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Old 11-25-2002, 07:27 AM   #76
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Hi guys. Greetings from Malta.

I must say i have to agree about the new Tamiya 414.

The Tamiya image before that was one of a manufacturer of toys, admittedly very nice toys.

But all that has finally changed with the 414 series.

However, apart from the World Champ, has anyone else had some REAL results with it. Just curious. I don't mean at club level.

Regards

Joe from sunny Malta.
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Old 11-25-2002, 07:56 AM   #77
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Default Tamiya? Ugg...

Lots of new bandwagon followers. There are so many out there that just want to be different, even if its a pain to wrench on. What about chassis design? I can't believe the XXX-S is not more popular. Very low maintenance and its so easy to work on. Parts count is one of the lowest on the market. Closed belt design, what more could you want in a belted tourer. The Graphite plus has eventhing you could want at a very good price. I personally think the TC3 is easier to dial, but the XXX-S is not far behind. If a design can be made with only two screws, Schumacher will make it with 20 screws. Losi & AE are the only way to go! My two cents
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Old 11-25-2002, 10:25 AM   #78
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Losi-Asso UGGGGG!!!!! Both cars are the 2 most fragile cars on the market, believe me I have owned both.... actually 5 TC3's.... The Tc3 is not the easiest to dail in, the car is either loose or pushes.... there is no in medium ground. The Losi is far better out of the box, but doesn't like to be driven really hard.

The Mission is a pleasant mix of the 2 , and tough as nails to boot! The Schuie is easy to dial in and loves to be drien hard!!!! Not to mention much more adjustable with no seperate parts to buy to get those adjustments!

people bandwagon behing the M2??? alot of guys have been lusting after that Tamiya since the origional 414 pics appeared in the mags! However we dicided on different cars when it wasn't readily available, and got stuck with others when it became available..... The only downfall of the M2 is that it is really dialed out of the box, and most guys will leave the set-up where it is because it is so easy to drive..... thus sacrificing better laptimes unknowingly...........

BTW: neither the M2 or Mission need weight atchers or Jenny Craig!!!! LOL
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Old 11-25-2002, 10:31 AM   #79
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Quote:
Nightbreed Lots of new bandwagon followers. There are so many out there that just want to be different, even if its a pain to wrench on. What about chassis design? I can't believe the XXX-S is not more popular. Very low maintenance and its so easy to work on. Parts count is one of the lowest on the market. Closed belt design, what more could you want in a belted tourer. The Graphite plus has eventhing you could want at a very good price. I personally think the TC3 is easier to dial, but the XXX-S is not far behind. If a design can be made with only two screws, Schumacher will make it with 20 screws. Losi & AE are the only way to go! My two cents
I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "Lots of new bandwagon followers." Are you referring to the Losi bandwagon, or another?
Personally, I don't see anything wrong with wanting to be different.

Quote:
Parts count is one of the lowest on the market. Closed belt design, what more could you want in a belted tourer.
How about the inclusion of dual one ways??? Top notch instructions and parts fitment??? Maybe saddle pack option??? To name a few!

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Losi & AE are the only way to go! My two cents
Then you should go that way!

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Old 11-25-2002, 10:48 AM   #80
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Impactplayer,

You know I like Tamiya's hell I drove 900 miles just to race one. But I think you are a little off on your logic. The Tc3 is a very dialed car right out of the box maybe someone just hasn't helped you learn how to set one up properly. I just built another tc3 last week and finished putting ele. in it at the track and didn't even get a practice run with it and was able to make the A with out a problem. The xxx-s is pretty much the same way.

With all these cars it boils down to one thing and that is the wrench behind wheel. A good car can be made crappy very easy and a ok car can be made good. I have 3 different cars I bring to the track (tc3,XXX-S,Ta04r) Each one is better suited for a different layout and traction situation.I usually run the tc3 but I play with the Ta04 just because I like it for some reason.
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Old 11-25-2002, 02:39 PM   #81
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I had the car as dialed as closeas humanly possible and the quickest I could get it to rotate thru the turns was to break traction and swing the rear end around. Fast as hell, but also inconsistant.

The TC3 does fit some driving styles, just not mine.....
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Old 11-25-2002, 04:09 PM   #82
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Default Hummm...

AE and Losi fragil? Maybe, but its an easy fix for $6.99. Penguin and Brb bumpers. OR you can just try to stay off the walls.



AE is too easy to dial in if you ask me. No med ground set up, I must disagreee.

How many driving styles can there be out there? A good driver can adapted and make tunning adjustments to fit their style.




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Old 11-26-2002, 06:02 AM   #83
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Nightbreed- have you ever watched or competed in any form of racing??? There are many assorted driving styles. Some drivers are more comfortable with a car that is always on the edge of breaking traction, others prefer a car with a slight push, some like a "lazy" chassis (alot of body roll), while others like a really stiff chassis. Some guys are very smooth on the throttle, and others prefer to "blip" the throttle. I like my car to be slightly on edge, but I always found the TC3 to be a little too far over the edge. I found that no matter how I set-up the TC3 I just couldn't be fully comfortable with how it ran. Belt cars are far superior in that even if you aren't the smoothest with the throttle the extra "stretch" of the belt smooths out the throttle delivery.

