Go Back  R/C Tech Forums > General Forums > Micro and Mini Scales
GL Racing GLF F1 Chassis >

GL Racing GLF F1 Chassis

Like Tree285Likes

GL Racing GLF F1 Chassis

Old 10-17-2019, 12:49 PM
  #151  
Tech Master
iTrader: (3)
 
mugler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,540
Trader Rating: 3 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by v_squared
"Any and all cars will look much better on carpet as the tuning window on carpet is exponentially larger than RCP. "

This statement is very perfound. I had no ideal. Now you are peaking my interest with carpet. Must do more research myself.
I should have wrote any and all "1/28" cars but yep that's what we found out...compared to RCP no tuning needed to address traction rolling or tight diff induced or lack of rear traction spin outs, only for the purpose of being faster than the competition, breaking is also doesn't get the car out of shape like it does on RCP. Forward wheel spin (but without loss of control) which kills speed is a big problem specially with non-stock motors...but again the biggest feature which makes carpet with no tire sauce cheesy is the excessive sliding on corners, its makes the experience half way close to drifting rather than road course racing which RCP delivers beautifully with a tuned car.
mugler is offline  
Old 10-17-2019, 07:37 PM
  #152  
EMU
Tech Master
iTrader: (3)
 
EMU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,580
Trader Rating: 3 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by liljohn1064
New info for today setting up the car. Extra shim and longer screw needed for A-19 or the spring drags on A-19 and will not allow full droop. Added to shims to the ball stud under A-19 to move the damper actuator down. The threads of the ball stud were previously dragging on the spring and retainer of the center damper as it moves forward.
Use the flat nut under A-24, the instructions say lock nut. It will not fit.
Use carpet tape or two sided tape, not servo tape to hold in the electronics. Servo tape is too thick.
The thin nut under A-24 still rubs on the ESC causing tweak in the upper deck. I'm going to take about 1/2 to 1 full mm out over the screw in the corner of the ESC as this gnerates tweak through the whole rear suspension.
Use the front downstop screw to make the front arms level. Just learn to drive it that way as leaving it loose invites all kinds of other problems.
Put all the shims on the top of the front knuckle for 3mm ride height on fresh tires.
I did drill the front wing and use 6mm self tapping screws in the two holes. They stick out a little in the front, but even with the back. It would look cleaner with 5mm, but you will still have to drill out the holes as the screws will still be too long.
I added 3 .02 shims to the diff side of the axle as I was getting a knocking sound from the diff tensioner on the pod. I added 2 on the non diff side to balance out the width. The axle spins all day with no gearing

Car is now at 3mm ride height and waiting for the ESC case mod and motor install and solder.
I noticed that the nut for the center deck/suspension pivot was fighting for space with the ESC. I clipped some of the plastic off the ESC cover and now it is flat.

I don't have the diffuser installed at the moment, but haven't seen any rub on the mount from the diff, but I also haven't had much time to work or examine the car in the last couple weeks.


Carpet vs RCP, carpet you are always searching for traction, RCP you are reducing it. Setup window for both are similar in size, you just know better with RCP when you are in it. With RCP it is right at the point that the car stops traction rolling, but carries the speed through the corners. With carpet, I find that it is harder to get both ends of the car working well at the same time. When you get the corner entry to mid corner working right, the exit often suffers, and when the exit is hooked up, it often suffers in the mid corner. I almost always favored drive off the corner initially, but changed my setup theory to favor corner entry and mid corner speed and lap times and consistency improved (I had expected the opposite).

I absolutely hate the feel of driving silicone tires, the car never feels like ot hooks up and you never know when you're in the setup window unless you compare with other drivers.
EMU is offline  
Old 10-18-2019, 01:28 PM
  #153  
Tech Master
iTrader: (3)
 
mugler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,540
Trader Rating: 3 (100%+)
Default

Perhaps my use of the phrase “tuning/set-up window” technically is not the right choice for the main point I was trying to get across which is every rwd 28th scale car, in any WB and choice of hop-ups will drive on carpet first time out and if its the only car on the track will give the impression that its already tuned in since there is no traction rolling, roll overs or any other obvious ill effects (wheel spin excepted here) like there always is with first time for a car on RCP.

