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Old 12-28-2005, 06:36 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by imjonah
$85 for a $5 worth of electronics is just the most egregious example of the industry's attitude toward the consumer.
This is an ignorant statement. First, you have absolutely no idea how much the parts that make a transponder cost. Second, you have no idea how much the company has tied up in development costs and costs just to begin production (molds, etc).

Add these to the cost of operating a business (personnel, insurance, advertising, promotion, customer service, etc.) and you will most likely find that the cost of the parts that make the transponder is a minimal portion of the cost of producing it.

Your example is like saying that you can get a watermelon seed for nothing but the supermarkets charge you $5 for a ready to eat watemrelon.

I would also be willing to bet your $100.00 tennis shoes have less that $5.00 worth of materials. And your latest $20.00 cotton t-shirt has about $0.25 worth of cotton.
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Old 12-28-2005, 06:48 PM   #62
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Ermm... Maybe also due to the exchange rates.I think AMD is from europe,so they use Euro.And Euro is a larger dinorminator than USD.So over the yrs as Euro riise against the USD,therefore the price of the AMD PT increases in accordence to the exchange rates increase...

Thats why people like me only can effort 2nd hand PT...
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Old 12-28-2005, 06:59 PM   #63
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How much does it cost to produce a set of brushes?
I know do you?
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Old 12-28-2005, 07:00 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by CIVIC91
I just don't like companies that say, "hey, lets see how far we can push the price on this and see if they will still buy it." It shows what they truly feel about their customers. Instead of trying to be reasonable..they go for the throat. Not all companies are like that.
True. That's exactly like Sanyo, before GP release at the market. Intel with AMD.
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Old 12-28-2005, 07:03 PM   #65
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Tracks spend several thousand dollars purchasing a lap counting system. Even if it was possible for the software to utilize two different sources for the laps, the tracks aren't going to buy more than one system unless they need to.

If someone could make a transponder compatible with the AMB system, then there might be competition, but the volume of sales is pretty low, so it is unlikely. There is also a question whether this would be legal, I don't know if there are any patents or such that might prohibit it.

AMB is not doing anything wrong. They have found a price point that allows them to sell their product at maximum profit. That is what businesses do. This is not a defense, this is just a definition of what business is all about. They are not in business to make customers happy, they are in business to make money. To a point, making customers happy will help them make money, but that isn't their purpose, just one method to help them make money.

Just think of it this way.... If you were able to double your salary without doubling your work, would you do it? If you do accept that double salary, are you price gouging? Your boss doesn't necessarily WANT to pay you double what you are getting now, but does it because he needs what you have, your knowledge and skills.

This is an item that most racers will only purchase one of. These things don't wear out, go obsolete, or get improvements. Most racers will go through several cars, radios, chargers and speed controls during the life of their transponder. So let's do the math, 3 touring cars at $300 each, 2 radios at $250, 2 chargers at $150 and 4 speed controls at $125... So, $100 for the transponder vs. $2,200 for the other equipment. It's a pretty small portion of what we spend over the life of our hobby.

Given that, by it's nature, this is a low volume item, AMB's margin will be pretty high. AMB has estimated how many they will sell and the amount of profit they need to make. Just like many companies, they sold the item at a discount (possibly a loss, who knows?) when it was new to get people interested. Now that it is successful, they can charge more. That's it, simple Supply and Demand.....
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Old 12-28-2005, 07:04 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by CIVIC91
When is the last time you saw any advertising for AMB? R/D??? when??? It's been the same product for years.
They're busy R&D-ing to just change the LED color.
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Old 12-28-2005, 08:47 PM   #67
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Default Thanks for making my point

You can take, argueably the most overpriced common item in all RC, and a majority of the posters will defend the pricing.
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Old 12-28-2005, 09:49 PM   #68
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You can take, argueably the most overpriced common item in all RC, and a majority of the posters will defend the pricing.
Rick will back me on this, the most overpriced item in all of RC is ADVERTISING!!!!

Pricing aside, I think they are great and worth more from an irritation perspective than anything else.

I remember spending about 15 minutes out of each race day looking for the guy that FORGOT to put back the transponder I was supposed to use... Or you grabbed the wrong color... or it fell out of the car, or the guy that was in charge of charging them forgot, and it cost you a race.

What about holding up races because a transponder can't be found. They also show up missing, lost ruined, and the club has to pay.

Personals are the way to go, and worth every dime. I can get my car ready, and it BE READY. Don't have to leave the body off, can get my tires done, don't have to wait for a transponder for a nitro car that you're already driving around and then have to stop and put it in, it's a pain. Good riddence...
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Old 12-28-2005, 09:50 PM   #69
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Almost $90 (right now) for a little piece of electronic device...yes, it is kinda expensive, but then, I am looking back at what I have so far for both electric and nitro on road RC Cars, tools and equipment...........I DID NOT find 1 single piece of item (charger, ESC, engines, tools, motors...etc) that does last me more then 3 years, and still, if I decided to quit RC, and sell it here or EBAY and I can STILL get at least $75 for it, no matter how bad shape it is.........(I have 5 now and I brought them like $50-65 each back then).

The AMB personal transponder probably is the ONLY RC item that does WORHT every single dollar and has the BEST (highest) resale value, period...

Not to mention....no upgrade on that, no options, no modification.....plug it in and you can race WORLD WIDE.

