Is this a NON insulated carb problem?
04-03-2012, 03:31 AM
#46
That was a "general" statment dude, it was not directed at anyone in particular.. Funny how you conveniently left this part out:
You should not assume and no it was not condescending.
You should not assume and no it was not condescending.
04-03-2012, 06:37 AM
#47
Thanks for trying to help man, but again I have done what you said (apart from buying an A5) to no avail...
1 and 2: I have definitely changed the way I tune other engines to the way I tune this, this thing is 4 turns out from closed, can't get much richer than that man. Blue smoke everywhere...
3: The big one. It isn't an issue of the engine overheating when the tank drops, or me chasing a tune, because this happened at the start of the tank (the tank was full) and I thought I had an airleak in the fuel filter.
Changed the filter to a single piece of line (as you know you need to take the tank out to change the fuel line on the LST unless you're a God when it comes to threading needles, so it gave the engine time to cool down) and it did it yet AGAIN (still not half tank or empty).
After I changed the tune to even richer as per Tibs instructions, it ran great for a whole tank of fuel, right at the bottom of the tank I rolled it and it died, I tried to put some more fuel in it and prime it and it wouldn't take the fuel.
It has happened 3 times, two of which when the tank was full and 3/4 full. I said before it happened twice, but I forgot one of the times when I was writing.
It's not a tuning issue or an air leak, so if it's not the carb, I have no idea what it is... I sincerely believe it IS the carb man. It makes sense for the carb to become hot over time, until it reaches the same operating temp as the engine, if it's a metal carb. There's no other way I can explain the fuel being spat out, it was simple bizarre and EXTREMELY frustrating. I was forcing as much air into the pressure line as I could and nothing was working...
I can't do another test run because my room mates dog is an untrained idiot and ate my air filter -.-, when I get another one, I'll see if I can make a video and perhaps it will put this thing to bed and show that in CERTAIN circumstances (obviously not yours), it can pay to have an insulated carb.
1 and 2: I have definitely changed the way I tune other engines to the way I tune this, this thing is 4 turns out from closed, can't get much richer than that man. Blue smoke everywhere...
3: The big one. It isn't an issue of the engine overheating when the tank drops, or me chasing a tune, because this happened at the start of the tank (the tank was full) and I thought I had an airleak in the fuel filter.
Changed the filter to a single piece of line (as you know you need to take the tank out to change the fuel line on the LST unless you're a God when it comes to threading needles, so it gave the engine time to cool down) and it did it yet AGAIN (still not half tank or empty).
After I changed the tune to even richer as per Tibs instructions, it ran great for a whole tank of fuel, right at the bottom of the tank I rolled it and it died, I tried to put some more fuel in it and prime it and it wouldn't take the fuel.
It has happened 3 times, two of which when the tank was full and 3/4 full. I said before it happened twice, but I forgot one of the times when I was writing.
It's not a tuning issue or an air leak, so if it's not the carb, I have no idea what it is... I sincerely believe it IS the carb man. It makes sense for the carb to become hot over time, until it reaches the same operating temp as the engine, if it's a metal carb. There's no other way I can explain the fuel being spat out, it was simple bizarre and EXTREMELY frustrating. I was forcing as much air into the pressure line as I could and nothing was working...
I can't do another test run because my room mates dog is an untrained idiot and ate my air filter -.-, when I get another one, I'll see if I can make a video and perhaps it will put this thing to bed and show that in CERTAIN circumstances (obviously not yours), it can pay to have an insulated carb.
its the carb dude..... trust me...Hersavage is obviously not on the level where he would aware enough notice these issues with the carb...........His standards of how a engine should behave are obviously quite different then the rest of ours...to him what is happening to you is perfectly normal and a sign of a great easy tuning engine.......... myself and probably 99% of the other on this forum would be unhappy with the way those engines behave...........
Last edited by Maximo; 04-03-2012 at 06:57 AM.
04-03-2012, 07:10 AM
#48
I.e. sell that piece of junk XXL, get a truggy, and of course a modded Bonito to go with it... 
