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Old 12-13-2005, 05:00 PM   #61
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[QUOTE=jiml] So what, stuff happens. You don't think scoring errors happen in full scale racing?
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Ya, usually about 3:00pm at a 24 hr race..... Did my car go by Oh S#$t!
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Old 12-13-2005, 05:01 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by JKA
Dawn - I was the highest seed not to make the playoffs in both of my leagues. lol DMac on IR killed me in both.
Keith, I know.. I just looked at the playoff lineup and I asked Sean where you were... you were the first bump out. He and Boomer are playing this week and I am stuck with Super Poopers... I would assume Boomer and Super Poopers and then Gas Butts. Nobody beats Michelle.. but me.. TWICE!! LOL

If I only had a RB that would, well, run..... I have never changed my QB nor my primary WR.
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Old 12-13-2005, 08:41 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dawn Sanchez
Adrian - um... excuse me?? In all honesty, I don't believe you and I have ever spoken so please... of course, [email protected] is always open and never have I disregarded an email or neglected to work on a situation. There might not be the solution you want... but at least attempt before you condemn? (posted with all due respect.. no offense ever intended.)
You and I never had a reason to speak. Your were not in a position that had anything to do with Electric On Road rules or the US IFMAR Worlds in 2004. If you did then you need to have a talk with Rick and Randy as they never told me I needed to speak with anyone other than them.

My contact with ROAR was always with Randy Holst (Electric Comitee Chair and IFMAR Liason) and Rick Wilson. I would assume that those two guys should be able to sort out all IFMAR World and Electric Comitee issues. Turns out that when things got tough and decisions needed to be made rather than standing up and making a call they crawled into holes and disappeared.

Heiner Martin (The IFMAR Competition Director), John Grant (Former IFMAR Prez.), The World's Promotor and Dallas from EFRA all had the same experiences as me during this ordeal.
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Old 12-13-2005, 09:52 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by AdrianM
You and I never had a reason to speak. Your were not in a position that had anything to do with Electric On Road rules
Okey dokey.. Nothing like putting me in my place... totally understand your statement.

Mike Queller is the new ROAR President and he can be reached at [email protected]

ROAR Promotions duty is membership contact..no matter the issue.
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Old 12-13-2005, 10:00 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dawn Sanchez
Okey dokey.. Nothing like putting me in my place... totally understand your statement.

Mike Queller is the new ROAR President and he can be reached at [email protected]

ROAR Promotions duty is membership contact..no matter the issue.
Dawn,

I will say I had no idea that membership contact was a duty of the promotions director. That leads me to my next question. Is there a write list of the ROAR By-laws that says what each duty is and how it should be done?
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Old 12-13-2005, 10:06 PM   #66
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Quote:
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Dawn,

I will say I had no idea that membership contact was a duty of the promotions director. That leads me to my next question. Is there a write list of the ROAR By-laws that says what each duty is and how it should be done?
You could contact Fred Hohwart at [email protected] for a .pdf of the bylaws. They are not installed on the website as of yet. Or.. there is a thread on here somewhere that they were posted when somebody was angry at a new rule put in place.

Yes, membership communication and promotions of ROAR is my job. To be honest, I didn't know there was a promotions director for ROAR until I was asked to do the job. When Rick Wilson took office, his first goal was to make the ROAR excomm more accessible to the membership. It was his goal to show the membership several different avenues of contact and to begin to realize their questions can be answered by an email, phone call or opening up a thread on any message forum.
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Old 12-13-2005, 10:51 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dawn Sanchez
One thing about ROAR I cannot stand is the tolerance level. We allow people to "bash" the organization publically and even at a national event. We allow bashing in the media and we allow people to get in our faces and publically disrespect the position and the job. NASCAR doesn't... and with so many comparisons to how ROAR should do things like NASCAR, I believe behaviorial modification and penalties should be imposed. (sure, call me a MOM!! LOL)

Dawn, come on. ROAR is an organization made up of members and the members are some of the people bashing. The "media" reports things as they are seen. What I can't stand about ROAR (not you) is that they take no stand either way. It seems the route of least resistance for ROAR is point finger in two directions thinking not making a decision (wrong or right) is the best route. Whatever reason that is it needs to change.

But if ROAR was so concerned with "bashing" maybe all you people that volunteer there should read REV-UP or what I lovingly refer to is ROARs memo to ROAR how bad they suck. Not only is it the worst thing I've ever read (when I can make myself read it) it does nothing but complain about itself and let new members know that ROAR doesn't even care enough to make sure it's Official Newsletter doesn't look like a rambling email arguement. Even the newsletter I got at my old apartments knew enough to remind everybody there how great it was to live there. I still remember one that said my crappy apartment was like living in the White House. It made me laugh, but if it said You live in a dump and we're going to charge you more everymonth and offer less service, I think I would have moved earlier.


The sad truth is that ROAR is a mess. The mentality it posses is old and out of date. And until a reorganization comes about nothing will change for the better. Sometimes you need to burn down the place to start over. The only thing holding ROAR up right now is it's one of the only ways into IFMAR Worlds Events. I can say if something else got that approval then it would be a quick slide off the map for ROAR.

So use that Trump Card and start do something. Make some bad changes, average changes, but try to change something to stir things up. The only thing i can think that changed is that ROAR made it harder for change with the EXCOMM and president.

