Like Tree128Likes

Xray T4'17

    Hide Wikipost
Old 07-20-2017, 02:09 AM   -   Wikipost
R/C Tech ForumsThread Wiki: Xray T4'17
Please read: This is a community-maintained wiki post containing the most important information from this thread. You may edit the Wiki once you have been a member for 90 days and have made 90 posts.
 
Last edit by: R Dodge
Welcome to the XRAY T4'17 Thread & Wikipost! Here you will find some useful info, tips and tricks as well as setups that are used by several team drivers. This wikipost is a work in progress and should continue to develop over time. Feel free to add anything you feel is useful to the community!

New for 2017:
The T4'17 comes available with either a Graphite chassis, or Aluminum Flex chassis. We recommend the Graphite chassis for starting on asphalt, and the Aluminum Flex for starting on carpet. The 2017 also comes standard with the floating swing rack as an option, and the Composite Graphite arms included. Most of the team prefers the Graphite arms for both asphalt and carpet, though sometimes Hard arms may be ideal for asphalt depending on the conditions. This year's car also comes with the new "In-line Flex Adjustment" which provides many more flex adjustments than in the past allowing you to focus & fine-tune on forward/back flex and side-to-side flex both together & independently. Additionally, the Ackermann has been moved back by 1mm and the spacing of the RF blocks is wider, creating 0.5° less rear toe from previous T4 models.

What's NEW at T4 2017? Convert your '16 to '17 specs with these parts:

- NEW chassis plate (3 options to chose from below)
- NEW Motor holder
- NEW Motor holder plate
- NEW center shaft holder
- NEW Floating Servo Mount

301142 T4'17 CHASSIS 2.2MM GRAPHITE
301143 T4'17 ALU CHASSIS 2.0MM - SWISS 7075 T6
301144 T4'17 ALU FLEX CHASSIS 2.0MM - SWISS 7075 T6

302536 ALU STEERING POST FOR FLOATING SERVO SAVER (2)
303066-O T4'17 ALU LAYSHAFT BULKHEAD CLOSED L/R - ORANGE
303067-O T4'17 ALU MOTOR MOUNT - ORANGE
303068-O T4'17 ALU MOTOR MOUNT PLATE - ORANGE
306204-O T4'17 ALU SERVO MOUNT - ORANGE
306233 T4'17 GRAPHITE FLOATING SERVO HOLDER 3.0MM
306530 T4'17 GRAPHITE CHASSIS STIFFENER 3.0MM

Tips & Tricks:

Alex Hagberg's Tech Tip Tuesday articles

How to mount your Protoform LTC-R Body
Setting static camber
How to mount weight on your chassis Part1
How to mount the rear wing on Protoform bodies
Simple troubleshooting guide
How to mount the battery on your chassis
How to glue your front tires for CRC Black carpet with Eric Anderson
Mastering the Sanwa M12S: Utilizing Exponential and RMode
How to mount weight on your chassis Part2
Mastering the Sanwa M12S: Utilizing TH-Hold

Team driver Tim Wahl posted some very useful build tips for the T4'16 on Facebook as he worked through building a new kit. These tips will still apply on the current model.

1- Carbon Parts
2-Suspension
3-Solid Axle and Differential
4-Bulkheads & Drivetrain
5-Driveshaft (ECS & CVD)
6-Front & Rear Suspension
7-Tweak
8-Anti-Roll Bar
9-Battery Fix (OPTIONAL)
10-Bumper & Body
11-Shocks
12-Steering

Center Brace:
The manual indicates using a 2mm shim under the center brace when attaching to the chassis plate. The gap is actually 3mm, so a 3mm shim should be used here.

Tuning Note:
On Carpet we have found that adding screws or doubling up the graphite brace will make the car react quicker to steering input, & change direction faster. Raising the graphite brace off of the aluminum bulkheads by placing a shim under it on the front and rear holes will reduce response. Using the tie-rod will reduce initial response to input, but will generate more in-corner traction or 'side-bite'. Using no brace will generate even more of this 'side-bite' but all of this is at the expense of corner speed. Best to use the tie-rod or no brace only in low-traction conditions. Additionally, the center brace increases forward traction, so removing it will potentially increase wheel-spin out of low speed corners.

