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Another TKI thread, more TKI4 Specific http://www.rctech.net/forum/nitro-of...buggy-kit.html

TKI4 Replacement Parts (Good for upgrading from TKI3) http://www.kyoshoamerica.com/Replace...ts_c_1505.html

TKI4 Optional Parts http://www.kyoshoamerica.com/Option-Parts_c_1506.html

Some notes on the new Towers/Long shocks here

Picked up a TKI3 and want to upgrade to TKI4 ? Here are all the updated parts:

Shocks

IF347-155 1.5X5 Pistons
IF471-01 Front Shock Body
IF470-01 Rear Shock Body
IF470-03BK Shock Adjust Dial
IFW154 Boots
IF346-05C Shock End Set

Wing

IF491BK Wing
IFW460B Wing Mount/Stay

Rear End

IFH006W Wheel
IF490 HUB
IF490-01 Hub Insert
IF492 Shock Pin
IF423HB Rear Arm
IF287 Hard Upper Rod Rear

Front End

IF489 Steering Rod Set
IF488 Knuckles
IF487H Front Arm
IFW458 Hard Lower Pin
IFW425 93MM CVD
IF286 Hard Upper Rod
IF486 Lower Susp Holder
IFW459 Servo Saver (Hard)
IF446B Ackerman Arm
IF426-64.5 Susp Shaft

Other

IF469B Filter
97035LW-13 Clutch Bell
IF453B Body Mount
IFW107GM Hexes
W300910 Washer
IF443B Center Diff Plate
IF444C Tank
IF479B Radio Box
96772 13x16x0.15mm Shim
IF481B Fuel Tank Stay
IFW336GM Wheelnut
IFB008 TKI4 Body
IFD403W TKI4 Decal

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Old 08-14-2014, 08:18 PM
  #17701  
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Looking for some more set up advice. Running Tebos Silver State set up. Having troubles keeping the rear end planted anytime I am turning whaile on the throttle. If I baby the throttle the entire turn and I mean baby, the rear will stay planted. Anytime I want a little extra throttle the rear end swings out. I find it very twitchy under reasonably hard throttle. How can I get the rear end planted more?

I have bumped the anti-squat down to 1 degree as track is fairly bumpy and usually has a fine layer of dirt on top.

Played around with the rear roll center on the shock tower, between 8,9,10. Seem to like 9. Played around with every shock position, seem stuck on 2nd from outside and in (rear). 4K in center diff as track gets pretty blown out.

Was also looking for an easier explanation of roll center. What's the difference between running the H's in the lower hinge pins vs, just playing with the rear shock tower?

Sometimes trying to figure out which direction to go when tuning can be very frustrating and intimidating. Looking for some help.. Thanks

Last edited by RiPPeN302; 08-14-2014 at 08:39 PM.
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Old 08-15-2014, 01:29 AM
  #17702  
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To start, make sure you have no bent hinge pins or shock shafts and that your shocks are freshly rebuilt with the right oils and pistons and diffs too.

I ran that set up about 8 months ago and it worked well at one track. On another track that always has a loose layer of fine dirt on it the car didn't want to turn tight. It would drift wide, but the back end wouldn't kick out like you're describing.

Double check your sway bars to ensure they can pivot in the mounts, but aren't sloppy. If I remember correctly Tebo calls for 3mm on the rear sway bar. Getting rid of those mm's on both sway bars got the car to turn tighter. Maybe try 1 or 0 mm on the rear bar.

verify rear toe... 3 degrees upside down dot out.

Drive cups not binding up the suspension

max wheelbase

tires are key as well

Last edited by My ST-RR EVO; 08-15-2014 at 01:44 AM.
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Old 08-15-2014, 02:27 AM
  #17703  
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Originally Posted by RiPPeN302
Looking for some more set up advice. Running Tebos Silver State set up. Having troubles keeping the rear end planted anytime I am turning whaile on the throttle. If I baby the throttle the entire turn and I mean baby, the rear will stay planted. Anytime I want a little extra throttle the rear end swings out. I find it very twitchy under reasonably hard throttle. How can I get the rear end planted more?

I have bumped the anti-squat down to 1 degree as track is fairly bumpy and usually has a fine layer of dirt on top.

