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Another TKI thread, more TKI4 Specific http://www.rctech.net/forum/nitro-of...buggy-kit.html

TKI4 Replacement Parts (Good for upgrading from TKI3) http://www.kyoshoamerica.com/Replace...ts_c_1505.html

TKI4 Optional Parts http://www.kyoshoamerica.com/Option-Parts_c_1506.html

Some notes on the new Towers/Long shocks here

Picked up a TKI3 and want to upgrade to TKI4 ? Here are all the updated parts:

Shocks

IF347-155 1.5X5 Pistons
IF471-01 Front Shock Body
IF470-01 Rear Shock Body
IF470-03BK Shock Adjust Dial
IFW154 Boots
IF346-05C Shock End Set

Wing

IF491BK Wing
IFW460B Wing Mount/Stay

Rear End

IFH006W Wheel
IF490 HUB
IF490-01 Hub Insert
IF492 Shock Pin
IF423HB Rear Arm
IF287 Hard Upper Rod Rear

Front End

IF489 Steering Rod Set
IF488 Knuckles
IF487H Front Arm
IFW458 Hard Lower Pin
IFW425 93MM CVD
IF286 Hard Upper Rod
IF486 Lower Susp Holder
IFW459 Servo Saver (Hard)
IF446B Ackerman Arm
IF426-64.5 Susp Shaft

Other

IF469B Filter
97035LW-13 Clutch Bell
IF453B Body Mount
IFW107GM Hexes
W300910 Washer
IF443B Center Diff Plate
IF444C Tank
IF479B Radio Box
96772 13x16x0.15mm Shim
IF481B Fuel Tank Stay
IFW336GM Wheelnut
IFB008 TKI4 Body
IFD403W TKI4 Decal

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Old 01-09-2013, 03:16 PM
  #12856  
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Originally Posted by AZRC4Me
This is what I ran there last year:

https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B-c...DJtOGFhZVFyaVk

If I had it to do over again, I may try grey springs up front and 7k in the front diff, and might change rear shock oil depending on temps. But I remember my car being super dialed there, especially in the main.
Do you remeber what the weather temperature was when you were running the 45 / 30 shock oil?
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Old 01-09-2013, 03:28 PM
  #12857  
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Originally Posted by pitpop
this one works well for blown out:

http://www.codykingrc.com/category/m...loose_surface/

In addition you might try 4k in the center if it's really rough..
Mr. King, some people have said yes some people said no. Have you ever noticed that the break rotors on the tki3 seem like they are warped and won't let the car stop smoothly. When rolling my car by hand and applying the brakes, they seem very grabby like there are high and low spots on the disk. I've ruled out everything but the disk becaused hand grinding it on a flat grinding stone minimizes the problem some. I've tried 3 different rotos, one vented. Thank you for any light you can shed on this frustrating problem.
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Old 01-09-2013, 03:34 PM
  #12858  
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Originally Posted by My ST-RR EVO
Mr. King, some people have said yes some people said no. Have you ever noticed that the break rotors on the tki3 seem like they are warped and won't let the car stop smoothly. When rolling my car by hand and applying the brakes, they seem very grabby like there are high and low spots on the disk. I've ruled out everything but the disk becaused hand grinding it on a flat grinding stone minimizes the problem some. I've tried 3 different rotos, one vented. Thank you for any light you can shed on this frustrating problem.
My last set of rotors and discs were really grabby just like you describe. They would hold tight then release and act very inconsistent. I used a dremel to grind a chamfer around the edges of the pad and everything was solved.
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Old 01-09-2013, 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by My ST-RR EVO
Do you remeber what the weather temperature was when you were running the 45 / 30 shock oil?
Not exactly, but it was at night, probably about 60-65F out I would say.

In response to the brake rotors, they aren't warped. And the chances of them being machined wrong on a lathe are slim to none. I can say this with absolute certainty.