New Graphite Hubs:
Xray have recently released some additional Graphite hubs for the T4 lineup. The 4° Graphite C-Hub has been out for some time and is known to improve steering on entry, and in general makes the car turn better. This has been the go-to c-hub on asphalt for many on the Xray team, though it is not needed on high bite carpet. The Graphite rear hub tends to make the car more stable, especially on corner entry. We are still working on gathering input on the new Graphite steering block, but for the moment feel that it should improve steering response. All Graphite parts are approximately 1g lighter than the Hard or Medium options.

ARS Tuning courtesy of Ed (TryHard):
If you set the ARS up with no shims under either inside or outside ball positions, it actually adds toe-in under compression, at around 1° at 5.2mm ride height (how much it adds depends how much the car compresses, obviously )

Adding shims reduces the amount added (1mm under one of the links gives about 0.5°), until the link has 2mm worth of shims (1mm either side, or 2mm on one side) makes the ARS neutral. Adding more shims then turns it into reducing toe in under compression.

Whilst that might sound a bit backwards, it's actually not quite as simple as it sounds. By having the links to add toe, you gain forward traction. Also consider as the car rolls, the inside wheel is in negative compression, and the outside in compression. So the inside is toe-ing out, and the outside toe-ing in, so the whole rear is then 'steering' in the direction of the turn. Obviously the inside wheel has a lot less influence than the outside as it's far less loaded, but the effect is still there.

Optional & Tuning Parts to consider:
XRA301196 T4 Graphite Upper Deck 1.6mm V2
XRA302254 Composite Steering Block - Graphite
XRA302334 Aluminum C-Hub Block - Caster
0° - Orange *Only for ARS*
XRA302383 Composite C-Hub Right – 4
° - Graphite (ECS)
XRA302384 Composite C-Hub Left – 4
° - Graphite (ECS)
XRA302711 Brass Front Lower 1-Piece Suspension Holder - Front - FF
XRA302803 1.3mm Front Anti-Roll Bar
XRA303360 Composite Upright 0° Outboard Toe-In - Graphite
XRA303802 1.2mm Rear Anti-Roll Bar
XRA305137 Steel Solid Axle Driveshaft Adapters - HUDY Spring Steel *Highly recommend*
XRA305242 Composite Drive Shaft Replacement Cap 3.5mm – Orange – Strong (QTY 4)
XRA305351 Aluminum Wheel Hub – Offset “-0.75mm” – Black (QTY 2)
XRA305352 Aluminum Wheel Hub - Offset
“+0.75mm” - Black (QTY 2)
XRA306191 T4 Graphite + Aluminum Fully Adjustable Battery Holder
XRA308264 4S Spring-Set Progressive C=2.5-2.8 (QTY 2)
XRA308276 4S Spring-Set C=2.7 (QTY 2)
XRA308286 4S Spring-Set C=2.6 (QTY 2)

XRA308039 Aluminum Progressive Shock System – Set (QTY 2) *Only for asphalt*

Recent Setups:
Bruno Coelho - IIC 2016 - High Bite Carpet - Modified
Alex Hagberg - AOC HK 2016 - Med Bite Asphalt - Modified
Jan Ratheisky - AOC HK 2016 - Med Bite Asphalt - 13.5
Chris Adams - Halloween Classic - High Bite Carpet - Modified
Chris Adams - ROAR Region 9 - Med Bite Asphalt - Modified
Craig Xavier - US Indoor Champs - High Bite Carpet - 17.5
Bruno Coelho - ETS Rd1 Hrotovice - Med Bite Carpet - Modified
Craig Xavier - Stock Wars - High Bite Carpet - 17.5
Jan Ratheisky - DHI Cup - Med Bite Carpet - 13.5
Chris Adams - Texas EOS Rd 1 - High Bite Carpet - Modified
Alex Hagberg - Snowbird Nationals - High Bite Carpet - Modified
Robbie Dodge - Snowbird Nationals - High Bite Carpet - 17.5
Jan Ratheisky - TITC - High Bite Asphalt - 13.5
Drew Ellis - ROAR Carpet Nationals - High Bite Carpet - Modified
Eric Anderson - ROAR Carpet Nationals - High Bite Carpet - 17.5
Martin Crisp - Canadian Nationals - Medium Bite Carpet - Modified
Martin Crisp - Canadian Nationals - Medium Bite Carpet - 17.5
Dan Hamann - MN State Champs - High Bite Carpet - 17.5

Print Wikipost

Old 08-30-2017, 03:42 AM
  #1501  
Tech Elite
 
Skiddins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Windsor, UK
Posts: 4,952
Default

Originally Posted by DoubleRR24
I just recently for the 2017 T4 and have started assembling it. I seem to have an extra parts bag labeled 300021. Is this accurate or did I miss a step somewhere? I've gone back over each step and I can't seem to figure out where I might have missed using them.

