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Mugen MTC1

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Old 03-13-2018, 09:34 AM   -   Wikipost
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Mugen MTC1 Wiki:

MTC1 Manual on the Mugen Web Site.

Correction for the manual




The max/min tooth count of the spur and pinion combined.

64p = 127 to 164 total teeth


48p = 95 to 120 total teeth


People who have spare spur gears left over from other cars which they wish to use but can only utilize 2 of the 4 mounting holes, here's neat trick from MKAH to drill 2 more holes precisely in the spur gear:

1.Dismantle the Spur Holder and mount XRAY Spur with two screws.

2.If you have take a 3mm Top Setting Screw

3.Get the Top Screw in the first free thread to the Spur Holder from the other side until it touches the Spur a litle bit.
Make the same with the second free Thread.


4.Dismantle Top set Srew an the two screws witch holds the Spur on the Holder.
Now you see two marks absolutely central.


5. Take an 3mm Driller an Drill the holes at the marked places

6.Mount the Spur with the two old and two new holes on the Spur.


Spur Gears known to fit the gear holder with the correct hole pattern

1. Axon
2. Panaracer


Upper front arm hinge pin set screw tip (or any of the kit set screws):

When installing the set screw run the set screw in until you can see it come into the hinge pin gap. Back the screw out and make sure there is no flashing in the way and then the screw. Now slide the pin in and you should hit the pin and come to a dead stop. It will be a solid feel and not sloppy like it will not tighten which is caused by any loose plastic.

Hara's Setup


Robert Pietsch's Latest Carpet Setup

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Old 06-26-2017, 04:59 AM
  #196  
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Originally Posted by Antimullet View Post
$509 amain preorder. Any more idiot conjecture on being overly priced?? You know who you are...
average price of a top level kit
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Old 06-26-2017, 05:24 AM
  #197  
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Yep nothing exorbitantly overpriced.
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Old 06-26-2017, 07:47 AM
  #198  
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One of the few kits that actually looks like it's worth the money. The thing looks ultra high zoot in the pics.
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Old 06-26-2017, 11:01 AM
  #199  
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At $510 they are making profit. Unlike several others killing the hobby. Not too many people will want to join the hobby with prices to scare them away. Those considering a hobbygrade rc will be terrified of any kit, no electronics, costing $500.

In 2007 ae won the world's in Japan with their first wheeler, b44, which started selling a month after the race for $320. The chassis, top deck and shock towers were all carbon fiber. Plus 4 thumb screws and a lexan undertray to keep the chassis looking good. Out of nowhere the prices are now well over $400 and the only difference IN material is an aluminum chassis, and downgrade to bodyclips instead of thumb screws to secure battery. At the time tower was giving $60 discount if you spent $300 or more so I got mine for $260. For no reason ball diffs now cost twice what they used to. A ball diff was not even $30. Today they are around $50.

So yeah $500 for a kit is plenty. TC has machined aluminum bulkheads so I can understand why they cost more than wheelers, but imo $500 should be the maximum price for any tc, unless its parts are made of gold and diamonds.
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Old 06-26-2017, 11:04 AM
  #200  
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very attractive..
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Old 06-26-2017, 09:48 PM
  #201  
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I think the price announced is at the moment a test (and perhaps a subtle message that below this it may not make enough of a profit for the company to make it worthwhile - though I am sure there is some give built in). This is the case for just about anything. No manufacturer will venture in high scale production if signs show they might lose money. If the car sells at this price point, then the price is right! If not, they'll take it from there.

The RC top level race grade TC market is quite competitive and it does not grow. On the contrary. Much as we would like to believe otherwise. Check your own club and see who are the people you were racing with twenty years ago and who are the people you are racing with today - in my experience, it's the same people, minus some who left the hobby.

On the other hand, a lot of cheap, affordable cars are on the market (and continue to come) and it is hard to break in and take away some of the market from the other (possibly much better established) manufacturers.

What any new comer to this crowded market place can hope for is that they will lure enough people away from their brand and convince them to spread good news around. That says something about the power of the consumer. We'll see how this pans out. I hope they make it, because I think the car deserves a good place in the sport.

Would I buy a car at this price? This is what I would like to avoid answering, because I wouldn't like the company to start thinking (before their cars even hit the market) that they can push the price up. This is one of the reasons I don't really like threads like these where companies can get the hype going and have people arguing about nothing. In my opinion a manufacturer with their head well screwed in place would disregard info coming from such sources. The only valid info such threads can bring is how big a die hard fan base the company can count on. See Tamiya fanboys threads.