Played around with the rear roll center on the shock tower, between 8,9,10. Seem to like 9. Played around with every shock position, seem stuck on 2nd from outside and in (rear). 4K in center diff as track gets pretty blown out.

Was also looking for an easier explanation of roll center. What's the difference between running the H's in the lower hinge pins vs, just playing with the rear shock tower?

Sometimes trying to figure out which direction to go when tuning can be very frustrating and intimidating. Looking for some help.. Thanks
When you move the camber link up (lower roll center) or down (higher roll center) on the tower, you also affect camber rise

The rear toe block in the roll center Low position is the normal one you always see. Re-orientating the rear toe block for higher roll center (hinge pin is higher- identified by dot down) or lower roll center (hinge pin is lower, dot up) affects only roll center, not camber rise. It's not that simple though because it's not "only". Rear ride height will need to be reset because the rear of the car will drop as the hinge pin is raised and droop will need to be reset as well since the arm is higher than 'normal' and subsequently changes the distance between the droop screw and the chassis. Easy to do though.

I did some testing with the high roll center via the rear toe block and I coudn't get the handling balance of the car right and have given up on that adjustment for now.

Someone put a great video up on Youtube explaining the effect of raising or lowering the rear upper link on the tower...

http://youtu.be/tWdRQaz_Xq8
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Old 08-15-2014, 06:27 AM
  #17704  
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Thanks so much MAX ST-RR EVO.

I would like to try extending the wheel base. The track is quite small and technical so I am iffy on changing this. Is it quite a dramatic difference between a mm or two?
Going to try 10 on the rear roll center, play around with rear sway bar and extend wheel base some. If I still can't get the handling I want with the rear, any other suggestions?

Arms, hinge pins and everything are free. Just went through the entire thing.
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Old 08-15-2014, 06:23 PM
  #17705  
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Originally Posted by RiPPeN302
Thanks so much MAX ST-RR EVO.

I would like to try extending the wheel base. The track is quite small and technical so I am iffy on changing this. Is it quite a dramatic difference between a mm or two?
Going to try 10 on the rear roll center, play around with rear sway bar and extend wheel base some. If I still can't get the handling I want with the rear, any other suggestions?

Arms, hinge pins and everything are free. Just went through the entire thing.
HI

There was a similar request for more exit grip a few pages back , this was Sean Gaffneys reply, which i found really helpful. Thanks Sean

--Change rear diff to 2k or 1k. This will help get the car into the corners better off power, and allow you to get on power sooner without worrying about on-power oversteer as much.
--Change center diff to 4k. When the track gets rough, dropping the center oil makes the car easier to drive overall.
--Go up in rear shock oil to 32.5 losi. Your car looked a bit unsettled in the rear and I attribute that to a very rough track and thin shock oil (30 is thin imo). The result is an under-damped shock package that appears bouncy on track (oil is not thick enough to dampen the spring force).
--Run the narrow wheel hexes in the rear. This will help lock the rear end in more.
--Try the H setting for the upper hinge pins in the front. Remember to flip the back bushings as well so the holes are at the top when running the H. I tend to prefer the H setting on lower grip surfaces as it allows the front end to roll more entering a corner, and gives the feeling of more grip when cornering, rather than the plow effect (wheels turned but car goes straight, i.e. push).
--Experiment with rear hub position. You will find that the more rearward you move the hubs, the car will want to oversteer on power and push off power. The more forward you move them, it should push on power and oversteer off power. The caveat is balancing traction with bump handling, as longer wheelbases tend to handle rougher tracks better.
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Old 08-15-2014, 08:48 PM
  #17706  
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Originally Posted by Soapy
Hi Guys,
I have a setup question for you's...

