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Rear tires heating up...

Rear tires heating up...

Old 11-05-2015, 07:33 PM
  #16  
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Whats your dual rate? Too much steering lock can cook the tires very quickly. If you're over 80~85%, try backing it off a bit.
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Old 11-06-2015, 07:15 AM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by theproffesor View Post
Ok I think you found your own problem. Your tires are old. Get new ones. Tires that old may look like they are in good shape wear wise, but they are actually pretty messed up. I had tires that were actually fairly new, and looked to be in great shape. But my car was violently traction rolling no matter what I did. I got a whole new car, used old electronics and tires. First lap, violent reaction roll. Fought it all day. Then another driver let me borrow a set of his tires. Instant change. Car became very drivable.

Try new tires
Old tires are probably part of the problem but still there's a weight transfer issue problem. I think trying different setups is a good way to learn how different changes will work for me instead of buying my way out of this issue. Unfortunately also, I'm the biggest budget racer you will ever know. So no new tires.

Originally Posted by EDWARD2003 View Post
Alright.

First thing - Just because it doesn't leak doesn't mean you don't have to change the oil. At club level you should be looking at changing the oil 1-2 times a month. It's important to freshen up the oils to maintain consistency.

Gear diff oil - 7k-10k
Shock oil - 450 oil
Roll centers - 1.0 mm front inner link and (1.0 mm rear inner link 0.5 mm on outer hub)
These shim settings should reduce the amount of camber gain on the front and increase the amount of camber gain on the rear. I would even go lower on the rear and try no shims on the rear inner link. Leave the outer hub shim as it is.
Springs. You have one of two options
1) Go one spring rate harder on the front and leave the rear.
2) Keep the same springs, but move one hole out on the front and or one hole in on the rear.

What are your shock tower positions?

Droop - 2.0mm front 2.5 mm rear

New Tires!!!!!!

Also type of wheel plays a big role in how the car is planted. A multi-spoke rim will flex more and make the car more forgiving. I've found it really plants the car down on the track. Perfect for low-medium grip situations. A dish rim is stiff and will make the car more reactive and I would say is ideal for medium-high grip situations.

The hot ticket at my track is 5 spoke wheel, Sweep Blue insert, and Sorex 28's.
On list to try: front spring harder, shock angle changes (currently front and rear at 4 on a 0 to 7 range)

Further down the list: shock oil change

Diff oil that high? Wouldn't that make my rear more loose especially on power?

Also droop I think I'm at max 4. Reason max cause the springs become loose in the shock after any more droop.

Thanks for the insight about rim characteristics. Sorex are also the hot ticket at our track the last few years. I just haven't tried them yet.

Next weekend there's a big regional race and they are using Sweep 28's, a new handout tires for the 2 TC classes (I've always used one set for both classes) vs Sweep 32's the last few years and Jaco Blues before that. Tonight is club racing and I think if I can get my mod car decent, it will be more competitive next weekend.

Originally Posted by Will27 View Post
Whats your dual rate? Too much steering lock can cook the tires very quickly. If you're over 80~85%, try backing it off a bit.
Dual rate. That's an interesting discussion in its own.

I unfortunately wasn't taught how to use a wheel type controller properly when I started. I also never used brakes in the beginning cause the slower classes you really don't need to and I was a lock to lock driver. Bad habits.

I've notice the fastest guys I race with their dual rate is like 90-100%. Looking at them controlling the wheel, they can use smaller but well controlled steering input in a small area around the mid point. My dual rates use to be around the 70s but now I'm playing with around 95 and same with brakes and learn to make them feel like drag braking when I hit the brakes and not feel like an on off switch. It's tough to relearn both but I don't think I can improve without trying.

Always appreciative of feedback,

Ivan
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Old 11-06-2015, 07:20 AM
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Buy new tires. The 3+ year old hand me down tires your using suck.
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Old 11-06-2015, 08:00 AM
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Never mind. I should either learn to read or not post when tired.

Last edited by DirkW; 11-06-2015 at 03:33 PM. Reason: got something totally wrong
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Old 11-06-2015, 08:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Akhor View Post
Buy new tires. The 3+ year old hand me down tires your using suck.
You gave him too much credit, I bet some are more than 3+ years old.
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Old 11-06-2015, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by joech View Post
You gave him too much credit, I bet some are more than 3+ years old.
lol. Your right.. My bad.
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Old 11-06-2015, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Akhor View Post
lol. Your right.. My bad.
You speak of new tires, however I am still trying to get my head around the thought of ivan purchasing a new car. What's next? will we be able to walk on water? Mind blowing revelations are a foot today.

Sorry off topic, buy new tires Ivan!!!!!
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Old 11-06-2015, 03:29 PM
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Yes, the differential oil can be that high. Better yet, since you're running modified I would try 5k-7k.

So, I would keep the springs the same and run the rear shock hole on the 3rd hole.

Droop - it's not ideal for your springs to "unload" and lose connection from the spring cup. I think your droop settings will play a pivitol role in your chassis setup. Make an effort and set the droop at 2.0 front and 3.0 mm rear. You'll have to test and tune, I find 2.0 and 2.5 mm work well on carpet.
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Old 11-07-2015, 04:37 AM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by BoneCrusher View Post
Old tires are probably part of the problem....

Ivan
Err, yeah, maybe
So solve that problem first, it's the simplest.

THEN, if you still have issue we can help.

They're the single most important part of a setup, and you're not even prepared to change that!
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Old 11-07-2015, 10:16 AM
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I'll ignore my clubmate's comments. I hear them all the time even though I have most of the time competitive cars, the lowest rate of mechanical issues or not finishing a race against almost anyone I have ever raced against. "You need new this and that." Nah. I think learning setup outside of getting new tires will help me even more to learn about my car. That's why I'm asking for setup advice and not what new stuff I need!

Anyways, had a great time club racing last night. Played around with a few things and in the end in the finals I settled on:

- increased rear toe -3.0 to -3.5
- front droop from 5 to 4.
- increase one level harder front spring
- front shock angle laid down one hole in
- still gravityrc sauce full rear and 90% fronts

After the mains I was 110F both rear tires, 105 outside front tire and 95 inside front tire. 5.5t motor was about 140F. Car in my opinion ran pretty good (tad understeer and I have to work on smoother accelerations and braking) and car was better than the driver. Was about 0.2sec slower fast lap than the fastest drivers and my consistency was around 0.2sec top 20 laps and I did smack quite a few boards.

Car was planted and some of the faster drivers mentioned it looked very planted when not off the driving line but a bit too safe looking. I think this is a great start. Big regional race next weekend so hopefully this setup transfers well from 32 shore Jaco Blues to 28 shore Sweeps (forced handout tires) as I won't have time to do any setup changes during the race weekend as I'll be running multiple classes (8 of 9).

The weekend after for club racing I might try the rear diff changes which might rotate the car better and extra droop (better front and rear weight transfer) and I also need to figure out if my shocks can even do that. Roll centres after that. Lots to test out!

Thanks again for advice and I'll report how stickier tires work out next weekend.

Ivan
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Old 11-08-2015, 10:04 PM
  #26  
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I would try newer tires. If that doesn't work or you're totally dead set against it, thicker rear oil is a good bet that won't affect the car much in other areas. Droop changes affect the car more than an oil change will.

But seriously...

Get some new tires. Some HAND ME DOWN SWEEPS or Sorex 28's or something. Anything is better than the tires we haven't ran in 3 years.
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