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Old 10-24-2005, 06:37 PM   #1
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Default Can anyone offer some advice for a new Electric user on Tc4 vs Losi XXX-S?

Hi, just found the forum here and it looks very active and a nice place to stay awhile =).

I know everyone hates the n00b coming in asking questions without searching ...

I have been doing some searching and researching on this the last few days and i and a friend will probably buy one of the 2 cars each tomorrow.

I have a local Hobby shop that has a carpet track in back and has both the Tc4 and Losi XXX-S for sale. I am looking for a RTR kit for my first car, at the moment i am leaning towards the Tc4 since it looks like i can do the Team Factory upgrade later and toss in a bigger motor and be in decent shape. Does that sound like a good plan, or is there a reason to go for the Losi over this? I am not sure if there is a advantage to Shaft vs Belt.

I plan on upgrading to a Spectrum Dsm controller in the next month or so for my car i get and my Revo. The revo is the extent of my RC experience so far.

So i come to you the experts here for advice on the 2 cars, and any advice on what i need on day one (which battery, and are there some foam tires better then others)?

Also any day one upgrades that should be done with either, or go beat it up some and get used to it then upgrade?

Thanks for the help, and nice place you got there
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Old 10-24-2005, 08:51 PM   #2
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both are good kits, check to see what the majority of people are running at the track.this way more of your questions could be answered regarding setup later. next what is the parts availability like for that kit at your local hobby store, when you break parts do they have them in stock. as for tires again what do most people at the track run and ask them what type of compounds you should start with. batteries is a tuff one stick or matched if you feel that you are going to stay in the hobby spend alittle extra and buy matched i like the smc packs, but more or less they are all the same. hope this helps
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Old 10-24-2005, 09:07 PM   #3
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Thanks for the reply. Both are very well supported by the hobby shop. I seen a build up in a RC magazine today showing $166 in add ons to a stock Tc4 and it was running 43 mph. I am pretty sure we will end up going with that.

One thing i have not seen is what is the avg time the battery will last on a run?

Thanks
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Old 10-24-2005, 09:19 PM   #4
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I would go for TC4 if there are only two choice like that.
Check for sure about LHS parts support.
Also since you are new to EP, having an experienced driver as your mentor/friend is good. Buy the same car as he used and ask for the set-up. It's the easiest way to start with.
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Old 10-24-2005, 09:25 PM   #5
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depends on what motor or racing you are doing, min. batteries should be 3300's you can make run time in stock and most mods with these but go 3800's. dont worry about going fast, speed doesn't come from a motor it comes from practice, start with a stock motor and go from there the tc4 is a not bad car
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Old 10-25-2005, 05:33 PM   #6
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Friend bought a Tc4 setup today at our LHS. The owner was there and gave us a good deal since he has bought a ton and brought in a lot of business which was cool of him. I am going to pickup mine on Friday. Friday is track day for our revo's though so will have to squeeze some time in asap with it =).

Any upgrades you would do at the start on the Tc4 RTR? The package we are buying is the RTR, 2 midgrade Batterys, and foam tires since we both already have chargers.

Anyone make a foam tire with a chrome rim

Thanks for the help!
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Old 10-25-2005, 05:56 PM   #7
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If the TC4 still has the plastic diff outdrives the same as the TC3, i would change these to the steel ones - they dont break! This was a weak spot on the TC3. Think the TC4 is a good starter car. Its hard for me to admit that as i have always been an avid Losi user and i never got on well with the TC3, i couldnt get it balanced for my driving style but i dont know if im just biased! Having said all that, my XXX-S G+ is still more than competative against the multitudes of TC3/4 and Xrays run at my local club.
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Old 10-25-2005, 07:28 PM   #8
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Default I agree the XXX-S...

is right up there with the rest. I saw a XXX-s at Stormmer for $189.00 for the G+ That's much cheaper than a TC4 and getting all the grahpite parts.
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Old 10-25-2005, 10:01 PM   #9
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just my 2 cents-- the xxx-s is fast and smooth. I had the rtr version, bone stock, and won some races with it. So easy to drive, unlike the xray i got next (building my mi2 now,hoping for a return to predictable). If you can score the graphite model for a price close to the standard tc4 your getting alot more in "pro" car features--so what if its old it is a fast car....
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Old 10-26-2005, 01:09 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashenor
Friend bought a Tc4 setup today at our LHS. The owner was there and gave us a good deal since he has bought a ton and brought in a lot of business which was cool of him. I am going to pickup mine on Friday. Friday is track day for our revo's though so will have to squeeze some time in asap with it =).

Any upgrades you would do at the start on the Tc4 RTR? The package we are buying is the RTR, 2 midgrade Batterys, and foam tires since we both already have chargers.

Anyone make a foam tire with a chrome rim

Thanks for the help!
I started with the TC4 RTR myself. On asphalt, I never got it to turn in well and eventually moved to a Losi JRXS which seems to suit my limited driving skills better. I've never driven on carpet, so I can't comment on the TC4 in that environment.

One problem with the TC4, but likely with all RTR packages is the electronics are fairly low quality and you will likely want to replace them fairly soon, thus reducing the value of the RTR package.