04-03-2012, 07:25 AM
#49
its the carb dude..... trust me...Hersavage is obviously not on the level where he would aware enough notice these issues with the carb...........His standards of how a engine should behave are obviously quite different then the rest of ours...to him what is happening to you is perfectly normal and a sign of a great easy tuning engine.......... myself and probably 99% of the other on this forum would be unhappy with the way those engines behave...........
I'll try and get an insulated carb for this thing and in the not too distant future (hopefully) pick up a picco, I might try one of yours.... I've wanted one of your engines since you started modding P6's in the revos and posting about it on MVB :P Do you sell modded sleeves for them, so I don't need to buy a whole new engine once every 12 months?
04-03-2012, 07:28 AM
#50
I dunno why you hate on picco's man, have you ever owned one? They make fantastic power and they are a really nice engine for a cheap price (you can get a picco for the same price as an LRP)....
Your arguments are always price based, which is fair enough for a basher who doesn't have anyone to race against, but the argument doesn't pertain to picco .28's (the ones you'd put in an MT) because they are competitively priced.
04-03-2012, 09:57 AM
#51
Must admit, I lol'd.
I'll try and get an insulated carb for this thing and in the not too distant future (hopefully) pick up a picco, I might try one of yours.... I've wanted one of your engines since you started modding P6's in the revos and posting about it on MVB :P Do you sell modded sleeves for them, so I don't need to buy a whole new engine once every 12 months?
I'll try and get an insulated carb for this thing and in the not too distant future (hopefully) pick up a picco, I might try one of yours.... I've wanted one of your engines since you started modding P6's in the revos and posting about it on MVB :P Do you sell modded sleeves for them, so I don't need to buy a whole new engine once every 12 months?
I wouldn't spend the money modding one of these......All the poor tuning characteristics will be just brought to the surface...... As well the engines are kinda built flimsy with 13 mm rear bearings, which is very small for a .28, especially a modified one....So you end up with a poor tuning mod .28 that is not overly durable......... Yes it will be fast while its in tune, but your going to chase that tune all day long.....
I would skip right to the Nova 28.... it is more money..But it is a much more stable engine that is far easier to tune and keep tuned..Night and day better then the 454 , and a fair bit better then the Picco..... Performance wise the Nova 28 is a rocket, fastest of all the 28's on the market..
04-03-2012, 10:02 AM
#52
And there we have it - the sales pitch... Puke..
04-03-2012, 11:49 AM
#53
Cummins, I only get "defensive" when people start talking trash and making personal attacks. You're the one constantly trying to lay some veneer of objective truth on all this - and then antagonize things by calling people fanboys. I posted five video clips of five different RC's I've had with five different SH engines - NONE of which ever had ANY carb issues.
Maybe there is something to hot outside temps or whatever, but the way you carry on trying to prove this "SH uninsulated carbs automatically boil fuel" or whatever is frankly bunk. Maybe under some weird cirumstances I haven't encountered in six years or so and with ten different engines this boiling issue can happen. I never denied that it was happening to the OP - or to you - either. There are tons of factors, and I don't and can't know exactly what's going on with your particular engines. I only even mentioned anything because you and a select small few are bent on brainwashing the world that "SH ENGINES' NONINSULATED CARBS BOIL FUEL". Which simply is not true, objectively. The "fanboy" talk doesn't help your case either... - or at least makes a civil discussion more difficult. If I am a "fanboy", well, it's only because I've had good experience with like ten different engines over a period of about six years, none of which ever boiled fuel.
And furthermore, what FLDAN said I agree with completely. These engines like to run cold. 2DMAXX used to show his vids of Machs and LRP's making good power at like 170F. When I raced my Mach in a 30-minute truggy Main, it came off at 212. 190 is a perfectly fine temp to thrash an SH engine.. I don't generally get them above 250, and I get good performance. And even then, I have had the occasional engine up over 300, and still never had fuel boil.