The company I work for, StopTech Brakes, has a technical white paper on it's website that addresses this very topic for full size vehicles (our MP9 brakes are very similar to 1:1 braking systems, minus the hydraulic caliper). I invite you to grab a cup of coffee or a tall cold one and give it a read:

The Warped Brake Disc Myth

This was written by Carroll Smith, author of books like "Prepare to Win", "Drive to Win", "Tune to Win", etc.

Cliffs notes version, there is an uneven transfer layer of pad material on the surface of the rotor - that's why grinding the surface might alleviate the problem - you're essentially removing the very thin transfer layer from the rotor. The uneven transfer layer comes from not bedding the braking system in properly, or getting the braking system hot and leaving the pads clamped on the rotors.

The slotted rotors tend to grab the pad material too much and give an inconsistent feel to the braking system. I would prefer to see a chamfer machined into the slots/holes at the surface, but this would probably make them cost prohibitive.
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Old 01-09-2013, 04:26 PM
  #12860  
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Originally Posted by SEF
White is tapered with straight holes.

Black is tapered with holes drilled at a 45 degree angle.

Get the whites. Black slow down the shock compression and rebound since the holes are drilled at an angle. I have a set of both and I didn't like the black pistons when I tried them. They would probably work better for fast smooth tracks.
Thanks Sef, mines came with the stock black ones 1.2/8 and it runs pretty good but now I can't wait to try the 1.3/8w.
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Old 01-09-2013, 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted by AZRC4Me
Not exactly, but it was at night, probably about 60-65F out I would say.

In response to the brake rotors, they aren't warped. And the chances of them being machined wrong on a lathe are slim to none. I can say this with absolute certainty.

The company I work for, StopTech Brakes, has a technical white paper on it's website that addresses this very topic for full size vehicles (our MP9 brakes are very similar to 1:1 braking systems, minus the hydraulic caliper). I invite you to grab a cup of coffee or a tall cold one and give it a read:

The Warped Brake Disc Myth

This was written by Carroll Smith, author of books like "Prepare to Win", "Drive to Win", "Tune to Win", etc.

Cliffs notes version, there is an uneven transfer layer of pad material on the surface of the rotor - that's why grinding the surface might alleviate the problem - you're essentially removing the very thin transfer layer from the rotor. The uneven transfer layer comes from not bedding the braking system in properly, or getting the braking system hot and leaving the pads clamped on the rotors.

The slotted rotors tend to grab the pad material too much and give an inconsistent feel to the braking system. I would prefer to see a chamfer machined into the slots/holes at the surface, but this would probably make them cost prohibitive.
Thank you Sean! That was a great article that addresses the problem nicely. Is it typical for people in the r/c industry to take the special steps to "break in" their brakes as described in that article? Or do you think they just build and drive and by happenstance of the lay out of the track they race on they get the slowing down from progressively higher speeds with cool down in between and it all happens by luck?
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:10 PM
  #12862  
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Originally Posted by SEF
My last set of rotors and discs were really grabby just like you describe. They would hold tight then release and act very inconsistent. I used a dremel to grind a chamfer around the edges of the pad and everything was solved.
Thank you. I remember many pages back another poster recommended that as well, however, it didn't really work. I'll try more of a chamferred edge. After reading the article Sean posted, I'm wondering if chamerfing the edges of the pad ground off the layer of unevenly deposited brake pad material from the rotor and that's how it got fixed. Well, time for some R&D.
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:10 PM
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Default Fuel Capacity

Hey all, can someone shed some light on how the tech the fuel capacity on the truggy and buggy?
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:15 PM
  #12864  
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Originally Posted by Speedracer1600
Hey all, can someone shed some light on how the tech the fuel capacity on the truggy and buggy?
They have a scientific flask with a maximum measurement line on it. They basically use a small fish tank pump connected to your fuel lines to remove all the fuel in the lines and the tank. If it goes over the line on the neck of flask, then it's too much. I saw quite a few guys with kyosho's at the nats last year get dinged because of having too much fuel line causing it to go over the limit.
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:23 PM
  #12865  
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Originally Posted by Speedracer1600
Hey all, can someone shed some light on how the tech the fuel capacity on the truggy and buggy?
At races I've been where they actually tech, they make you fill the tank up completely including the fuel tubing and fuel filter. Then they use a fish aquarium pump to pump out all the fuel into a graduated cylinder.