On the TC4 in particular, the speed controller does not have a reverse lock-out. If your track is low key, this is fine, but some will not let you race if you have reverse activated, in which case you must immediately throw out the stock speed control. Even if you don't have a problem with local track rules, I found the stock speed control overheated and went into thermal shutdown with even modest use of brakes during 5 to 10 minute practice runs. Thus, you may need a better speed control quite soon. A reasonably robust speed control costs $70+.

The servo on the TC4 RTR is a bottom of the line, very slow Airtronics. It works, but is not very responsive. I noticed a real improvement when I replaced it with a very fast servo. Fast servos are expensive, in the $80+ range, really fast servos are $!00+.

Finally, the RTR motor on the TC4 RTR claims to be a 15 turn, but runs no better than a Monster Stock Pro 27 turn, and may not even run as well. It is also a fairly flimsy motor. Mine broke after a moderate crash. Other folks told me of similar experiences. A good stock motor should cost $30-$35.

You also mentioned that you want to go Spektrum (an excellent system from my experience). This means you will be tossing the RTR radio and receiver.

Based on the above, you might want to consider going with the kit car. It will likely save you money even in the near term.

On the other hand, with the TC4 RTR, you do get tires and a shell that you can use. But bear in mind that some of the parts on the RTR are not as good as the equivalents on the kit car. In particular, the RTR shocks are not threaded, so setting ride height is not really possible on the RTR unless you upgrade. Another difference is plastic dog bones on the RTR versus aluminium on the kit car. This is not a problem unless you have a really bad crash. Otherwise, the plastic dog bones are reliable.

Good luck,
Ira
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Old 10-26-2005, 07:37 AM   #11
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Thanks for the advice guys.

If i did decide to build my own what is the hardest part? I have rebuilt my revo a couple of times now and are familar with rebuilding shocks and some limited stuff. But i have no knowledge of electric at all.

One thing that did bug me is that our local track guy said we could not run the Tc4 in the stock rookie class, we would have to replace the motor.

Is the Team Factory a good kit, or is that a little much for a beginner? I plan on getting a spektrum so i would still need a motor, speed controller, wheels, battery and a shell right?

Can anyone make a list if i were to build it on what they would recommend getting, remember i am a rookie and would like to run in the rookie class for a bit.

Thanks again!
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Old 10-26-2005, 07:56 AM   #12
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There is nothing wrong with the TC4 and it can be upgraded to the FTC4 when your ready. For the money, you're better to go with the kit because of the upgrades already in the box. The hardest part of most kits is the shocks and diffs. Neither are hard to build but can be frustrating to set correctly for a beginner. Another option on electronics is to buy used stuff. I'm sure that you've got a local fast guy who just had to have the newest speedo and is selling his GT7 or Quantum cheap. Look around. The deals are there. Same with batteries. With everyone jumping to 3700 and 3800s, there are alot of good 3300s for sale new and used. For $15-$30 a pack you'll get some good sticks. Besides, you'll lose more time hitting walls then you will because you're not running $100 batts. The XXX-s was a good car but if you look at the pros that were running them, they modified a lot of the car to get it to run well. As with any post here, this is just my 2 cents.
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Old 10-26-2005, 09:50 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashenor
Thanks for the advice guys.

If i did decide to build my own what is the hardest part? I have rebuilt my revo a couple of times now and are familar with rebuilding shocks and some limited stuff. But i have no knowledge of electric at all.

One thing that did bug me is that our local track guy said we could not run the Tc4 in the stock rookie class, we would have to replace the motor.

Is the Team Factory a good kit, or is that a little much for a beginner? I plan on getting a spektrum so i would still need a motor, speed controller, wheels, battery and a shell right?

Can anyone make a list if i were to build it on what they would recommend getting, remember i am a rookie and would like to run in the rookie class for a bit.

Thanks again!
The Team TC4 is probably the easiest kit to build. I had the RTR and disassembled it completely, then rebuilt it to learn how it all worked. Then I got ambitious and built a Losi JRXS. Carbon fiber chassis cars are more work to build because you have to file and grind the CF in lots of little places. The tub chassis on the TC4 is very simple and with shaft drive there are no wrries about belt tension, etc. The diffs are also quite easy to build, but do take a little practice to set just right. Thus, I think the Team (not Factory) TC4 is probably the easiest to build of all the newer models.

As for electronics, used is a good way to go if you can find the parts. Airtronics, Futaba, JR and KO make good servos. Check the width as the Team TC4 has a fairly narrow space for the servo. Look for a servo with a speed at 6 volts of .1 seconds or less. Also look for a model with metal gears.

Tekin, LRP and Novak make good speed controls (although LRP and Novak also make cheap, not so good models). Look for one with a low minimum motor turn limit and no reverse or reverse lock-out.

Around here, the Monster Stock Pro motor is the most popular stock can. Don't buy this used as it only costs $30-$35.

You will definitely feel that the car is really yours if you build it and choose the components. Just take your time building and if you have problems or questions, post them here or call the company. I've called AE and Losi and they are both very helpful.

Good luck,
Ira
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