And even then, Tamiya has obviously left the market. Why? Well, because the fanboys don't buy top end cars. Top end car buyers want performance, and Tamiya failed miserably there. I personally regret they gave up, simply because I am a consumer and more competition between manufacturers gives me more choice and power and ultimately lower prices. But that has created an opportunity for others like Mugen. Maybe that is their goal, to capitalise on the void left by Tamiya. In my opinion, they do have the goods to do it.

Personally I will wait until the car hits the shores of SE Asia, when we will see what the real price is and how much support I can expect.
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Old 06-27-2017, 01:28 AM
  #202  
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Originally Posted by latentspeed View Post
At $510 they are making profit. Unlike several others killing the hobby. Not too many people will want to join the hobby with prices to scare them away. Those considering a hobbygrade rc will be terrified of any kit, no electronics, costing $500.

In 2007 ae won the world's in Japan with their first wheeler, b44, which started selling a month after the race for $320. The chassis, top deck and shock towers were all carbon fiber. Plus 4 thumb screws and a lexan undertray to keep the chassis looking good. Out of nowhere the prices are now well over $400 and the only difference IN material is an aluminum chassis, and downgrade to bodyclips instead of thumb screws to secure battery. At the time tower was giving $60 discount if you spent $300 or more so I got mine for $260. For no reason ball diffs now cost twice what they used to. A ball diff was not even $30. Today they are around $50.

So yeah $500 for a kit is plenty. TC has machined aluminum bulkheads so I can understand why they cost more than wheelers, but imo $500 should be the maximum price for any tc, unless its parts are made of gold and diamonds.
$320 dollars in 2007 is roughly $380 in today's dollars simply by inflation. The relative prices haven't risen by as much as you suggest.
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Old 06-27-2017, 02:29 AM
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Well yeah the point of any business is to profit, not to break even after expenses or be in debt after. There is no such thing as business if there are no consumers either. I know this well and use it. At the gym I slammed the manager there because of how arrogant the workers are acting like they own the place and act like they are better than everyone. Even at the AT&T store where they try to dictate how you should be and impose their loud voices, glaring as I ask questions trying to intimidate me. I made a scene and told the fool to get his manager. lol I told the manager that these workers should at least be respectful because it's customers money that gives them their paychecks. That they'd be nothing without customers. He agreed and said he will check the video footage and if it's true the jerk will be facing the consequences. Never saw him again. lol

Point is I think many of us don't like others trying to rip us off. Tamiya sold the most expensive tc, yet several complained it didn't have enough steering, that's all you'd hear from Marc Rheinard when racing indoors. For that premium price everything should fit also. There's a video on YouTube with Jilles Groskamp explaining how he works on his Tamiya. The adjustment ball bearing hub was a little swollen which prevented the top clamp from completely reach the bulkhead. Groskamp said its good to put a washer in between. Belt tension adjusters and arms are pretty much the only plastic parts! Why doesn't it fit properly? Even cheap rtr cars have higher standards. Tamiya didn't listen to customers and it was not as easy to find a place that would sell for a reasonable price. Showing that customers weren't getting what they paid for resulted in ending their racing program. Durango also had complaints about cheap plastics, ball cups popping off so easily and what not. If actual buyers don't get their problems fixed with the next version of the car they will not recommend others to buy. They'll do the opposite and spread the word trashing the brand.

Orion is selling their hmx esc for $385. If every company starts that trend how many more will leave the hobby? If race tires start selling for $100 a set how much more would leave?

Not saying this is the case with Mugen. Engineering, design, trial and error is costly. Mugen is one of the few brands that innovate, not imitate so their r n d needs to get paid too, not just the price of materials and labor but as a company. Anyone who reads my comments in the off-road forum knows I go into official threads and slam those weaselly companies stealing the design of others. Time and money goes into designing stuff, and it's not good when others try to make profit off of someone else's hard work.

Maybe in some places there aren't newcomers, but if that were true everywhere else, manufacturers and shops would see that then stop producing and selling. Not sure if racers are a dying breed. Mugen is a pure racing brand and continue making top quality stuff and now expanding into this class.