I have recently installed the alloy 13 Deg Caster blocks and have noticed a small amount of up/down play between the knuckle and the caster block.
My question is if I shimmed the play out of it, what would the effects be with the knuckle in the highest position (shims at bottom of knuckle) vs knuckle in the lowest position (shims at the top of the knuckle).
I've been trying to work it out but it really has never been a setup option at all on buggies and was wandering what our kyosho gurus thought of this.
Looking forward to some replies on this one.
Anyone??
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Old 08-15-2014, 09:02 PM
  #17707  
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How much play are you talking about? I can't imagine enough play to make a noticeable difference. Almost seems like it would be a very small bump steer adjustment, but the play should be fairly small to where you probably wouldn't feel a difference. A small amount of play is normal.
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Old 08-16-2014, 01:15 AM
  #17708  
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Originally Posted by RiPPeN302
Thanks so much MAX ST-RR EVO.

I would like to try extending the wheel base. The track is quite small and technical so I am iffy on changing this. Is it quite a dramatic difference between a mm or two?
Going to try 10 on the rear roll center, play around with rear sway bar and extend wheel base some. If I still can't get the handling I want with the rear, any other suggestions?

Arms, hinge pins and everything are free. Just went through the entire thing.
The difference is noticeable. It's such a quick and easy adjustment it's definately worth your time to try it. After reviewing Gaffney's statement about how on power or off power turning is affected by wheelbase I will have to go back and retest myself as I have really only done it for off power reasons and assumed it would be the same for off or on power. I specifically remember adjusting for a section of track that had a tight right after a short shoot and the shorter wheelbase (Tebo's silver state... I think it was 2f / 3r) made the rear step out and yes it was off power turn in at that point and the max wheel base immediately fixed that issue. I guess it didn't occur to me to see what it was doing on power.

You can also try shocks out on the rear arm and center hole on the tower.

What tires are you using?

As always verify your ride height.
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Old 08-16-2014, 02:07 AM
  #17709  
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Just a question, is anyone using OFNA or Agama outdrives on the front of their MP9? Anyone found a different gearset for diffs thats not in aluminium but steel?
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Old 08-16-2014, 03:33 AM
  #17710  
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Originally Posted by Soapy
Anyone??
I shimmed mine once it got a season old. Think it took a 0.15 mm shim , I put it on top only because it was too fiddly to put underneath. I wouldn't think its be noticeable in handling as on 1/10 buggy you usually move up and down in 0.5 or 1mm increments.
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Old 08-16-2014, 03:40 AM
  #17711  
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Originally Posted by My ST-RR EVO
The difference is noticeable. It's such a quick and easy adjustment it's definately worth your time to try it. After reviewing Gaffney's statement about how on power or off power turning is affected by wheelbase I will have to go back and retest myself as I have really only done it for off power reasons and assumed it would be the same for off or on power. I specifically remember adjusting for a section of track that had a tight right after a short shoot and the shorter wheelbase (Tebo's silver state... I think it was 2f / 3r) made the rear step out and yes it was off power turn in at that point and the max wheel base immediately fixed that issue. I guess it didn't occur to me to see what it was doing on power.

You can also try shocks out on the rear arm and center hole on the tower.

What tires are you using?

As always verify your ride height.
Hey STRR.
Funny how wheelbase works on the MP9, on my Mugens I used to go to longer wheelbase to give it more steering in and out.
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Old 08-16-2014, 06:13 AM
  #17712  
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Originally Posted by WillF
I shimmed mine once it got a season old. Think it took a 0.15 mm shim , I put it on top only because it was too fiddly to put underneath. I wouldn't think its be noticeable in handling as on 1/10 buggy you usually move up and down in 0.5 or 1mm increments.
Lets just say there was a big gap for example, what would the difference be by shimming the knuckle up vs down in handling.
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Old 08-16-2014, 02:55 PM
  #17713  
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The only vehicle I see this as a option is a 2wd 1/10.
From AEs B4 handling guide in the manual it says-
Raising the axle will give -
less steering entering corners
more steering exiting corners
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Old 08-16-2014, 05:15 PM
  #17714  
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Cheers Willf
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Old 08-17-2014, 11:45 AM
  #17715  
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Hi, here is another vid of my TKI3 on a rough local track

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qAF...ature=youtu.be

as usually the car did great, since I race this buggy I always made it to the podium whatever the conditions/ tires/ track.. didn't break a single part either since the beginning of the season

this is a buggy that makes you look like a better driver, sometimes it's not even fair

don't hesitate to suggest some ways to improve my laptimes/ setup, as said earlier I just began nitro
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