All observations are dead on with what we experienced as well and good items to point out as well as driving tips.. Even though we never used silicone tires we had the same exact thing with rear tires never (ever!) hooking all the way…i think thats the nature of carpet driving w/no traction compound and again thats one of the biggest plus features of RCP vs carpet...and there are at least 2 other huge advantages of RCP i can think of.....RCP all the way
mugler is offline  
Old 10-19-2019, 05:20 AM
  #154  
Tech Prophet
iTrader: (9)
 
Billy Kelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Far south suburbs of Chicago area
Posts: 17,712
Trader Rating: 9 (100%+)
Default


It’s alive. I’m waiting on the guys to upload last night practice. Think I was close 150-200 laps. I’ve got long way to go. I’m about 1/2 second slower then my RTR Jomurema. Probably full second on average. Night was going great then servo seems to be having issue. I though I was just low battery. Servo locked full left. Charged and it happened again. Let the pros drive. Again and again. Hopefully Sunday morning will get it solved.
Billy Kelly is offline  
Old 10-19-2019, 10:42 AM
  #155  
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: CA, SF Bay Area
Posts: 98
Default

Originally Posted by Billy Kelly

Itís alive. Iím waiting on the guys to upload last night practice. Think I was close 150-200 laps. Iíve got long way to go. Iím about 1/2 second slower then my RTR Jomurema. Probably full second on average. Night was going great then servo seems to be having issue. I though I was just low battery. Servo locked full left. Charged and it happened again. Let the pros drive. Again and again. Hopefully Sunday morning will get it solved.
If your steering is locking at full left or right (especially after hitting a rail), check the clearance between the steering turnbuckles and the bulkhead.

On all three cars that I've built, the turnbuckle would rub against the bulkhead causing occasional binding. Had to grind down the bulkhead down a little to clear the turnbuckle which fixed the problem.

art4242 is offline  
Old 10-19-2019, 11:18 AM
  #156  
Tech Prophet
iTrader: (9)
 
Billy Kelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Far south suburbs of Chicago area
Posts: 17,712
Trader Rating: 9 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by art4242
If your steering is locking at full left or right (especially after hitting a rail), check the clearance between the steering turnbuckles and the bulkhead.

On all three cars that I've built, the turnbuckle would rub against the bulkhead causing occasional binding. Had to grind down the bulkhead down a little to clear the turnbuckle which fixed the problem.

Will check that in morning. It just happens randomly. You could be turning right or driving straight, and will go full left and lock up.

First time I thought it was battery. I pushed 19 minutes out of the battery. Just wanted to know the max limit. First time it locked up was when battery hit cutoff. Charged up and then it just started happening. Might be 10 seconds, think we got 3 laps then it locked.


Iím wondering if I nicked a servo wire with the body. Scraped the coating off. It was midnight by then. Back tomorrow morning
art4242 likes this.
Billy Kelly is offline  
Old 10-20-2019, 12:18 PM
  #157  
EMU
Tech Master
iTrader: (3)
 
EMU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,580
Trader Rating: 3 (100%+)
Default

We had a few issues with the stock servo saver skipping on the servo gear yesterday. Having really fast sections in the track layout didn't help much, but even medium speed hits would move the servo saver, making it impossible to keep the cars on track. We will be sending back this information to GL in hopes for a quick fix, and want to see a running change in the kits to either fix the stock servo saver or include the alu one in the base kit.

this was a concern of mine being that it uses the same saver as the GLA, and that has a similar issue. Necessitating the use of an option part in order to use the base kit is unacceptable to me. The base kit should perform as intended when built up, option parts should be for refinement not to fix issues with the kits.

this also shows the need for more protection on the front wing/bumper. One that overhangs the front wheels by at least 1-2mm on each side. The cars need to be able to be kept on track, and protection of the steering assembly is paramount in racing the F1 style cars.
liljohn1064 likes this.
EMU is offline  
Old 10-20-2019, 07:50 PM
  #158  
Tech Prophet
iTrader: (9)
 
Billy Kelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Far south suburbs of Chicago area
Posts: 17,712
Trader Rating: 9 (100%+)
Default

First weekend of practice.