Hmmm stay of the boards, even the very best drivers in the world smack a wall or 2. Barry Baker lost the worlds due to the fact that he tapped a board in the 3rd final race and broke an A-arm, and in one of the latest issue of Xtreme RC there is a picture of Mark Pavidis' TC3 launching off of a barrier and he is the current 200mm on-road world champ, I believe if 2 guys that have all that experience diving RC's to contend and win worlds championships slap the boards during some of the most important races of their carreers my occasional run-in with a barrier is acceptable........



I guess we will have to agree to disagree, because I don't think you will ever be able to find fault with your precious little pigs!!!LOL
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Last edited by IMPACTPLAYR; 11-26-2002 at 06:07 AM.
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Old 11-26-2002, 06:46 AM   #84
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Default Very Well Said

I have a pro3, and i hopped it up to the max and spend a lot, now it's better than the Hara Edition, I like it because when I hit something it does not break or tweak.

but

no matter how i tune it, my driving style is not in-tune with the car


I stuck with it because of the investment I made, both time, effort and money but i always finish last.

I got a TAO4-R and hopped it up to make it more competitive than it is, I like to drive it bec it has better turn in than the Pro3
(my opinion only), I am still not competitive


and now



Now I drive a TC3, and I have seen an improvement in my skills, a in noticeable difference, so maybe, this kit is in tune with my driving.


or maybe I just develop my skills along the way, but I still think its the kit, I will neve part with these kits mentioned, when I feel I am good enough, I will use them again. to see if its really the kit or just me.



Peace to all!!!


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Old 11-26-2002, 07:15 AM   #85
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Default Ok...

Impactplayer, you think the TC3 is to much on the edge? What is your driving style?
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Old 11-26-2002, 08:28 AM   #86
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I don't think that the car is the "boss" in the relation driver/car.
The driver is the boss and if you are good driver/mechanic you should be abe to tune every car to suite your driving skills/needs.

The fact that one car suites you more means only that you are not good enough to tune your others cars!! (That of course applies to me as well )

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Old 11-26-2002, 10:18 AM   #87
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ok heres what i would like to say about chasis/ driver relation ....
for most people they will say its non existant .. and i used to belive that it WAS NEVER AN ISSUE...... well u r the 'driver' and u call the shots on how the car behaved...

i changed my opinion when i got my a pro touring chasis
...after the inital introduction stage where u will try to get used to the car i was practicaly FLYING with it !!!!!

i ended up with a very AGGERASIVE and SENSITIVE seting giving rock solid and precise movement ..... i could control it well ..... and had lots of fun with it..... all i had to
do was relax and drive smoothly and the car will look fast and run fast......... its very nice to drive it hard as long as u r used to the car ......

it helped me improve on my driving because other cars felt soo easy to drive !!!!!


and when i changed to another car .... i could not find the 'comfort zone' which i i am soo used to

while driving it hard i will be turning in late for a turn or too early practically on each and every corner............

i did figure to find a similar setup which i was soo fond of... i got close..... but it was never the same feeling....

i am still trying to addjust my driving style to suit the car ......

so imho the car DOES play a role depending on your driving style .... but u will eventually get used to any car out there with some practice
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Old 11-26-2002, 10:55 AM   #88
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Oh definitely!!!! I don't like driving with the carbon chassis on the TC-3 - it makes it just a bit too aggresive for my style of driving. I like to pitch the car a bit and if I put the carbon chassis on then it is just too much and I have to go smooth (and anyone who knows me would laugh at me trying to be smooth. . . )

I have a friend who let me drive his nitro car (we car-swapped for a bit) and I found his car nearly undriveable - incredibly twitchy, and he found my car boring - very neutral. We both were fast (he is faster) and we both liked our style of car. . .

but is best when you can set your car up to be what you want it to be. I think that the TC3 CAN be set up any way you like it. You may have to drop to the plastic chassis to get a bit more forgiveness if you want that, but it can be done. . .
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Old 11-27-2002, 12:05 AM   #89
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Default well said nnick...

I have to agree, but also it depends on what class of chassis we are talking about. I am talking about chassis with adjustments. There are too many variables, so you should be able to get most chasiss to fit your driving style. Watch a pro driver, they can drive anything. If you ask me, most of it comes down to tires, and chassis flex. Chassis with good tires and a lot of flex, there is some room for setup error. Just a thought. Tamiya Uggg....
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Old 11-27-2002, 05:28 AM   #90
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Chassis with adjustments...

Well every top level TC chassis as the same adjustments that you can make to it, whether these be in the Xray-style or the TC3/XXX-S style with interchangeable blocks. Having driven the Xray Evo2 it is a different car to drive than the TC3, more neutral, and for me doesn't require as much concentration.

Personally, I think certain cars do suit certain driving styles. I raced a Kyosho MP7.5 last season. Half way through the season I changed to the Mugen MBX-4 XR Works. Having spent 3 solid days testing (2 with the UK team drivers) and 2 UK nationals I still was not as quick as with the Kyosho (qualified last, 84th, in the 2 nationals whereas with the MP7.5 I was as high as 33rd). I traded the Mugen with an MP7.5 Kanai and immediately went back up to 34th in the next national. I changed everything on the Mugen and just could not get the car to work for me.

So yes, to some extent you can make an Xray handle like a TC3, but I don't think that you will ever get them exactly the same. Maybe this has something to do with the chassis design. Does the Corally C4.1 or RC Lab have the same handling characteristics as the Xray due to their weight distribution? And is this why the TC3 and XXX-S are different due to their different chassis designs?
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