In any case I have NO problems with mugen prices.
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Old 06-27-2017, 02:33 AM
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Originally Posted by gigaplex View Post
$320 dollars in 2007 is roughly $380 in today's dollars simply by inflation. The relative prices haven't risen by as much as you suggest.
Considering the b64d doesn't even have a carbon top deck and sells for $430 I think it is.
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Old 06-27-2017, 05:39 AM
  #205  
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Hi all, I was a Mugen MTX-5 customer and I know that Mugen quality is very very excellent, but the only doubt I have is if Mugen can provide a continuous development to the car thanks to its official drivers (if any is already hired....) or is just a marketing operation to enter the electrical market.......from my point of view I don't want to spent more that 500 $ for a car that will not have any future development......
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Old 06-27-2017, 06:11 AM
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Originally Posted by charlie63 View Post
Hi all, I was a Mugen MTX-5 customer and I know that Mugen quality is very very excellent, but the only doubt I have is if Mugen can provide a continuous development to the car thanks to its official drivers (if any is already hired....) or is just a marketing operation to enter the electrical market.......from my point of view I don't want to spent more that 500 $ for a car that will not have any future development......
very true, haven't seen that car at any track or at any race yet, if it has they are doing a excellent job keeping it quiet
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Old 06-27-2017, 06:15 AM
  #207  
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Atsushi Hara has been doing alot of work on the car so I'm sure it wont be a dud... however being realistic it isn't likely to fall out the box and win a World Championship without further development. It needs to get more widespread exposure to all sorts of different tracks and conditions then it'll get here. I mean Xray have a rediculously big factory team all over the world - that is one of the main reasons the T4 platform is so successful. I'll be watching the MTC1 with interest as it really looks very well packaged.
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Old 06-27-2017, 06:20 AM
  #208  
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Prices are not explained by how much manufacturing, what materials or how much R&D or whatever else goes into making a product.

More often than not, taxes and overheads impact more the price than the actual cost of producing the goods.

In fact, manufacturing is costing less today with modern technology than it ever did in the past, in any terms you like (absolute or relative, adjust for whatever you want, inflation, fuel cost, energy, etc).

It is the damned overheads that go up and taxes.

But even that is not the whole picture.

A manufacturer will assess a product by weighing how much money it needs and decide at what price point they need to have the product on the market such that they make the projected profit (or not).

The "pre-order now" thing comes into play as the last reality check. If they do not fill the pre-order to the level they think guarantees profit later, they won't start production, and I doubt they will even honour the pre-orders. Or at best, if they know they'll break even they might do a production run to fill orders and stop there, then maybe wait to see enough guaranteed sales back up or give it up altogether. A lot of companies work like that, some big or really big ones. If the first production run works well and builds up desirability and market demand, they might have another small numbers production run a bit later. And so on. This keeps demand up, hence price. Best strategy for a small company. If it works, that is. The danger is that some other manufacturer might come up with something more desirable in the meantime, and you lose. In our hobby, people would probably move on and buy something else instead of waiting for another production run when they may or may not get their hands on a car. Let's hope Mugen is not banking on this strategy.
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Old 06-27-2017, 09:15 AM
  #209  
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If the quality and performance are there, price won't be a big issue. Awesomatix had a really expensive Shaft car in a world of belt drive cars. It had a radical suspension rethink and wasn't like anything else. The kit quality was top notch, the performance was great so people paid the price. Same here if the kit quality is good and it works reasonably well out of the box. People will pay the price. It's really a non issue.
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Old 06-27-2017, 01:35 PM
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This is not the right thread for this because Mugen makes great stuff and priced right.

The Orion hmx controller $385 and causing many problems. I'm surprised people buy them for the price and how others justify being ripped off. That just invites others to increase their prices also. If I'm wrong that $500 is more than enough for a race kit I'll accept that, but seeing how companies used to sell for so much less even if you include inflation makes me believe they are making good money. Only unless you work for them and in position to see would we know for sure.

But guys as consumers let's agree that we prefer lower prices. If we were on a budget and just wanted something to drive, a tc4 sells for less than $150 with parts and performance to match. I'm just saying $500 for premium parts and performance is enough. Why support prices that go way beyond that? I limit buying too many toy cars these days because I'd like to share my blessings with those that wish they had a bit of money for basic necessities.

Last edited by latentspeed; 06-27-2017 at 01:55 PM.
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