Compare to $500 JP full option motors, $40 Team spec stock/19T motors, $25 a set of foam tires per race day, $45 per set of rubber tires every 2-3 weekend.....$85 1.20v Pro-match.................AMB PT is nothing....and all you need is 1 for 1 car, not 1 per race day.
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Old 12-28-2005, 09:50 PM   #70
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I think the problem with AMB pricing, and most other RC related items, is they are selling to a fairly small audience. Let's say in the US there are 262,500 active RC racers (75% of RC Car Action's # of readers). This really means that RC companies are targeting a VERY small pool of people. In order to survive and continue to make cool products they have to make a good amount of $ per unit (the bigger the audience the less they need to make). Take a look at Much More. They are doing cool things and developing some really cool products that are pushing the edge, but they are making a ton of $ on each product they sell. Do I like it? Not at all, and when a cheaper alternative (knock off) becomes available I will scoop it up (ie Trinity Dyna Pulse) because after all I am American but in the meantime I understand the challenge the RC manufacturers have.
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Old 12-28-2005, 10:42 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by daniz24
They're busy R&D-ing to just change the LED color.

How about modification to sticker
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Old 12-28-2005, 11:57 PM   #72
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This may or may not have already been said but here goes. You can argue that the AMB personal transponder is overpriced. But then again, you need to look at it differently.

Think about this: You spend $400.00 on a car every 6-12 months and that car needs another $200.00 into it to be competitive on you local track. You are constantly buying $60-$70.00 battery packs, motors, brushes, ESC's and parts and all the upgrades and maintenance.

I bought 2 AMB transponders the time they were first made available to the public. I STILL HAVE THE 2 SAME TRANSPONDERS TODAY. They work as good as the day I bought them. Count all the batteries, motors, brushes, ESC's, chargers and hell even cars themselves. From the day I started in this hobbby 20 years ago, I've never used anything as long as I have used the AMB Transponder. It never breaks or needs fixing. It never needs to be updated or replaced for the latest and greatest. The one constant piece of equipment in my arsenal has been the AMB Transponder. Hell, you only need one because it can be moved from car to car in seconds and you'll never need another (at least until technology evolves or you fry it).

In the time I have owned the AMB Transponders, I have spent thousands upon thoudsands of dollars on batteries and yet I still have my original AMB's. I have gone through a TC3, RC12L3, Xray 04, XXX-S, TRF415 and now my main cars are my TC4 and RDX. Guess what, I am still using the same transponders. I have gone through Novak, Keyence, LRP QC1 and QC2 and am about to step up to the QC3 ESC and guess what, still have the same 2 transponders. Heck, I could buy 2 new AMB Transponders every year for what I have into body shells alone.

I can honestly say that almost everyone here can relate to me on this...even the person who started of this thread to complain...because if you are serious enough into racing to buy an AMB personal transponder, you buy the same stuff that I do as often as I do.

Sure the AMB may only cost $5.00 to manufacture. It could cost $.01 and I'd still be willing to pay hundreds for it. It's the only piece of equipment I ever bought that I use every single lap on the track since the day I bought it. It has helped me improve more than all my other equipment combined. You only need to buy it once and it's good forever.

Think of the AMB Transponder the way I described and now tell me any one could honestly complain about this piece of equipment as being too expensive.

I've said it many times and have been flamed for it just as I will be flamed for this post. We all knew what were were getting into when we joined this hobby. It's the nature of the beast. If you cannot afford to play, then don't. You can complain, you can write letters to the manufacture, you can boycote companies products but in the end unless everyone feels the same, nothing will change. After all you cannot please everyone all the time. There will always be people that are unhappy or feel cheated. I worked in retail for 10 years and I know that no matter what you do, no matter how nice you are, no matter how much free stuff you give someone, some A#$ Hole will always piss and moan. But then again, it's every person's God given right to complain, even if it makes no sense.

I could understand thread that complained about the need to buy 20 new battery packs every year. About buying a new $400.00 car every 6 months or spending insane amounts of money every year just top try and keep up with the latest technology. But to complain about the one constant thing in your pit box. The one thing you only need to buy once. The one item that offers the single biggest help in improving your driving skills. The one item that works the same for all the cars you drive...

...you mean to tell me that that is not worth $90.00 to you? Personally, I would be more than willing to pay three times that amount for that type of stability in this ever evolving hobby that is growing more expensive every day!
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Old 12-29-2005, 01:11 AM   #73
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This reminds me of Hudy, and how their professional wrenches have somehow doubled in price ever since their profitool range was introduced.

I remember purchasing my professional tools for $9-$10US about 2/3 years ago.
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Old 12-29-2005, 02:03 AM   #74
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You have sucessfully wasted 15 minutes of your life justifying the spending of $100 on a product that costs about $5 to manufacture

Sorry. but anyway you twist it...I'd find it difficult to shell out a C-note on something as simple as a personal transponder

Carry on....
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Old 12-29-2005, 02:31 AM   #75
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I purchased mine way back when they first introduced them..$45 now they are pushing a $100. God Bless America!! They charge this price to cover cost and all that crap,but ulitimately cost is determinedby "what the market will bear". On average rc replacement parts(arms and such) have about 40-50% markup for the retailer. I'm assuming that there is atleast a 25% markup involved with the transponders. When they were first introduced a local track/shop sold them at his COST just to make his life easier...$50. Do the math.

If everybody wants cheaper cable,gas or whatever, band together as intelligent buyers and make a difference. You won't get stuff at cost but the price would lower as "what the market will bear" becomes lower.

from what I understand AMB is pretty much the standard for other forms of racing. our transponders a trickle down of what is used in larger scale racing. i'm sure there was some re-engineering of the product to accomodate weight and voltage issues,but don't tell me this is all new technology and the isn't any other way for AMB,or any manufacturer to make money. We haven't even considered what shops are buying them for. I doubt any shop would sell them for $85-$90 if they didn't have to.

C'mon Rick..don't introduce all this info as if none of us here cannot somehow not comprehend the business end of any company. I always appreciate your take on things,but this time you can keep your snakejuice--Al
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