niznai

Maybe.
I am not interested in F1 so I wouldn't know, but I'll give you that one on blind faith.

You do however have to admit that's not enough for a company like Tamiya to stay afloat in top level competition RC, which was my point.

Raman

iTrader: (94)

Markus

iTrader: (93)

Tamiya's major money maker is with their static models. RC is a smaller generator of their income.

I have read it somewhere that the intent of the whole TRF division was to race at the highest level and create an elite branding of name for Tamiya. They have accomplished that and no longer feel they need to prove themselves at that level. They want to be able to stand on their name and have buyers 'remember' they are good. Classic retail brainwashing 101!

It worked well since we all need the light blue bling bling on our rides. lol

nubs

iTrader: (2)

It worked well indeed. But they need to support my addiction if they want to keep me as a customer

niznai

No customer, no matter how addicted can buy things one won't sell.

Re-releasing kits is a very good idea that makes easy money.

Developing new hi performance cars is not going to produce profits, or not directly, not immediately or much smaller profits after R&D is factored in. I think that's why Tamiya has abandoned the TRF line (with the few exceptions pointed out above by some).

But then this pricing policy, how is that going to help?

If any one has bought their TRF kit at the new prices (or has any intention to do it) I would like to see a copy of the receipt.

My money sez they won't sell one kit no matter how much prestige or whatever other delusions of grandeur they might foster and customers might harbour.

I guess we'll see now who is a real die hard Tamiya fanboy.

What I really think is they are trying to create a feeling that you're getting a great deal if you're buying something below RRP if the RRP is so high (never mind the RRP is just some random number pulled out of thin air) and that'll get them more than 4-500$ for their kits, which is what they're getting now. We'll see if it works.

And they'll also have stuff they will only sell in Japan, something Japanese companies have done for ages. This one I am not sure I understand, but I suspect it may have something to do with the way they perceive other markets or something simpler, like some sort of misinterpretation of patriotism.

F N CUDA

iTrader: (34)

Thats what I was thinkin
Where is any manufacturers ALL NEW chassis?
All of them just refine bits and pieces and call them blah blah '16 '17 '18...
Cool if F1 is not your thing but Tamiya's F1 is full redesign.
XRAY? Nope. same X1 '15 '16 '17 and now '18 with some tweeks for sure but just sayin 4 years of tweekin, all good. I run it as well as Tamiya's.
Hell, Tamiya even called theirs X1 first
Not a thing wrong with the new XR, pretty fresh and definitely competitive any level.
As far as USA pricing change, WTF IS UP WITH THAT?

niznai

How about Serpent or Mugen?
Or Capricorn?

Xray. Well, they "optimise".

Jokes aside, Tamiya has been very slow to adopt innovations that had proved themselves useful and performant.
Sure, the 419XR may look modern, but that is only because it has finally caught up with things others had locked in their designs years before. That doesn't make it modern, it makes it five years too late.
Xray can be made fun of, but they do listen to the customer more than any other company I can think of. Which sells their kits. People literally ask for things and they get them in the next Xray. Not so with Tamiya. Tamiya seems to want us to buy what they want to sell us. Back to marketing 101. One would be excused for thinking Tamiya wants tell the customer they know better. Fine, but you need to have the competitive results to back this up. I'll leave it up to you to decide if that stacks up. Or maybe it does in Japan and they don't care about the rest.

nubs

iTrader: (2)

Well, I would challenge you to find any modern chassis out there like the TA07 and the TB EVO 7. Both of those chassis are new and different. The TRF103 is basically the "it" F1 chassis right now. The TRF419XR has stabilizers that you don't see on the TC7.1 or even the TC7.2. It was also the first chassis I am aware of to have multiple types of center stiffeners. I don't know that it's fair to characterize them as behind the times. But it is absolutely fair to say they don't take feedback or listen to their customers very well. It's also fair to say that Tamiya's fit and finish is probably close to last in its class. Infinity, Xray, Serpent (4x), and AE all require virtually no shimming to get things to fit right and have very little play. My 419XR and TA07 all have a lot of play that has to be shimmed out. My 419XR has some play that cannot be shimmed out because the play comes from having Chubs with larger inner diameters (holes for the pins) than the outer diameter of the pins themselves. I also notice the front axles on the outside of the knuckles have an inordinate amount of play that prevent accurate setting of toe out and straight steering. I don't know if this is a problem with their molds or with the plastics they use, but it's definitely one of the things that I have had to learn to live with.