A side story: the guy in front of me that needed to be teched actually asked for his fuel back even after we told him that the graduated cylinder has been cycled with other fuels and never cleaned. Guess when you spend this much on the hobby, you need to save wherever you can
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:30 PM
  #12866  
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Originally Posted by AZRC4Me
Not exactly, but it was at night, probably about 60-65F out I would say.

In response to the brake rotors, they aren't warped. And the chances of them being machined wrong on a lathe are slim to none. I can say this with absolute certainty.

The company I work for, StopTech Brakes, has a technical white paper on it's website that addresses this very topic for full size vehicles (our MP9 brakes are very similar to 1:1 braking systems, minus the hydraulic caliper). I invite you to grab a cup of coffee or a tall cold one and give it a read:

The Warped Brake Disc Myth

This was written by Carroll Smith, author of books like "Prepare to Win", "Drive to Win", "Tune to Win", etc.

Cliffs notes version, there is an uneven transfer layer of pad material on the surface of the rotor - that's why grinding the surface might alleviate the problem - you're essentially removing the very thin transfer layer from the rotor. The uneven transfer layer comes from not bedding the braking system in properly, or getting the braking system hot and leaving the pads clamped on the rotors.

The slotted rotors tend to grab the pad material too much and give an inconsistent feel to the braking system. I would prefer to see a chamfer machined into the slots/holes at the surface, but this would probably make them cost prohibitive.
Oh Carrol Smith. He is a man of very few and mild opinions... hahahaha.

Love his books.

Its amazing how much you can take from "real car" prep and transfer it over to our "toy cars".
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:33 PM
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awesome thank you guys, are the limits still 125 and 150?
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:46 PM
  #12868  
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Originally Posted by My ST-RR EVO
Thank you Sean! That was a great article that addresses the problem nicely. Is it typical for people in the r/c industry to take the special steps to "break in" their brakes as described in that article? Or do you think they just build and drive and by happenstance of the lay out of the track they race on they get the slowing down from progressively higher speeds with cool down in between and it all happens by luck?
You know, I never have, but it stands to reason it might be a decent idea to try it. I'm just guessing the problem is more evident in guys with a driving style where they use a lot of brakes. I was thinking about this last night when I was running, and I realized I only use my brakes at the end of the straight at Revelation on the current layout, and even there, it's only to set the front end. If I ever find myself using a lot of brake, it's usually because I'm overdriving the corners.

Honestly, it's possible it isn't an uneven transfer layer on the rotor, it could be a faulty servo, something in the pads, etc. The only real way to know for sure would be to get an SEM done of the brake disc to see if any pad deposits are present. I know a company down here that'll do that for about $650...any volunteers?

Originally Posted by toyoter91
Oh Carrol Smith. He is a man of very few and mild opinions... hahahaha.

Love his books.

Its amazing how much you can take from "real car" prep and transfer it over to our "toy cars".
Agreed, Carroll Smith is the man, such wisdom. Physics is physics man, doesn't matter how small the race car is.
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Old 01-09-2013, 06:00 PM
  #12869  
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Here's a cool new piece:





No p/n yet, but I'm sure it'll be out shortly.
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Old 01-09-2013, 08:50 PM
  #12870  
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Originally Posted by AZRC4Me
Here's a cool new piece:





No p/n yet, but I'm sure it'll be out shortly.
are you running metal chassis braces ? i thought everyone had basically come to the consensus they took out to much flex ?
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