Official Team Associated Rival Monster Truck Thread
#751
Tech Rookie
ESC
OK, I am an old skool nitro racer(sponsored) been out of the hobby for 10 years.
Bought a Rival for bashing purposes. My first electric since '94.
Wow tech has come a long ways, and I have a lot to learn about brushless.
Want to go lipo. Question about the stock esc.
Says it rated for 2s x2, but then it has cell detect to detect 2s or 3s.
Can I use 3s x2 with this esc?
Motor claims to be rated for 3-4s.
And how hard will it be to fit 3s packs in the tray?
TIA, Steve
Bought a Rival for bashing purposes. My first electric since '94.
Wow tech has come a long ways, and I have a lot to learn about brushless.
Want to go lipo. Question about the stock esc.
Says it rated for 2s x2, but then it has cell detect to detect 2s or 3s.
Can I use 3s x2 with this esc?
Motor claims to be rated for 3-4s.
And how hard will it be to fit 3s packs in the tray?
TIA, Steve
#752
Tech Master
iTrader: (40)
You will need to get a new ESC/motor combo for 6S. The Rivals factory powertrain is its weakest link. It is an animal of a truck though. I've had a Rival for 8 months now and I use it hard and love it. Everybody and damn brother seems to be a fanboy of the Savage Flux with XL chassis and after years and years of reading about how great they are my curiosity got the best of me and I got one. Now the I have the both of them I can tell you the Rival is a better truck in more ways than not. It handles more truggy like than a Savage so its flickable and more predictable in the air. I can launch my Rival off of jumps that send it 15 feet high and 30 feet long easily. Its kind of like a buggy/truggy in the fact that it mid air corrects nicely and tends to level out almost naturally. I could see selling the Flux XL in favor of another Rival but most likely it will just a Tekno ET48 this time around. BTW the rival is 1/2 inch longer and just as wide as an XL so don't the XL part of it fool you into thinking its a bigger truck, its just a bigger piece of crap.
#753
Tech Rookie
Thanks for the info.
So the batterys are in series?
I have a few issues in the dozen times running the truck stock.
Lost a couple of the rear knuckle bearings(6x12)
Why wouldnt they go with 8mm axles and 8x16 bearings?
Hinge pins are soft, bend easily and bind arms.
The last jump I did was small, 4 ft high 6 ft long of air. Landed flat off power. Broke a shock cap, and pulled the lower hinge pin out of the gear case.
Broke the hinge pin off at the threads.
And that was while landing in 3 inches of snow. Only thing I can think of was snow packed in the arms and maybe bound the suspension on landing.
So the batterys are in series?
I have a few issues in the dozen times running the truck stock.
Lost a couple of the rear knuckle bearings(6x12)
Why wouldnt they go with 8mm axles and 8x16 bearings?
Hinge pins are soft, bend easily and bind arms.
The last jump I did was small, 4 ft high 6 ft long of air. Landed flat off power. Broke a shock cap, and pulled the lower hinge pin out of the gear case.
Broke the hinge pin off at the threads.
And that was while landing in 3 inches of snow. Only thing I can think of was snow packed in the arms and maybe bound the suspension on landing.
#755
Tech Rookie
That was a warm day for a North Dakota winter, Snow was sticky, not the usual powder.
I am surprised I havent read about others with issues with the 6x12 bearings in the knuckles.
I remember that being a problem with a buddies tmaxx with .21 conversion
and I had issues with those on an OFNA Dominator with the Proline Bulkheads to run Tmaxx suspension.
If an 1/8 scale buggy uses 8mm axles, you would think an 1/8 scale 14lb. MT shouldn't have 6mm.
I am surprised I havent read about others with issues with the 6x12 bearings in the knuckles.
I remember that being a problem with a buddies tmaxx with .21 conversion
and I had issues with those on an OFNA Dominator with the Proline Bulkheads to run Tmaxx suspension.
If an 1/8 scale buggy uses 8mm axles, you would think an 1/8 scale 14lb. MT shouldn't have 6mm.
#756
Tech Master
iTrader: (40)
Yes I had my fair share of Nodak winters. I was in Minot for my entire time in the Air Force. Next door in Montana we have it a little better this winter has been worse than normal. Its not uncommon for us to have days in the winter un the upper 50s but not lately. Haven't had the bearing problem.
#757
Tech Rookie
I bought the Rival in Williston.
Like I said, I am a die hard Nitro guy. Bought Electric so I wont have to deal with tuning issues based on weather. I have run the Rival in single digit temps w/o issue.
I liked the fact the Rival was based on a Nitro truck that came out 10 years or so ago.
I just need to figure out this whole brushless lipo business.
I watched videos of 6s lipo's in the Rival, stupid fast. Looks totally like unuseable power. Looks like broken driveline parts, so 6s for me is out of the question.
Is there going to be a difference in performance going from 8.4 mimh to 2s lipo?
Like I said, I am a die hard Nitro guy. Bought Electric so I wont have to deal with tuning issues based on weather. I have run the Rival in single digit temps w/o issue.
I liked the fact the Rival was based on a Nitro truck that came out 10 years or so ago.
I just need to figure out this whole brushless lipo business.
I watched videos of 6s lipo's in the Rival, stupid fast. Looks totally like unuseable power. Looks like broken driveline parts, so 6s for me is out of the question.
Is there going to be a difference in performance going from 8.4 mimh to 2s lipo?
#758
Thanks for the info.
So the batterys are in series?
I have a few issues in the dozen times running the truck stock.
Lost a couple of the rear knuckle bearings(6x12)
Why wouldnt they go with 8mm axles and 8x16 bearings?