Billy Kelly is offline  
Old 10-21-2019, 01:59 PM
  #159  
Tech Master
iTrader: (3)
 
mugler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,540
Trader Rating: 3 (100%+)
Default

Finally got a chance to shake down the GLF last Saturday. some observations and outloud thinking and note comparisons with others:

- on the bench I also like some here had to install all 4 shims on the top of the left knuckle and vice versa on the right side plus add a 0.5mm preload shim to left front shock to get the left/right front height as even as possible.
- the added pre load on the left shock was noticeable when driving and though not ideal surprisingly was not a big problem.
- started off with a 2500kv motor which kept cogging. I remembered EMU had mentioned somewhere the punch had to be set higher, tried that and a few other things but no joy so dropped in a GL3500 which was loose in my pit bag and cogging problem all solved.
- I installed art4242’s front bumper from the get go and i feel that really worked great, I don’t remember even a single front wing snagging incident.
- Overall the weight of the car needs to be higher if for nothing else to bounce less when it does run into the rails, right now at stock weight it bounces back excessively compared to any other 28 scale car.
- w/3500 motor at the advice of a 10th scale F1 iic champ who was with me at the track i lowered the throttle high point to get the car comfortable enough to not touch any railing for at least 5 laps full throttle…that ended up being 63% on a KO exII and I was doing 10+ laps without any bubbles and the car was still racing speeds quick…at that point I was yearning for more GLF’s on the track to play with This is definitely a fun chassis to spend a lot of time with on the track.
- There is a mild general wandering of the front end it seems, likely the slop on the upper arms play a role here, among other issues changing arm-sweep angles under braking and acceleration and on bumps too. I really think GL needs to dig-in and solve this issue with V2 molds, parts or whatever that’s needed. Front ride height discrepancy also seems to be at least partially due to the arm slop…. I notice general more arm slop from all the parts on the left compared to the right side.
- My servo saver screw backed out all on its owner though was secured very well…a different version of what EMU is pointing out perhaps but i have to look into the good servo saver parts which i was not aware the exist.
- I wouldn’t mind seeing some slippery tire decals that cover the entire side wall of the front/rear tires…right now any tire touching the rails brings the car to a hault…nature of F1 yes but still. also circular double sided tape to hold down the side tire walls on the rims at high rpms would be a nice item for any company to release.

Track was built on the rough side but very good traction over all / only v10/25 fronts used on that day / only optional part was the front bumper with spinners, everything else bone stock. / the transponder on this car ended up being defective but after all car tuning it was beating out other cars comfortably that were doing 5.6’s for their fastest laps/ My own fastest time with a stock PN car was 5.2xx .
art4242 and MTseo like this.
mugler is offline  
Old 10-21-2019, 03:39 PM
  #160  
Tech Prophet
iTrader: (9)
 
Billy Kelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Far south suburbs of Chicago area
Posts: 17,712
Trader Rating: 9 (100%+)
Default

Ok. So here’s my non technical view on the F1.

The steering lock issue is still undetermined. Oddly it seems to happen as battery gets low, or after being charged. The second video I posted was shortened from a full 15 minute run without problems. After charging it couldn’t make a single lap. Most likely now have to wait till next Friday night practice to find the problem.

Much to my suprise, it seems to fit my driving style better then the others. Of the 3 of us with them, I’m currently the only one with consistency in the 10s for laps.

