Kyosho Inferno MP9 TKI4 1/8 Buggy Kit
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#2177
Tech Addict
iTrader: (12)
Questions..
Hello everyone!I just got back into the hobby after 6 years off!I had a TKi2 when I quit!Really loved it!I also read a lot of good things about the TK3 while during my off!So few months ago I decided to get Kyosho again to start with!Went and I got a TKI4 Nitro roller and a TKI4E .Had fun building it!I put a setup what the factory suggested!Beside I am very rusty both buggy felt very hard to drive so I decided changing setups!Took away steering ,went up on diff fluid (5-5-7) etc etc did help a little bit but still not where I want to be!Buggy still feels a little hard to drive!It’s just not the same forgiving as the TKi2 was!The gas mileage is bad too!OS speed with 2090 pipe max 8:30min.Same engine setup tuned by same guy on a different brand buggy gets 10:00min....But than few friends telling me to not chew myself up because Kyosho really moved to the wrong direction with the TKI4!Its totally different than a TKI3 what everyone loved!My response was than how come the Nationals won by this buggy than?They say bc the guy actually ran the TKI3 not the TKI4!
They also said (this is Ppl who actually good local racers and tried the TKI4) if I keep the TKI4 I gonna always wrenching and chasing setups all the time!Which I am not really happy about!
Question:-what’s the deal with the fuel mileage?Is it true to get worse with this buggy?
-was TKI3 really a better buggy?
-did the Nationals really won with TKI3?
Don’t bite my head off!
Looking for constructive answer!I am not here to bash Kyosho!Just want to clear the water!
They also said (this is Ppl who actually good local racers and tried the TKI4) if I keep the TKI4 I gonna always wrenching and chasing setups all the time!Which I am not really happy about!
Question:-what’s the deal with the fuel mileage?Is it true to get worse with this buggy?
-was TKI3 really a better buggy?
-did the Nationals really won with TKI3?
Don’t bite my head off!
Looking for constructive answer!I am not here to bash Kyosho!Just want to clear the water!
#2178
Tech Master
Hi.
To get the same good feeling with the TKI4 as the TKI3 you need the TKI3 B-plate and 1,3x8 white pistons in the shocks. The B-plate is what makes the BIG differnece in theese two cars. I have not had the TKI2 so i don`t rember what rear hubs were on that car.
Put the TKI3 B-plate on and change the droop settings and the car is awesome! the diffoils you have put in makes the car worse. Use 5-5-3=easy to drive.
If you do not get more than 8:30 with the OS B2101 (if thats what you have) you are either HEAVY on your throttle or your engines is tuned wrong. I run on big tracks here in Norway and gets easely 10. Only car i know thats a fuelhog is the MBX6 and 7. The best car for fuel economy is the Losi 8ight, but thats the only thing good with that car, LOL :-)
To get the same good feeling with the TKI4 as the TKI3 you need the TKI3 B-plate and 1,3x8 white pistons in the shocks. The B-plate is what makes the BIG differnece in theese two cars. I have not had the TKI2 so i don`t rember what rear hubs were on that car.
Put the TKI3 B-plate on and change the droop settings and the car is awesome! the diffoils you have put in makes the car worse. Use 5-5-3=easy to drive.
If you do not get more than 8:30 with the OS B2101 (if thats what you have) you are either HEAVY on your throttle or your engines is tuned wrong. I run on big tracks here in Norway and gets easely 10. Only car i know thats a fuelhog is the MBX6 and 7. The best car for fuel economy is the Losi 8ight, but thats the only thing good with that car, LOL :-)
#2179
Tech Master
iTrader: (21)
You also might want to use the TKI3 steering knuckles. And if you want even a smoother steering feel, try the 16 degree aluminum c-hubs. Or if you don’t want to spend the coin on those, try the 17.5 degree plastic. There’s not a major difference in driving feel between the TKI3 and 4 other then a couple option parts that changes the feel.
#2180
Tech Addict
iTrader: (12)
TKI4 changes
Great info!Thank you!I do have the gunmetal 16 deg C-hub carrier.I did not know about the B plate!Can somebody stear my to a good setup sheet with the tk3 b plate?
Also I can’t remember if it was the pistons with the 1.3mm holes or not?I remember the one what I used was the white machined ones which came with the kit.