I honestly think that Ernie would have made a difference. At worst he would have done nothing, at best he could have ruined the place so there was a fresh place to start.
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Old 12-13-2005, 11:26 PM   #68
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Keith you can say anything you want about my attitude but I am not on the Excomm. I am simply a member that actually votes. I went to a crl electric race last week to observe and all I heard about was this 44mm battery deal. If it was that big of a deal to those it effected then they should have made their voices heard.
Out of the people that voted I know 30 that I know voted and none of them had a serious concern about the battery thing. thats not saying we don't care what happens its just that we weren't following it or its impact. If the folks that run electric most of the time didn't want it that way they should have voiced their displeasure by voting.
It is not going to change my origional statment either I stand by what I said everyone has the opportunity to have their voice heard and if they choose to remain silent then they should stay that way not complain about the outcome. It is this simple fact why no one wants to volunteer for ROAR positions and step up to the plate only to get pummeled for trying to do the right thing. so the way I see it were all insane because the definition of that is to continue repeating the same thing over and over again with the expectation of different results.

Quote:
Electric racers need representation and that is what Dennis was trying to convey more than anything.
that is exactly what I meant but but I also meant if you waiting for somone to come along and hand you a silver spoon its going to be a long wait. It might even be real cold somewhere before that happens.

Derek I'm not going to disagree with you but I certainly ain't touching that one
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Old 12-14-2005, 02:57 AM   #69
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When are we going to find out about the new battery rules?January 1st is fast approaching.
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Old 12-14-2005, 06:32 AM   #70
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This battery rule business is a mess. 95% of the ROAR membership do not have the technical knowledge to know what the issue with 43mm vs. 44mm is all about. Because of this there should never have been a public vote...even if it was just advisory.

In this case If I were the Technical Directer I would be on the phone with the top US matchers and Battery Importers to get their opinions on the matter. I would also have sent emails to the IFMAR, EFRA and FEMCA Tech directors to get an ideal what they thought. I then would have made my recommendation at the ExCom and there would have been an internal vote and that would be it.

This could all have been done two months ago.

Dawn - Has Bob Ingersoll completed all of the above steps? What is his recommendation as the ROAR Tech Director?
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Old 12-14-2005, 07:31 AM   #71
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I hate to agree with Adrian :> , but he hit the nail on the head with the Battery fiasco. I would like to add, that ROAR, or any other sanctioning body really should not try to work around international standardards on cells. IFMAR made a bad call, and we follow suit ?. Time to move past this judgement.

Being on the Electric On Road Committee, I or anyone else on the committee did not know about the advisory vote beforehand. Why have a committee when it is not consulted ?

Bad or Good , Rick is gone, pin this fiasco on him, and keep the rules as they are. It was an advisory vote, and after all consideration, make the call to keep it the same as it is now.

I still believe ROAR can be the organization it once was in North America......

Lets Clean house....Pick up and run with the good things Rick started on, dump the bad habits...

I am sure some of my comments, being on a committee will be frowned up from Uppper ROAR leadership, but it has come time for this kinda thing
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Old 12-14-2005, 07:39 AM   #72
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Tim, Clean house, and show us that ROAR has made changes for the better and people will come. As far as the Nat's still having prestige???? Plelase. If the factory guys didn't have to go they probably wouldnt. And unless I'm mistaken ROAR has the right to pick what track has the NATS, don't pick a location that isn't capable. Scotty put on the IIC for the 1st time and it is already considered to be THE race to go to. Want another suggestion. Get rid of the 49486 classes. Simplify things. You want to run a National you run stock or mod touring car and stock or mod 1/12. Too many classes just kill Racing.
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Old 12-14-2005, 07:53 AM   #73
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Bob,

Anything that Scotty does is TOP NOTCH., but that being said, you are contradicting yourslf. How many classes at the IIC ?

I think for the nats we are in the right zone for classes, but they need to be deliniated better.

1. Stock TC - You end up in the top 5 for stock, gotta move up the next year.
2. 19t - No Professional Drivers. ( too long of a discussion on how to determine)
3. Mod TC - it is what it is, but I believe you should have to finish in the top 10 at a regional or top 5 in 19t the previos year to be able to run.
4. Stock-19t 12th, personally I prefer 19t 12th, but either way, top 5 in this class, must move up the next year
5. Mod 12th, same as Mod TC
6. Masters - whichever class 12th or TC, should run 19t motors.

BTW, how could anyone think that the IIC WOULDNT be the race to go to ?
It is being run by one of the best in the business,AND it is VEGAS ?????
If ROAR could PICK one GREAT place to have a National, and find a great team to run it, hmmm. Just dont compare... it is not apples to apples...
I am not saying ROAR should not try to be as good as these guys are at running races, because they should.... but don't compare a once a year race in the same place, to the system that is in place for the ROAR Nationals.
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Old 12-14-2005, 08:06 AM   #74
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Not contradicting myself...I said ROAR needs to make it simple. As you get it down you can expand. Right now the NATS cant support 8 classes (or whatever they have currently). Fix the problem, get the attendance, get the luster, get the desire to attend, then add your "flavor of the year" classes.

I want ROAR to succeed but I also am fed up with the lack of direction this orginzation exhibits. Pick a goal...make it public, get people involved and Achieve this goal. I went to a regional and watched as a total of 15 people raced in it. I mean come on. 15 people.
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Old 12-14-2005, 08:33 AM   #75
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You make good points Bob, but I think there were 6 classes at this years On-Road nats.

Maybe you would get more entries in your regionals if people knew they had a chance to win Stock.

People Like Cuffs really hurt the Regional level racing. How many National STOCK titles does he need ?
Move up or get out. Get some integrity

The comments are not just directed at Cuffs, but the many people like him. My comments are my own, and not of ROAR in this matter
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