as before(that will need a change in upper arm position which my setup does). Anti squat is changed only if the pitching motion causes too much camber to be gained by the rear tires on power, nothing more.

Front knuckle, apparently there's a difference in the Ackerman arm. Can't say anything about them as I don't know enough about both.

Rear hub carrier,there is one made of plastic (which doesn't have offset apparently so it's suited to long arm setting) and three aluminium versions. One similar to the plastic one, other with offset and a new one with offset and adjustable hub height.

Rear tread can be used as arm length and outboard toe(never seen it being used but the possibility is there). Longer is better most of the time (only on really low traction).

Chassis brace, wheel hub, sway bars and weight are self explanatory. No need to use weights nor other hubs. A couple of roll bars would be a nice addition. About the aluminium braces I am torn, I guess the car doesn't need flex with this setup but won't recommend the stiffer braces but the lower engine mount is very nice to deal with flex around the clutch.

Wing and wing stay are like the d81x had regarding height and position. The wing should be as low and have free airflow as possible.

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Old 01-01-2017, 06:14 PM
  #1111  
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Originally Posted by windellmc
How are they compared to the 13?
A better overall feel for me.....the 13's are a bit twitchy if that makes sense. i went to the 19's for a little bit but found that i was struggling in very tight turns and had to run too much toe out to compensate. The 19's add a ton of on power steering.

16's for me are a better overall feel for both conditions.
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Old 01-01-2017, 09:08 PM
  #1112  
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Originally Posted by ragekills
@ windellmc full tki4 kit (no tki3 parts)
Are you running the 1.3x8 shock Pistons? I think the shock oil listed is probably ok for the tki4 kit pistons but it is too light for the 1.3x8 Pistons. I would also change the front lower arm bushing to get more kick up. You probably need the 16 caster blocks too although my car is ok with the 13 blocks it drives a little weird kind of like it needs more caster. That is on tight tracks though. Bigger tracks will need more caster.
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Old 01-01-2017, 09:09 PM
  #1113  
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Originally Posted by RockStar_199
A better overall feel for me.....the 13's are a bit twitchy if that makes sense. i went to the 19's for a little bit but found that i was struggling in very tight turns and had to run too much toe out to compensate. The 19's add a ton of on power steering.

16's for me are a better overall feel for both conditions.
That is what I figured. We are running indoors now so I can't get a good test on the 16 degree blocks.
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Old 01-02-2017, 12:00 PM
  #1114  
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Originally Posted by windellmc
Are you running the 1.3x8 shock Pistons? I think the shock oil listed is probably ok for the tki4 kit pistons but it is too light for the 1.3x8 Pistons. I would also change the front lower arm bushing to get more kick up. You probably need the 16 caster blocks too although my car is ok with the 13 blocks it drives a little weird kind of like it needs more caster. That is on tight tracks though. Bigger tracks will need more caster.
Yes I'm running 1.3x8 pistons (current setup minus tki3 B block and different shock oil depending on weather) http://www.kyoshoamerica.com/assets/...EO16%20(1).pdf


From what I'm understanding in my situation I need 16 degree caster blocks and don't worry about the B block? (For more on power steering)
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Old 01-02-2017, 02:59 PM
  #1115  
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Originally Posted by ragekills
Dirt, Loose, doesn't get watered much, temp range 50-90 degrees https://i.ytimg.com/vi/pxy2slaMu40/maxresdefault.jpg

More on power steering. Most of the time I have to get off the throttle to get more turn in.

Thank you
I see you have enough advice but here's my take too:
1. going by the setup you posted you should have a car with more than enough on-power steering, that isn't the case because I suspect the setup you choose is working out of expected conditions. Ergo, you should also have the TKI3 parts the setup calls, no mix n' match;
2. Have you tried the stock setup? If yes then what are the complaints using that setup, same as now?

