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Old 11-10-2005, 09:19 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by stumper
Because you said RC is like EVERY SPORT PLAYED ............. And by your example about 12yr olds is why pro level drivers shouldnt be in stock......Why are pros in stock ? To beat up on the little guys ???
I think that oversimplifies why factory guys run stock. I think it could be one reason, but it's not the only reason. Here a few reasons in no particular order:

1) Cars are manageable on the small carpet tracks most of us run on on a weekly basis. (Our previous indoor track had a straight of about 70-75' maybe...it was tight and small. Modified motors went no faster. Fast laptimes were 8.5-10 seconds depending on layout.)

2) Some people feel mod is more expensive. That's debatable, but whatever.

3) There's simply more competition. Locally, it's not really that enjoyable having to race against 2 other people in your class. Generally stock (and 19T) usually have a good group of racers.

4) No issues with dumping. Believe me, if you saw Hara at Vegas, you'll know ANYONE can dump in mod even with 490+ second packs. He dumped a couple of times just as he was finishing his run.

I personally was glad there were fast guys running stock when I got back into the sport two years ago after a 12 year hiatus. Because of a few local drivers (Schreff and Cuffs in particular), I was able to raise my game very, very quickly. By the time the Nats came around, I was confident I could do well because I was accustomed to running with guys that always made the A at large events. Sure enough that proved true.
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:20 PM   #62
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Jon, does indoor racing use more battery than outdoor?
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:22 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by Ike
Doesn't that tell you that maybe he should have moved up a long time ago?
Ummm...no. I can't speak for Mark, but Ray ran stock at a high level for a couple years max. During that time he won multiple times at different events.

What it tells me is that he was able to get adequate preparation before moving up. If he would've moved up prematurely he would've been 'slaughtered'.
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:25 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by Jon Williams
I think that oversimplifies why factory guys run stock. I think it could be one reason, but it's not the only reason. Here a few reasons in no particular order:

1) Cars are manageable on the small carpet tracks most of us run on on a weekly basis. (Our previous indoor track had a straight of about 70-75' maybe...it was tight and small. Modified motors went no faster. Fast laptimes were 8.5-10 seconds depending on layout.)

2) Some people feel mod is more expensive. That's debatable, but whatever.

3) There's simply more competition. Locally, it's not really that enjoyable having to race against 2 other people in your class. Generally stock (and 19T) usually have a good group of racers.

4) No issues with dumping. Believe me, if you saw Hara at Vegas, you'll know ANYONE can dump in mod even with 490+ second packs. He dumped a couple of times just as he was finishing his run.

I personally was glad there were fast guys running stock when I got back into the sport two years ago after a 12 year hiatus. Because of a few local drivers (Schreff and Cuffs in particular), I was able to raise my game very, very quickly. By the time the Nats came around, I was confident I could do well because I was accustomed to running with guys that always made the A at large events. Sure enough that proved true.
I think #3 is such a big factor like I pointed out earlier, things are spread around too much.

Plus, can we stop calling RC racing a sport
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:26 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by ChadCapece
If you can, name a sport where someone is considered great by winning in amateur events and never moving to the pro's.
Dude, thats a total contradiction to your whole arguement........... Pro level guys SHOULD move on because they're basically competing against amatuers....
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:28 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aurra Sing
Sometimes, tracks aren't big enough or don't supply enough traction to suit cars with mod motors effectively. These are the tracks when the lap times of mod motor equipped cars are the same, if not slower, than 19t cars. Although it's true that you need more skill and talent to drive under these conditions, the fun and excitement of driving an r/c car is eliminated because you will be constantly struggling for traction and "racing action" will be more difficult since it is harder to stick to a line to make a pass. This is why most people I know simply run 19t class whenever we race on such tracks. I personally do believe running mod will make you a better driver (not necessarily "racer".) But if the track is not suited to run mod, then it's more beneficial to learn how to race against more cars on a closer pace (19t) than it is to race against fewer cars that are on your pace or overshooting every corner (mod). As for stock... stock is definitely too slow and should be ran only by the beginner
Precisely, & in my neck of the woods that's EXACTLY why we don't see a mod class much at my local track, it just doesn't provide enough grip to put that kind of power down. However, we DO have multiple levels of stock & we do run 19 turn when we have enough guys who want to(& when we all have a good supply of tires to keep our cars working, the surface here is also pretty abrasive, the more power you use the faster the tires go bye-bye). In fact, our stock classes are divided up into Novice(for beginners), regular Stock(for those graduating from Novice & for those who feel they can't hang with the fastest guys, more for fun than being ultra-competitive), & ProStock where the fast guys run(& if tires are in short supply, that's what I'll run, plus with my last car, an original tub-chassis TC4, it couldn't handle any more than a stock, so I ran that alot before I got my FT car). but now that I have a car that can handle the extra power, I do run as much 19 turn as I can, & we've gotten a steady group of guys to do it(pretty much all the guys with any sponsorship & the rest of us who can hang with them). Honestly, that seems to keep everyone pretty happy, not much sandbagging, & everyone is in a class they're comfortable with & can have fun in....
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:30 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ike
Plus, can we stop calling RC racing a sport
Fine...hobby.