Thx again!
Also I can’t remember if it was the pistons with the 1.3mm holes or not?I remember the one what I used was the white machined ones which came with the kit.
Thx again!
#2181
Tech Master
You also might want to use the TKI3 steering knuckles. And if you want even a smoother steering feel, try the 16 degree aluminum c-hubs. Or if you don’t want to spend the coin on those, try the 17.5 degree plastic. There’s not a major difference in driving feel between the TKI3 and 4 other then a couple option parts that changes the feel.
#2184
Tech Champion
iTrader: (32)
I just won a race where I got 11min on my final pit running a Triton L3. I never ran a TKI3 but I don't feel the TKI4 is behind by any means. One thing I made sure not to do just yet was go to the TKI3 front pieces until I was totally comfortable with all stock TKI4 parts. Chasing that 10min fuel window will eat at you. I get 10+ minutes all the time while practicing but could get the same mileage in the main. Maybe I don't push it as hard in practice as I do in the main or if I crash I gas it while on my lid so that the marshal see's me. It can be a number of things that add to the reason of less mileage. I love this car compared to all that I came into Nitro just a little over a year ago. TLR 3.0, MBX7R, D815, TKI4.....AKA HAPPINESS
#2185
Tech Master
iTrader: (21)
Just because the 3 knuckles gives more steering doesn’t mean it makes it harder to drive. The 3 knuckles combined with the 16 degree hubs feels the best for ME. He can easily try both and see what’s best for him. My smoother feel reply was more towards the 16 degrees opposed to the 13 degree
#2186
Tech Elite
iTrader: (1)
Hello everyone!I just got back into the hobby after 6 years off!I had a TKi2 when I quit!Really loved it!I also read a lot of good things about the TK3 while during my off!So few months ago I decided to get Kyosho again to start with!Went and I got a TKI4 Nitro roller and a TKI4E .Had fun building it!I put a setup what the factory suggested!Beside I am very rusty both buggy felt very hard to drive so I decided changing setups!Took away steering ,went up on diff fluid (5-5-7) etc etc did help a little bit but still not where I want to be!Buggy still feels a little hard to drive!It’s just not the same forgiving as the TKi2 was!The gas mileage is bad too!OS speed with 2090 pipe max 8:30min.Same engine setup tuned by same guy on a different brand buggy gets 10:00min....But than few friends telling me to not chew myself up because Kyosho really moved to the wrong direction with the TKI4!Its totally different than a TKI3 what everyone loved!My response was than how come the Nationals won by this buggy than?They say bc the guy actually ran the TKI3 not the TKI4!
They also said (this is Ppl who actually good local racers and tried the TKI4) if I keep the TKI4 I gonna always wrenching and chasing setups all the time!Which I am not really happy about!
Question:-what’s the deal with the fuel mileage?Is it true to get worse with this buggy?
-was TKI3 really a better buggy?
-did the Nationals really won with TKI3?
Don’t bite my head off!
Looking for constructive answer!I am not here to bash Kyosho!Just want to clear the water!
They also said (this is Ppl who actually good local racers and tried the TKI4) if I keep the TKI4 I gonna always wrenching and chasing setups all the time!Which I am not really happy about!
Question:-what’s the deal with the fuel mileage?Is it true to get worse with this buggy?
-was TKI3 really a better buggy?
-did the Nationals really won with TKI3?
Don’t bite my head off!
Looking for constructive answer!I am not here to bash Kyosho!Just want to clear the water!
The TKI3 wasn't better than the TKI4, the TKI4 was a step in the good direction only thing I don't like are the stock pistons being the same front and rear, they shouldn't be because of how the shocks are mounted. Setup skills are scarce amongst pros, not that I'm a setup god but i know a thing or two. That being said, I've spent 30 minutes every day of this week at the track perfecting my setup. And I did perfect it and learned some things.
First, the stock setup is aimed at giving lots of corner entry steering, too much actually and the front loses grip too fast. To tune this use the HT-LR V5 setup I'm going to put on the wiki above this page. Really the biggest difference between the 3 and the 4 is that you can't run 11 degrees of kick up on the 4 stock, period. Second, if runtime is an issue the problem is from your driving or building skills, sorry to say this but here's a tip, if you want to increase runtime use the throttle sparingly. Hold off throttle as much as you can, brake deep into the corners (not before) and power once you finished the corner, not sooner. Will take time to master this technique called trail braking but 100% worth it.