Any thoughts?
Can you take a photo of it's contents?

There is quite often a 'spares' bag that contains additional screws etc.
Skiddins is offline  
Old 08-30-2017, 05:45 PM
  #1502  
Tech Addict
iTrader: (54)
 
Jethroz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: MD
Posts: 593
Trader Rating: 54 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by Skiddins
There is quite often a 'spares' bag that contains additional screws etc.
Attached a picture of mine. It is indeed the 'Oops' bag.
Many laps of good luck if you never open it.
Attached Thumbnails Xray T4'17-p8301480.jpg  
Skiddins likes this.
Jethroz is offline  
Old 08-30-2017, 06:45 PM
  #1503  
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 103
Default

Originally Posted by DirkW

Great! That's accurate. Thank you
Rcracing01 is offline  
Old 08-30-2017, 09:44 PM
  #1504  
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: HK
Posts: 5
Default

I want to buy screw set for my T4, anyone try to buy screw from rcbees?
sorry that i can't post the link.
erikism is offline  
Old 09-02-2017, 01:23 AM
  #1505  
Tech Adept
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 113
Default

Originally Posted by erikism
I want to buy screw set for my T4, anyone try to buy screw from rcbees?
sorry that i can't post the link.
you mean their 12.9 screws? I am using their gold color ones and they are quite good IMHO... Didn't have any stripped one yet!

But they are heavier than titanium and alum screws...
otaku521 is offline  
Old 09-04-2017, 09:23 AM
  #1506  
Tech Addict
iTrader: (5)
 
OttoKrosse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: AZ, USA
Posts: 566
Trader Rating: 5 (100%+)
Default

I'm doing a complete rebuild of my shocks and need a reminder of how long the shock should be after screwing on the eyelets onto the shock shafts, with the shafts fully extended.

Thanks.
OttoKrosse is offline  
Old 09-04-2017, 10:18 AM
  #1507  
Tech Master
iTrader: (10)
 
tbrymer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,559
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by OttoKrosse
I'm doing a complete rebuild of my shocks and need a reminder of how long the shock should be after screwing on the eyelets onto the shock shafts, with the shafts fully extended.

Thanks.
Mark, mine are around 56.4mm.
tbrymer is offline  
Old 09-04-2017, 12:54 PM
  #1508  
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 7
Unhappy Understeer and pushing in corners

i am newbie and T4 17' is my first touring kit , i am having understeer issue

running on large asphalt track that usually has some dust on it

i am using Asphalt basic setup from teamxray website tires are Sorex 36

could you please help me with the understeer,
Attached Thumbnails Xray T4'17-t4_2017_set_up_asphalt_1.jpg  
obadvw is offline  
Old 09-04-2017, 01:11 PM
  #1509  
Tech Elite
iTrader: (15)
 
JEFFs SC10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Orlandooooo, Fl
Posts: 4,044
Trader Rating: 15 (100%+)
Default

check ride height first,
what's your toe out
what's your camber?
2.5-8 springs in the front
2.6 springs in the rear
500-550 cst oil
I also add 20 grams of weight in the front.
JEFFs SC10 is offline  
Old 09-04-2017, 01:13 PM
  #1510  
Tech Master
iTrader: (10)
 
tbrymer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,559
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by obadvw
i am newbie and T4 17' is my first touring kit , i am having understeer issue

running on large asphalt track that usually has some dust on it

i am using Asphalt basic setup from teamxray website tires are Sorex 36

could you please help me with the understeer,
Try changing the front eccentric bushings, both FF and FR, to be .1 down and in, so that you are lowering your roll center and narrowing the front track width. Try putting some harder springs on the rear, like xray 2.6 and maybe some progressive xray 2.3-2.6 (Or smj progressive yellow on the front, I've found to be great)

If your car is having trouble rotating, I'd reduce the rear toe from 3 to 2.5 and see if that also helps you. You can do this by using the .5 in and center bushings in the RR suspension block.