Hinge pins are soft, bend easily and bind arms.
The last jump I did was small, 4 ft high 6 ft long of air. Landed flat off power. Broke a shock cap, and pulled the lower hinge pin out of the gear case.
Broke the hinge pin off at the threads.
And that was while landing in 3 inches of snow. Only thing I can think of was snow packed in the arms and maybe bound the suspension on landing.
So the batterys are in series?
I have a few issues in the dozen times running the truck stock.
Lost a couple of the rear knuckle bearings(6x12)
Why wouldnt they go with 8mm axles and 8x16 bearings?
Hinge pins are soft, bend easily and bind arms.
The last jump I did was small, 4 ft high 6 ft long of air. Landed flat off power. Broke a shock cap, and pulled the lower hinge pin out of the gear case.
Broke the hinge pin off at the threads.
And that was while landing in 3 inches of snow. Only thing I can think of was snow packed in the arms and maybe bound the suspension on landing.
#759
Tech Rookie
When I first noticed the hinge pin problem, I thought the springs got weak, truck wouldn't come back up to ride height after drop test. I took the wheels and shocks off, worked the arms through the range of motion, they would not drop with gravity, so I pulled the pins and rolled them on a flat surface
Straightened them out best I could, reinstalled and the arms dropped with gravity.
The thing that surprised me about this problem, I didnt think any of my crashes were bad enough to warrant this issue. Just a couple of half throttle cart wheels.
I landed every full throttle jump rubber side down.
Maybe I just got a batch of really soft pins.
Now the bearing issue was noticed when the left rear wheel looked loose. Total of 4 runs, I replaced those with traxxas rubbers shielded bearings thinking maybe water(melted snow) caused the failure on the metal shield bearings. 8 runs later and the traxxas bearings are giving up. So I ordered rpm knuckles to get the over sized bearings
Straightened them out best I could, reinstalled and the arms dropped with gravity.
The thing that surprised me about this problem, I didnt think any of my crashes were bad enough to warrant this issue. Just a couple of half throttle cart wheels.
I landed every full throttle jump rubber side down.
Maybe I just got a batch of really soft pins.
Now the bearing issue was noticed when the left rear wheel looked loose. Total of 4 runs, I replaced those with traxxas rubbers shielded bearings thinking maybe water(melted snow) caused the failure on the metal shield bearings. 8 runs later and the traxxas bearings are giving up. So I ordered rpm knuckles to get the over sized bearings
#760
Just ordered 4 big joes 11 tires and rims. I'm hoping they will fit fine. Any thoughts to this as I have 2 days to cancel to order as I buy from the local store.
#762
Tech Rookie
Anyone able to enlighten me about my first post? #751
#763
Tech Rookie
Is there going to be a difference in performance going from 8.4 mimh to 2s lipo?
#764
Tech Master
iTrader: (40)
Yes, big difference. Just make sure you go with some good Lipos. It will seem like atleast 1/2 again more power. Remember Lipos are temperature sensitive so never leave them drained down and in the cold. Make sure they go from warm house to run in cold and then back inside before cold really sets in on them.
#765
Tech Rookie
I bought the Rival in Williston.
Like I said, I am a die hard Nitro guy. Bought Electric so I wont have to deal with tuning issues based on weather. I have run the Rival in single digit temps w/o issue.
I liked the fact the Rival was based on a Nitro truck that came out 10 years or so ago.
I just need to figure out this whole brushless lipo business.
I watched videos of 6s lipo's in the Rival, stupid fast. Looks totally like unuseable power. Looks like broken driveline parts, so 6s for me is out of the question.
Is there going to be a difference in performance going from 8.4 mimh to 2s lipo?
Like I said, I am a die hard Nitro guy. Bought Electric so I wont have to deal with tuning issues based on weather. I have run the Rival in single digit temps w/o issue.
I liked the fact the Rival was based on a Nitro truck that came out 10 years or so ago.
I just need to figure out this whole brushless lipo business.
I watched videos of 6s lipo's in the Rival, stupid fast. Looks totally like unuseable power. Looks like broken driveline parts, so 6s for me is out of the question.
Is there going to be a difference in performance going from 8.4 mimh to 2s lipo?
To answer your question; yes there will be a large difference in performance going from 8.4V nimh to 2s lipo. The amperage that lipo's can put out blows nimh's away. Without getting into a whole lot of detail, nimh can put out about 21 amps continuous, while the lipos will do about 390 amps (and thats not even the burst current). Another benifit is less weight (about 1/2 pound with a pair of lipos).
Associated Reedy WolfPack NiMH 7C 8.4V 3000 Stick from TowerHobbies:
7C x 3000 mAh (3.0 Ah) = 21 Amps x 16.8V (8.4V x 2) = 353 Watts
The 7C is based on Tower's description. 7C reads 7 x capacity, where capacity is 3000 MAh.
Turnigy nano-tech 6000mah 2S2P 65~130C Hardcase Lipo Pack from HobbyKing:
65C x 6000mAh (6.0 Ah) = 390 Amps x 14.8V (7.4V x 2) = 5772 Watts
All this proves is that the lipos put out alot more power than the NiMH and more than enough for whatever ESC can pull. Associated does not post amp draw specs for RTR motors and ESC's, so I have always just not worried about it and kept an eye on the motor and ESC temps until I was happy with my gearing.
I started looking at Rival stuff today (which lead me here) since I am thinking about using the stretched chassis and transmission for my already converted Monster GT (I call it a Monster ET now). I might be able to post a picture if this forum lets me, I will try that too.
Last edited by dustin4141; 02-24-2014 at 07:28 PM.