You also might want to use the TKI3 steering knuckles. And if you want even a smoother steering feel, try the 16 degree aluminum c-hubs. Or if you don’t want to spend the coin on those, try the 17.5 degree plastic. There’s not a major difference in driving feel between the TKI3 and 4 other then a couple option parts that changes the feel.
I just won a race where I got 11min on my final pit running a Triton L3. I never ran a TKI3 but I don't feel the TKI4 is behind by any means. One thing I made sure not to do just yet was go to the TKI3 front pieces until I was totally comfortable with all stock TKI4 parts. Chasing that 10min fuel window will eat at you. I get 10+ minutes all the time while practicing but could get the same mileage in the main. Maybe I don't push it as hard in practice as I do in the main or if I crash I gas it while on my lid so that the marshal see's me. It can be a number of things that add to the reason of less mileage. I love this car compared to all that I came into Nitro just a little over a year ago. TLR 3.0, MBX7R, D815, TKI4.....AKA HAPPINESS
----//-----
About the testing I've made during this week, I wanted to see why the TKI3 parts were used. Using my TKI3 as the test mule:
- A spec setup, easy to drive but slow. Why? The front end is numb but the grip balance is good, while having lower grip than the setup I ended using today.
- less kick up. Very good change, the front end had more grip on braking and acceleration transients.
- longer front upper arm so it has the same length as the rear, major change! Everything went bananas, almost no steering into the corner and too much exit.
- orange rear springs, consistent but not better overall.
- HRC D plate bushing, small change.
- 2.5mm front roll bar not good, too stiff.
- 2.3mm rear roll bar with 2.5mm front roll bar, not good.
- 2.3/2.3, meh. (want to try 2.5/2.5).
- 2.3mm front roll bar with 2.5mm rear roll bar (stock), a bit better.
- #2 hole on the rear shock tower, everything better. Tears of joy, champagne for everyone and fireworks. Front grip, rear grip and corner speed was better.
Last edited by 30Tooth; 12-20-2017 at 04:27 PM.
#2188
Tech Master
Not going to agrue With you, but there is a differnece in ackerman even if the steering trow is the same.. you will see that there is a differnece in how much the Outer Wheel turns compoared to the inner Wheel.
Disclaimer - I'm going to be blunt, nothing against you sir.
The TKI3 wasn't better than the TKI4, the TKI4 was a step in the good direction only thing I don't like are the stock pistons being the same front and rear, they shouldn't be because of how the shocks are mounted. Setup skills are scarce amongst pros, not that I'm a setup god but i know a thing or two. That being said, I've spent 30 minutes every day of this week at the track perfecting my setup. And I did perfect it and learned some things.
First, the stock setup is aimed at giving lots of corner entry steering, too much actually and the front loses grip too fast. To tune this use the HT-LR V5 setup I'm going to put on the wiki above this page. Really the biggest difference between the 3 and the 4 is that you can't run 11 degrees of kick up on the 4 stock, period. Second, if runtime is an issue the problem is from your driving or building skills, sorry to say this but here's a tip, if you want to increase runtime use the throttle sparingly. Hold off throttle as much as you can, brake deep into the corners (not before) and power once you finished the corner, not sooner. Will take time to master this technique called trail braking but 100% worth it.
Sir allow me to disagree with you regarding the need to buy TKI3 knuckles. The 17.5* caster blocks are inexpensive and good to have on hand, other than that nothing is really needed maybe 8 hole pistons but definitely not the TKI3 knuckles IMO.
I have both cars and the steering angle isn't different without using tools to measure, only the bump steer because of the kick up change. BTW the bump steer curve is more consistent on the TKI4. I think that's the reason most feel the 3 has better steering when it really doesn't, it's just the the 4 doesn't shine as good as it can.
You already have the pills why not try more kick up on your car? Dot up and in on the A plate
So are you using the stock TKI4 parts yet?
----//-----
About the testing I've made during this week, I wanted to see why the TKI3 parts were used. Using my TKI3 as the test mule:
- A spec setup, easy to drive but slow. Why? The front end is numb but the grip balance is good, while having lower grip than the setup I ended using today.