The others seem to struggle with a front end push( it snowplows). From watching it looks like they are trying to use the same line as with the regular cars.


Billy Kelly is offline  
Old 10-21-2019, 03:41 PM
  #161  
EMU
Tech Master
iTrader: (3)
 
EMU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,580
Trader Rating: 3 (100%+)
Default

Short reply, a response from GL states that the GLA servo saver is not the same as the F1. This was in response tyou a message sent last week. Hopefully we can get some clarity on some of the issues brought up.

My front end is equal left to right with shimming. I don't recall seeing an issue when I had built it up with the stock parts, but have the alu parts on now. Is it an arm issue, or a bulkhead issue? Is the bulkhead not sitting flat on the chassis? Something we should investigate ourselves and try to see if there are workarounds until proper adjustments can be made.
EMU is offline  
Old 10-21-2019, 07:10 PM
  #162  
Tech Master
iTrader: (3)
 
mugler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,540
Trader Rating: 3 (100%+)
Default

Bulkhead parts were all nice and flat at time of the build. one obvious problem I noticed was excessive up and down play of the lower left knuckle ball joint inside the lower arm ball cup, I'll be ordering a new set of lower arms with the hopes of a tighter fitment...likely the source for most of the ride height issues on that side but i suspect not all of them.

The upper pin holes are possibly just a touch too big of a diameter allowing the pins to wiggle around but the fact its the same with aluminum piece also, is curious.


F1 driving lines for sure will be different whic is part of the charm of driving a different type of chassis... i had good success with the Kyosho F1's with off throttle before turning in / rotate @ apex- / get on throttle again style of driving vs trying to feather the throttle mid corner like with GT cars ...I'll be trying to go more that direction with GLF next time by tuning in more rear droop on the top shock using that handy droop system thats built in.
EMU likes this.
mugler is offline  
Old 10-21-2019, 07:13 PM
  #163  
Tech Adept
iTrader: (2)
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Highland, IN
Posts: 240
Trader Rating: 2 (100%+)
Default

I got a chance to make a few laps with my GLF yesterday. I really wish I could've have made it to Friday practice to sort the car out but am really pleased with the way the car handled. Last week I added a small piece of .030 steel sheet on the rear part of the chassis where the cutouts are. I am not running the small electronics plate because of fitment issues. (Swave speedo)
The plate added 15 grams of weight. The car weighs 145 grams. I also added spinner wheels to the corners of front wing to help protect the servo and steering linkage.
mugler, liljohn1064, EMU and 3 others like this.
rystang is offline  
Old 10-21-2019, 07:47 PM
  #164  
Tech Prophet
iTrader: (9)
 
Billy Kelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Far south suburbs of Chicago area
Posts: 17,712
Trader Rating: 9 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by rystang
I got a chance to make a few laps with my GLF yesterday. I really wish I could've have made it to Friday practice to sort the car out but am really pleased with the way the car handled. Last week I added a small piece of .030 steel sheet on the rear part of the chassis where the cutouts are. I am not running the small electronics plate because of fitment issues. (Swave speedo)
The plate added 15 grams of weight. The car weighs 145 grams. I also added spinner wheels to the corners of front wing to help protect the servo and steering linkage.
I believe I know that car. The spinner seemed to work.

see ya in couple weeks
rystang likes this.
Billy Kelly is offline  
Old 10-21-2019, 11:03 PM
  #165  
Tech Apprentice
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: CA, SF Bay Area
Posts: 98
Default Brass chassis and weights

Early shipment arrived from GL: brass chassis, brass front spoiler mount, and brass weights. It was quick to swap everything over. I was somewhat concerned about the brass being too flexible but it actually feels a bit stiffer in both bending and torsion than the stock carbon chassis.

It feels REALLY hefty now at 173+ grams. It might actually be too heavy, the extra weights may not be needed.

I'll try and get my track set up over the weekend to give it a shakedown.



rystang, mugler and MTseo like this.
art4242 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.