First changes I would do without knowing more is to propose you change kick up to dots up and try raising the rear camber link one hole on the shock tower. That would be more close to how a Mugen drives.
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Old 01-02-2017, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by ragekills
Yes I'm running 1.3x8 pistons (current setup minus tki3 B block and different shock oil depending on weather) http://www.kyoshoamerica.com/assets/...EO16%20(1).pdf


From what I'm understanding in my situation I need 16 degree caster blocks and don't worry about the B block? (For more on power steering)
I think tebo runs a lot heavier shock oil usually for SoCal weather. Either try the 16 degree blocks or switch to the tki3 b block and steering knuckles.
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Old 01-02-2017, 06:43 PM
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Originally Posted by ragekills
Dirt, Loose, doesn't get watered much, temp range 50-90 degrees https://i.ytimg.com/vi/pxy2slaMu40/maxresdefault.jpg

More on power steering. Most of the time I have to get off the throttle to get more turn in.

Thank you
why are your running tebo's NEO16 setup in the first place? its an indoor race with vastly different soil, grip and temperature to what you have..
and your not even running his setup in its entirety, as he has the tki3 b-block and front knuckles..

if i was you i would go back to the stock setup and make one setup change at a time to ensure you are heading in the right direction.

the tki4 is an amazing car and does not lack steering anywhere so something is amiss.
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Old 01-02-2017, 06:54 PM
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yeah definitey does not lack steering with box setup, plus, you may have to adjust your driving a little and drive the car the way it was designed, and a little less the way you want to drive it. you never know, it may just be a fair bit quicker that way...
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Old 01-02-2017, 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by 30Tooth
I see you have enough advice but here's my take too:
1. going by the setup you posted you should have a car with more than enough on-power steering, that isn't the case because I suspect the setup you choose is working out of expected conditions. Ergo, you should also have the TKI3 parts the setup calls, no mix n' match;
2. Have you tried the stock setup? If yes then what are the complaints using that setup, same as now?

First changes I would do without knowing more is to propose you change kick up to dots up and try raising the rear camber link one hole on the shock tower. That would be more close to how a Mugen drives.
1. True.
2. I have not, A guy at the tracked recommended the setup I'm running.

Thank you, I will try it.
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Old 01-02-2017, 09:50 PM
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As I do, I think I will try the stock setup and see how that works. If that doesn't work, I will try a couple parts.

Originally Posted by windellmc
I think tebo runs a lot heavier shock oil usually for SoCal weather. Either try the 16 degree blocks or switch to the tki3 b block and steering knuckles.
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Old 01-02-2017, 09:53 PM
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Originally Posted by mourinho
why are your running tebo's NEO16 setup in the first place? its an indoor race with vastly different soil, grip and temperature to what you have..
and your not even running his setup in its entirety, as he has the tki3 b-block and front knuckles..

if i was you i would go back to the stock setup and make one setup change at a time to ensure you are heading in the right direction.

the tki4 is an amazing car and does not lack steering anywhere so something is amiss.
One of the guys at the track recommended it, I agree.

I will try the stock setup. Glad to hear

Last edited by ragekills; 01-05-2017 at 07:19 PM.
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Old 01-03-2017, 12:41 AM
  #1122  
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Originally Posted by mourinho
why are your running tebo's NEO16 setup in the first place? its an indoor race with vastly different soil, grip and temperature to what you have..
and your not even running his setup in its entirety, as he has the tki3 b-block and front knuckles..

if i was you i would go back to the stock setup and make one setup change at a time to ensure you are heading in the right direction.

the tki4 is an amazing car and does not lack steering anywhere so something is amiss.
+1.. was reading all comments and with yours.. I 100% agree with you
Well said
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Old 01-03-2017, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by BigInJapan
yeah definitey does not lack steering with box setup, plus, you may have to adjust your driving a little and drive the car the way it was designed, and a little less the way you want to drive it. you never know, it may just be a fair bit quicker that way...
How was it designed to be driven ? This may be the piece of the puzzle I have been missing ...
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Old 01-03-2017, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by wittyname
How was it designed to be driven ? This may be the piece of the puzzle I have been missing ...
factory setup = way it was designed. let the car drive around the corners rather than forcing it to drive "like" another brand. the tki4 has amazing corner speed, you wont be lacking anything.
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Old 01-03-2017, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by BigInJapan
factory setup = way it was designed. let the car drive around the corners rather than forcing it to drive "like" another brand. the tki4 has amazing corner speed, you wont be lacking anything.
Agreed, the Inferno series are favour a point and shoot driving style but have enough leeway to cater to drivers that don't lift throttle as much.
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