- less kick up. Very good change, the front end had more grip on braking and acceleration transients.
- longer front upper arm so it has the same length as the rear, major change! Everything went bananas, almost no steering into the corner and too much exit.
- orange rear springs, consistent but not better overall.
- HRC D plate bushing, small change.
- 2.5mm front roll bar not good, too stiff.
- 2.3mm rear roll bar with 2.5mm front roll bar, not good.
- 2.3/2.3, meh. (want to try 2.5/2.5).
- 2.3mm front roll bar with 2.5mm rear roll bar (stock), a bit better.
- #2 hole on the rear shock tower, everything better. Tears of joy, champagne for everyone and fireworks. Front grip, rear grip and corner speed was better.
The TKI3 wasn't better than the TKI4, the TKI4 was a step in the good direction only thing I don't like are the stock pistons being the same front and rear, they shouldn't be because of how the shocks are mounted. Setup skills are scarce amongst pros, not that I'm a setup god but i know a thing or two. That being said, I've spent 30 minutes every day of this week at the track perfecting my setup. And I did perfect it and learned some things.
First, the stock setup is aimed at giving lots of corner entry steering, too much actually and the front loses grip too fast. To tune this use the HT-LR V5 setup I'm going to put on the wiki above this page. Really the biggest difference between the 3 and the 4 is that you can't run 11 degrees of kick up on the 4 stock, period. Second, if runtime is an issue the problem is from your driving or building skills, sorry to say this but here's a tip, if you want to increase runtime use the throttle sparingly. Hold off throttle as much as you can, brake deep into the corners (not before) and power once you finished the corner, not sooner. Will take time to master this technique called trail braking but 100% worth it.
Sir allow me to disagree with you regarding the need to buy TKI3 knuckles. The 17.5* caster blocks are inexpensive and good to have on hand, other than that nothing is really needed maybe 8 hole pistons but definitely not the TKI3 knuckles IMO.
I have both cars and the steering angle isn't different without using tools to measure, only the bump steer because of the kick up change. BTW the bump steer curve is more consistent on the TKI4. I think that's the reason most feel the 3 has better steering when it really doesn't, it's just the the 4 doesn't shine as good as it can.
You already have the pills why not try more kick up on your car? Dot up and in on the A plate
So are you using the stock TKI4 parts yet?
----//-----
About the testing I've made during this week, I wanted to see why the TKI3 parts were used. Using my TKI3 as the test mule:
- A spec setup, easy to drive but slow. Why? The front end is numb but the grip balance is good, while having lower grip than the setup I ended using today.
- less kick up. Very good change, the front end had more grip on braking and acceleration transients.
- longer front upper arm so it has the same length as the rear, major change! Everything went bananas, almost no steering into the corner and too much exit.
- orange rear springs, consistent but not better overall.
- HRC D plate bushing, small change.
- 2.5mm front roll bar not good, too stiff.
- 2.3mm rear roll bar with 2.5mm front roll bar, not good.
- 2.3/2.3, meh. (want to try 2.5/2.5).
- 2.3mm front roll bar with 2.5mm rear roll bar (stock), a bit better.
- #2 hole on the rear shock tower, everything better. Tears of joy, champagne for everyone and fireworks. Front grip, rear grip and corner speed was better.
#2189
Tech Master
Just because the 3 knuckles gives more steering doesn’t mean it makes it harder to drive. The 3 knuckles combined with the 16 degree hubs feels the best for ME. He can easily try both and see what’s best for him. My smoother feel reply was more towards the 16 degrees opposed to the 13 degree
I still belive that a very easy car to drive is the TKI4 With the B-plate from TKI3 if the cars have the same setup.
On anither note, why not buy the 17.5 plastic castorblock and test. It is cheap compared to 16 degree alu castorblock.
#2190
Tech Master
I did use the front to adjust the steering or how the car comes araound the corners, but this summer i have been using different rear toe settings and antisquat more and more to achive the same.
Here is the order of how i adjust my cars when i hit a New track:
Antirollbars.
Front and rear camberlinks, upper arms.
Last, i adjust toe or antisquat.
After this, i start messing B-plates, castorblocks, knuckles and diffs.