Airwave

iTrader: (1)

Like what?

patorz31

I think you mean Awesomatix. If you ask for it and it improves performance; Oleg will make it in a couple of weeks.
That's customer service.

nubs

iTrader: (2)

That's great. But I have heard that Awesomatix has inventory issues as well. if I end up changing to a new brand in the future... I would definitely end up with a brand that has really good part support.

Raman

iTrader: (94)

Raman

iTrader: (94)

niznai

And why not?

You think on your death bed you are going to regret not spending more weekends at work to make one extra penny for your rich boss? Well, go in more on week ends, then.

You can joke as much as you want, but I get my Capricorn parts directly from them. One email away, seven days to my door on the other side of the world. You obviously don't drive any of their cars.

Mugen could have come on the market with any car they wanted. They could have come with one of those cars that end up in the "clone" threads around here where people argue that it's a Xray copy or a Tamiya copy or whatever. They chose to come with a brilliantly engineered one and very original in almost every aspect. You can't sneeze at that. At the very least it shows guts.

As for options people have asked for from Xray, have a look in the relevant threads.

TC7 ? What's that?

TB, TA chassies are not race spec, which is what we're talking about here.

And by the way, single belt cars better than TA07 have been made in the distant past by Kawada (among others), you just didn't see them in the US. I still have two of those cars and they're actually better than current Tamiya offerings in that department.

Oh, and by the way, the Sigma and Sigma 2 both have variable motor positioning just so you remember someone told you when you go buy your future "innovative" Tamiya.

And I forgot Schumacher for innovation. Nearly every one of their last four cars came out with something new and unique to the marque.

And how about the now defunct Corally? A company killed by too much innovation, I'll give you that.

But that's the point. Tamiya knows that innovation is tough and it doesn't always make money, so they shelved it. I would hazard a guess their own TRF line lost them money.

A lesson learned by Awesomatix as well. Which I am aware of, I just didn't mention it because Awesomatix is not a major company.

Who remembers the first prototype with flexible shaft drive? Nowadays their cars look a lot more conventional, because innovation like that all done with prime quality materials, all CNC in small numbers, it's very expensive. How many cars do they sell a year? A few.

Gizmo? Likewise.

Do they make any money off them? Not that much, I would guess. Yet the cars are at the top of the price bracket. Maybe they did apply the strategy someone mentioned earlier. Get a good name, then charge top dollar.

But I don't think so.

I think they abandoned extreme innovation because it just does not make money and without that you cannot survive.

Look at car manufacturers. Toyota or Chrysler or Ford don't innovate much but have a very healthy bank balance. Panhard (ever heard of them?) holds more patents than the rest of the car industry put together but they went bankrupt a long time ago.

Even Capricorn has some brilliant features unique to their cars. Too bad they end up way too expensive over here. But the new Tamiya pricing will make them look like a bargain. And make no mistake about it, the TE03 is far superior to the 419 in any guise (keep in mind the TE03 is not a new car either).

So, if Tamiya doesn't even come close to that kind of innovation what are they going to charge a premium for?

Anyhoo.

Maybe one day they'll rebuild their TRF arm from ground up and do a better job next time. I personally regret their disappearance not because I think their cars were amazing, but because more competition in the market place gives me better prices and more options.

Right now, the TRF adventure seems to be over, and seems to have been just an exercise like building the Ford GT40 to win Le Mans and pull one over Ferrari (who loved his lunch breaks, by the way). Yeah, sure, you can do it with enough money, but what's the point? Bragging rights? Some silverware in the glass cabinet? Maybe.

We'll see you on the other side of this.

rtypec

iTrader: (2)