If you have a setup station, I'd make sure you are getting at least 26-29 degrees of steering throw in each direction.

Also playing with your droop so that you get more weight to transfer to the front off power will help you get into the corner, but that would also take away from the weight transfer to the rear on power. So its a balancing act.


Good luck
tbrymer is offline  
Old 09-04-2017, 01:38 PM
  #1511  
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 7
Default

1 deg toe out front
2 deg camber all around
2.5 springs all around
300 cst oil

Originally Posted by JEFFs SC10
check ride height first,
what's your toe out
what's your camber?
2.5-8 springs in the front
2.6 springs in the rear
500-550 cst oil
I also add 20 grams of weight in the front.
obadvw is offline  
Old 09-04-2017, 01:42 PM
  #1512  
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 7
Default

-right now the front is 0.1 down

-i have an offset wheels , i'll use zero offset ones and try

since i dont have other springs right now, can i change shocks to more vertical position ?

can you elaborate more on the droop?

right now i have 5 mm in front and 4mm at the back
thanks
Originally Posted by tbrymer
Try changing the front eccentric bushings, both FF and FR, to be .1 down and in, so that you are lowering your roll center and narrowing the front track width. Try putting some harder springs on the rear, like xray 2.6 and maybe some progressive xray 2.3-2.6 (Or smj progressive yellow on the front, I've found to be great)

If your car is having trouble rotating, I'd reduce the rear toe from 3 to 2.5 and see if that also helps you. You can do this by using the .5 in and center bushings in the RR suspension block.

If you have a setup station, I'd make sure you are getting at least 26-29 degrees of steering throw in each direction.

Also playing with your droop so that you get more weight to transfer to the front off power will help you get into the corner, but that would also take away from the weight transfer to the rear on power. So its a balancing act.


Good luck
obadvw is offline  
Old 09-04-2017, 01:53 PM
  #1513  
Tech Elite
iTrader: (15)
 
JEFFs SC10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Orlandooooo, Fl
Posts: 4,044
Trader Rating: 15 (100%+)
Default

droop is everything in these cars, if you have to much weight transfer to the rear you will understeer.

I'd go thru it and mark everything on a setup sheet.

300 cst oil is very light. same with springs.

The good thing it looks like your setup is off but can be fixed.

have you looked on the xray forum to see setups on asphalt with similar conditions?
JEFFs SC10 is offline  
Old 09-04-2017, 02:14 PM
  #1514  
Tech Rookie
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 7
Default

Should i go for more droop or less to fix the understeer?

Also noticed that chassis has scuff marks at the edges , so probably it touches the asphalt in corners , should i go higher roll center at the back ? Or raise the ride height?


Originally Posted by JEFFs SC10
droop is everything in these cars, if you have to much weight transfer to the rear you will understeer.

I'd go thru it and mark everything on a setup sheet.

300 cst oil is very light. same with springs.

The good thing it looks like your setup is off but can be fixed.

have you looked on the xray forum to see setups on asphalt with similar conditions?
obadvw is offline  
Old 09-04-2017, 03:40 PM
  #1515  
Tech Master
iTrader: (10)
 
tbrymer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,559
Trader Rating: 10 (100%+)
Default

Originally Posted by obadvw
Should i go for more droop or less to fix the understeer?

Also noticed that chassis has scuff marks at the edges , so probably it touches the asphalt in corners , should i go higher roll center at the back ? Or raise the ride height?
If it's just a little scuff, don't worry about it. If you constantly hear your car making noises while turning, then you have a problem. My car gets scuffs on the very edges and it's fast as hell I also race on asphalt and similar features.

Less front droop (higher down stop value) will reduce weight transfer to the rear of the car on power.
More front drop (lower down stop value) will transfer more weight to the rear on power.
Less rear droop (higher down stop value) will reduce the weight trasfer to the front of the car off power.
More rear droop (lower down stop value) will transfer more weight to the front off power.

I usually run 40 weight summer and 35 weight winter in my shocks.
tbrymer is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.