Whatever. It's just a term. Dictionary.com lists the third definition of 'sport' as:

an active pastime; recreation.
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:32 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by ChadCapece
Mod 2wd buggy is crazy fun.

Yup. I don't think there's any greater joy than a 9 single in my MF1; that thing is stupid fast. There's no reason for that kind of speed.....
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:33 PM   #69
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People that have been running stock for the past 10 years and doing well and winning at the big events need to step it up and run mod. Mod anything is not easy, you don't just start running mod and go out and expect to make the a-main. It takes years, to get it down, especially now with how fast the cars are. I think it would be good if some type of rule was enstated, say that over a years period if you consistantly finish in the top 3 of stock then it's time to climb up the ladder a rung to 19t, and then to mod. Just my opinion.
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:34 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ike
Plus, can we stop calling RC racing a sport
To me calling RC Racing a sport vs. a hobby depends on your commitment to it. If you're like myself and Jon Williams here, we dedicate a great deal of time to this and race it at a level to where it truly is a sport. If you're just a club racer and don't put as much to it as we do, then it's a hobby. It all depends on the person.

And as far as top-level racers staying in stock...since most people that race with me would put me at that level I can speak for the group. Most of us don't want to continue running stock forever. It's like Jon said, the race experience and ability to consistently drive fast lines only comes from a couple years of high-level racing in stock. You can't just go and jump into mod if you can get a car around the track decent---you'll have yourself a handful. If you haven't been to a major race where stock is by far the most competitive class (meaning that the top 30 guys have only a lap spread between them), then you don't know what you're talking about. Once you've been to a race like this, you'll never say stock is a "beginner" or "novice" class. Racing at that level for a good period of time gives you invaluable skills that will do an incredible amount for someone moving up to modified.
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Last edited by Brian McGreevy; 11-10-2005 at 09:44 PM.
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:37 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian McGreevy
To me calling RC Racing a sport vs. a hobby depends on your commitment to it. If you're like myself and Jon Williams here, we dedicate a great deal of time to this and race it at a level to where it truly is a sport. If you're just a club racer and don't put as much to it as we do, then it's a hobby. It all depends on the person.


Sport vs. Hobby should have its own thread-cuz it's a good way to piss off a bunch of people.....
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:38 PM   #72
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Nobody said you have to put a 6 turn in, and nobody is forcing you to pull the trigger either. Look at nitro, they don't have these issues. Get rid of stock, it solves more issues then it creates.
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:43 PM   #73
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No, you just spend a lot more time at your hobby than the rest of us IMO... Being great at RC racing takes the same skill set as it does to be great at video games.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian McGreevy
To me calling RC Racing a sport vs. a hobby depends on your commitment to it. If you're like myself and Jon Williams here, we dedicate a great deal of time to this and race it at a level to where it truly is a sport. If you're just a club racer and don't put as much to it as we do, then it's a hobby. It all depends on the person.
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:43 PM   #74
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If we got rid of stock then mod would just be divided into 3 classes. And as far as big races, there arent many people that go to Big races that consider themselves novices.

Everyone wants to win and thats just not possible.

If your comparing RC car racing and Video games you obviously dont compete on a level that some of us do.
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Old 11-10-2005, 09:44 PM   #75
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Agree with Andrew. I think there really should be some sort of time period of good results before you're required to move up.

Brian, I think you may be hitting the nail on the proverbial head there. I think there really are two dichotomous attitudes behind the points being raised. I think the whole arguement does hinge on whether you feel racing is a 'sport' or a 'hobby' to you. I think if you view R/C as a 'sport', you're probably more aggressively, actively working at improving your skill and knowledge and grateful to have tough competition no matter how far down it makes you finish.

On the other hand if you're viewing it as a 'hobby' I think you lean more towards a passive, relaxed view of racing. Subsequently, you're more likely to be frustrated when guys who are super good are running stock because it makes it much more difficult for you to win or run with those at your skill level. (Disclaimer: I'm not talking about guys who've been running stock for 20 years making A's. I do think that sucks. You know who you are. )
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