So again, the only reason I posted is because IMO, when people like you say "non-insulated SH carbs result in boiling fuel", as if this applies across the board and is some new-fangled scientific discovery - I see it as simply the spreading of misinformation. If somebody wants for ex. to get an XXL, they should - it's a great bashing truck. And no, they don't have to automatically buy a new carb if they get one.. Same goes if they want to put an LRP 30 in it or whatever.. Mach, Big Red, LRP Spec 3, LRP 30, etc.. - all good budget MT bashing engines. I only started breaking my 454 in in December, so probably don't have more than a gallon through it, but still, it runs well too so far... Nothing boiling.
.
Maybe there is something to hot outside temps or whatever, but the way you carry on trying to prove this "SH uninsulated carbs automatically boil fuel" or whatever is frankly bunk. Maybe under some weird cirumstances I haven't encountered in six years or so and with ten different engines this boiling issue can happen. I never denied that it was happening to the OP - or to you - either. There are tons of factors, and I don't and can't know exactly what's going on with your particular engines. I only even mentioned anything because you and a select small few are bent on brainwashing the world that "SH ENGINES' NONINSULATED CARBS BOIL FUEL". Which simply is not true, objectively. The "fanboy" talk doesn't help your case either... - or at least makes a civil discussion more difficult. If I am a "fanboy", well, it's only because I've had good experience with like ten different engines over a period of about six years, none of which ever boiled fuel.
And furthermore, what FLDAN said I agree with completely. These engines like to run cold. 2DMAXX used to show his vids of Machs and LRP's making good power at like 170F. When I raced my Mach in a 30-minute truggy Main, it came off at 212. 190 is a perfectly fine temp to thrash an SH engine.. I don't generally get them above 250, and I get good performance. And even then, I have had the occasional engine up over 300, and still never had fuel boil.
So again, the only reason I posted is because IMO, when people like you say "non-insulated SH carbs result in boiling fuel", as if this applies across the board and is some new-fangled scientific discovery - I see it as simply the spreading of misinformation. If somebody wants for ex. to get an XXL, they should - it's a great bashing truck. And no, they don't have to automatically buy a new carb if they get one.. Same goes if they want to put an LRP 30 in it or whatever.. Mach, Big Red, LRP Spec 3, LRP 30, etc.. - all good budget MT bashing engines. I only started breaking my 454 in in December, so probably don't have more than a gallon through it, but still, it runs well too so far... Nothing boiling.
.
I have never said that ALL SH engines do this, or avoid them like the plague. However, my experience with the ones I have personally owned and worked on are that they are bad about boiling the fuel. I didnt come in this thread and tell this guy that was his problem. He already knew it was his problem, and I simply agreed with his diagnosis, because he's right. I like my SH engines fine, but I cant stand it when an engine boils fuel because it makes it impossible to run. No engine I have owned has had the fuel boiling issue except for my SH engines with non insulated carburetors. Go figure.
I guess it just Irk's me when someone is asking for help with an issue, they have clearly determined the problem, but then people come in saying they must have other issues, etc... because fuel boiling is a non issue, even though it clearly is in this case. And it does not mean the 454 is a bad engine, but I can tell you that if its like my 427 and XTM 24.7, I would personally have to change the carburetor to an insulated one to be happy with its performance...
If I was "bent on brainwashing" as you said, I would have started this thread myself. Im simply trying to help this guy out, because I have been there and done that and know how frustrating it is.
04-03-2012, 03:09 PM
#54
I wouldn't spend the money modding one of these......All the poor tuning characteristics will be just brought to the surface...... As well the engines are kinda built flimsy with 13 mm rear bearings, which is very small for a .28, especially a modified one....So you end up with a poor tuning mod .28 that is not overly durable......... Yes it will be fast while its in tune, but your going to chase that tune all day long.....
I would skip right to the Nova 28.... it is more money..But it is a much more stable engine that is far easier to tune and keep tuned..Night and day better then the 454 , and a fair bit better then the Picco..... Performance wise the Nova 28 is a rocket, fastest of all the 28's on the market..
I would skip right to the Nova 28.... it is more money..But it is a much more stable engine that is far easier to tune and keep tuned..Night and day better then the 454 , and a fair bit better then the Picco..... Performance wise the Nova 28 is a rocket, fastest of all the 28's on the market..
How much more power is there to be had from a modded nova than a modded picco? I think the picco would be more than enough.
Cheers man.
04-03-2012, 03:59 PM
#55
Tech Adept
I wasn't talking about a modded 454, I meant a modded picco. Yeah, I dunno if I really want to put a $400 engine in a basher MT, lol.
How much more power is there to be had from a modded nova than a modded picco? I think the picco would be more than enough.
Cheers man.
How much more power is there to be had from a modded nova than a modded picco? I think the picco would be more than enough.
Cheers man.
I've been curious about the moded Nova .28 as well. My last Nova bigblock, the Plus 28 3 was a total piece of crap..dunno..just never got it to run right even after I changed the leaky front bearing..plus it just left a while lot to be desired performance wise...IDK, maybe I just ended up with a dud. I know the plus28 7's are a whole different animal though.. I've seen the modded ones rip. I wonder how they stack up with respect to durability..
Last edited by FLDan; 04-03-2012 at 05:16 PM.
04-03-2012, 05:44 PM
#56
OMG too funny.... there is a thread in the Nitro engine section about a engine high idling...the threads been going for a week now, finally today the guys says what engine it is LOL...A dam SH Big Red
here is the first post
When I approach the biggest jump on the front straight at full throttle, my motor then sticks at wot while floating over to the downside when rx is at idle immediately after I launch off the lip. It does fine everywhere else but they're lower speed jumps. Are the wheels spinning faster than motor after launch to jam it at wot? Confused.
typical SH characteristic...high idling fuel hog LOL..
here is the first post
When I approach the biggest jump on the front straight at full throttle, my motor then sticks at wot while floating over to the downside when rx is at idle immediately after I launch off the lip. It does fine everywhere else but they're lower speed jumps. Are the wheels spinning faster than motor after launch to jam it at wot? Confused.
typical SH characteristic...high idling fuel hog LOL..
04-03-2012, 05:50 PM
#57
I wasn't talking about a modded 454, I meant a modded picco. Yeah, I dunno if I really want to put a $400 engine in a basher MT, lol.
How much more power is there to be had from a modded nova than a modded picco? I think the picco would be more than enough.
Cheers man.
How much more power is there to be had from a modded nova than a modded picco? I think the picco would be more than enough.
Cheers man.
durability the Nova wins...Picco 28's are bad on rods if your not careful ( tho any 28 is really )
the thing is the Nova is just a better built engine...it is sealed better, has a much better carb , a much beefier case and overall better construction....The Nova is super easy to tune, the Picco is not.... The Nova does cost more...but it comes already as a turbo head and has the fancy rotostart included...It also includes a glowplug, roto wand and 5 different carb inserts...in terms of value for the dollar the Nova wins.........The Picco is standard head, pullstart, no glowplug and no venturi inserts or roto...Buy a turbo button, a glowplug and a roto backplate for the Picco and its the same price as the Nova...just its nowhere near as nice of a engine...
04-04-2012, 05:18 AM
#58
the Nova will tear the ass off the Picco.... it tunes much better too ! they both have the same bottom, same mid, but the Nova tears it up on the top end......
durability the Nova wins...Picco 28's are bad on rods if your not careful ( tho any 28 is really )
the thing is the Nova is just a better built engine...it is sealed better, has a much better carb , a much beefier case and overall better construction....The Nova is super easy to tune, the Picco is not.... The Nova does cost more...but it comes already as a turbo head and has the fancy rotostart included...It also includes a glowplug, roto wand and 5 different carb inserts...in terms of value for the dollar the Nova wins.........The Picco is standard head, pullstart, no glowplug and no venturi inserts or roto...Buy a turbo button, a glowplug and a roto backplate for the Picco and its the same price as the Nova...just its nowhere near as nice of a engine...
durability the Nova wins...Picco 28's are bad on rods if your not careful ( tho any 28 is really )
the thing is the Nova is just a better built engine...it is sealed better, has a much better carb , a much beefier case and overall better construction....The Nova is super easy to tune, the Picco is not.... The Nova does cost more...but it comes already as a turbo head and has the fancy rotostart included...It also includes a glowplug, roto wand and 5 different carb inserts...in terms of value for the dollar the Nova wins.........The Picco is standard head, pullstart, no glowplug and no venturi inserts or roto...Buy a turbo button, a glowplug and a roto backplate for the Picco and its the same price as the Nova...just its nowhere near as nice of a engine...
I had no idea it came with a wand. Will the wand fit into the losi spin start? I knew it was roto start, I just thought you'd have to buy a want for your unit, or use an HPI unit because that is what most roto start units are based off.
Can you tell me what the benefits of a turbo head are? I've had one turbo engine, an Alpha A852 in my truggy, it was a great engine, but I don't know what the added benefit of running a turbo plug is?
I've already bought a spin start backplate for the picco, but it's only $10, so I'm not fussed. If the price difference is only $50 or so, I might consider the nova, I've always wanted to try a novarossi
04-04-2012, 06:30 PM
#59
I love mine..(modded Picco)..I call it Freddy Krueger because it refuses to die..lol. I've been running it since early 2010..I'm not sure how many gallons have been through it, has to be pretty damn close to 10 by now if not over and the thing still runs its ass off. I'll probably send my next one to CRE for mods...and yes, I'll admit to being a Picco fanboy...
I've been curious about the moded Nova .28 as well. My last Nova bigblock, the Plus 28 3 was a total piece of crap..dunno..just never got it to run right even after I changed the leaky front bearing..plus it just left a while lot to be desired performance wise...IDK, maybe I just ended up with a dud. I know the plus28 7's are a whole different animal though.. I've seen the modded ones rip. I wonder how they stack up with respect to durability..
I've been curious about the moded Nova .28 as well. My last Nova bigblock, the Plus 28 3 was a total piece of crap..dunno..just never got it to run right even after I changed the leaky front bearing..plus it just left a while lot to be desired performance wise...IDK, maybe I just ended up with a dud. I know the plus28 7's are a whole different animal though.. I've seen the modded ones rip. I wonder how they stack up with respect to durability..
04-06-2012, 10:13 PM
#60
I took the XXL down to the park for about an hour or so while my GF took our dog to the dog park.
The XXL ran ok, I had it richened to the absolute sh1t house, though... SO let me rephrase that, once tuning it to the point where it doesn't behave like a dog, it ran ok.
The carb issue DID happen, but not as problematic as before. The only way it can be fixed is to richen it to the point that it just doesn't get hot, unfortunately for it to not happen at all it would be running that horribly that it's not even worth running.
It was a nice cool day here today, 26 celcius and 51% humidity, so a very comfortable day to run. I will be interested to see what happens again when the needle pumps up another 10 degrees when it starts getting hot... It probably won't happen for a long time, as we are heading into winter.
I got some video of the carb taking a prime perfectly without the engine hot, then I got a few videos of it running around and me having some fun, then I had a final video of the carb bubbling slightly. Keep in mind, the engine had been shut down for quite a while and it was still bubbling and it was difficult to start again.
I'll have them uploaded soon.
The XXL ran ok, I had it richened to the absolute sh1t house, though... SO let me rephrase that, once tuning it to the point where it doesn't behave like a dog, it ran ok.
The carb issue DID happen, but not as problematic as before. The only way it can be fixed is to richen it to the point that it just doesn't get hot, unfortunately for it to not happen at all it would be running that horribly that it's not even worth running.
It was a nice cool day here today, 26 celcius and 51% humidity, so a very comfortable day to run. I will be interested to see what happens again when the needle pumps up another 10 degrees when it starts getting hot... It probably won't happen for a long time, as we are heading into winter.
I got some video of the carb taking a prime perfectly without the engine hot, then I got a few videos of it running around and me having some fun, then I had a final video of the carb bubbling slightly. Keep in mind, the engine had been shut down for quite a while and it was still bubbling and it was difficult to start again.
I'll have them uploaded soon.