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Old 08-28-2005, 10:38 AM   #1
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Inboard toe vs. Outboard toe

Ok, other than making the changing the width at the rear of the car what are the advantages and disadvantages of each. Please give situational advise also. EX. outboard works better with foam on carpet. <----I don't know.
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Old 08-28-2005, 04:50 PM   #2
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i believe toe-in in the rear will make the car more stable at high speeds and toe out will give the car more steering
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Old 08-28-2005, 04:57 PM   #3
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I think you misunderstand him Nick, he means adjusting toe by changing the rear uprights (outboard) or the suspension block width (inboard).

Sorry, but I don't know the advantages or disadvantages, but I only ever change inboard toe.

Last edited by Ballsie; 08-28-2005 at 05:19 PM.
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Old 08-28-2005, 05:18 PM   #4
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Outboard toe changes only the angle of the wheels in accordance to the ground whereas inboard toe also changes the angle of the suspension arms which would theoretically change the squating characteristics of the car mainly on takeoff/acceleration. I couldn't tell you the exact effect it would have but i have always changed inboard toe due more to car design than anything else.
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Old 08-28-2005, 05:32 PM   #5
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Pyrosian- I could be wrong, but I believe your theory on squat characteristics only comes into play when the rear hingepins are not parallel to the chassis.

I believe the thing that comes into play prodominately for us pertaining to outboard vs inboard toe is the weight balance and the wheelbase effects.
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Old 08-28-2005, 05:36 PM   #6
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Inboard Pin Angle: Placing all of the toe-in inboard will cause the weight to transfer to the front end easily, increasing off-power steering and decreasing on-power steering (more forward traction). Placing all of the toe-in in the hubs will stabilize the weight transfer, providing less initial steering entering a turn, and less forward traction.

Taken from Team Losi
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Old 08-28-2005, 05:39 PM   #7
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BigDog: But wouldn't any change to inboard toe change the angle of the hingepins in relation to the chassis?? The only time the hingepins would be parallel to the chassis would be at 0* toe. Unless of you mean parallel to the chassis as in no anti-squat.

I do remember reading an article once in a magazine (XRC i think) about sweeping the suspension arms foward or back in offroad racing as a tuning option. If anybody knows which article i'm thinking of please post a summary.
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Old 08-28-2005, 05:41 PM   #8
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Seems like the question was answered while i was typing, oh well.
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Old 08-28-2005, 05:45 PM   #9
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You're talking about the hingepins being parallel to the centerline of the chassis. I'm talking about the pins being parallel to the chassis on the horizontal plane.


A shorter wheelbase will make a car turn tighter and feel more twitchy assuming all things otherwise are the same. So on a long sweeping track you would theoretically want a long wheelbase car to make it easier to drive.
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Old 08-29-2005, 08:52 AM   #10
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Using out-board rear toe-in will also change the camber gain characteristics. Here is a link to a write-up on the changes I found:

http://www.teamxray.com/xforum/viewtopic.php?t=1491
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Old 08-29-2005, 09:11 AM   #11
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Do yourself a favor...Buy the XXXmain Touring car tuning guide...it has all the information that someone could need to better tuen there car...Has all the basics and many more compliucated things well defined..
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Originally Posted by mtc3od
Ok, other than making the changing the width at the rear of the car what are the advantages and disadvantages of each. Please give situational advise also. EX. outboard works better with foam on carpet. <----I don't know.
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Old 08-29-2005, 09:34 AM   #12
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mtc3od,

The XXX Main book is a great book that all drivers should have (I use mine often to refresh my memory and cross reference tuning options). I would also suggest first using the standard tuning options that it provides information on.

But if you are already familiar with these, and your just curious to find out more about the difference between in-board and out-board toe for fine tuning, then it won't help as it does not contain definitions for these. Let us know if you have more questions and we'll be happy to help.
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Old 08-29-2005, 10:25 AM   #13
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the inboard and outboard is about all that I really had a question about. I have a pretty decent understanding about everything else.
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Old 08-29-2005, 03:02 PM   #14
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I agree with you guys about the XXX-main being a good resource, but once you start getting more into suspension geometry sometimes you need more than just "gives more steering in, less steering out". That stuff is fairly easily memorized and sometimes it's more complicated than just a pat answer.

You know, it's like: how is this actually *working* on the car and what interactions will this adjustment have with the rest of my setup? That's the kind of information that you need to dig around for and usually just try out for yourself.

Just as a little plug, I run the Tamale 1.5* outboard hubs on my BMI XRAY and they work extremely well. The aluminum is top drawer as well as the craftsmanship. As far as performance, after switching some months ago during the outdoor season, I found the car to be more stable, yet freer throughout all points of the corner.
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Old 08-29-2005, 03:07 PM   #15
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inboard toe will change pivot angles, wheelbase, ect. and magnifies whatever degree blocks you decide too run outboard toe will only change it at the wheels. 2 degrees of inboard toe will give you more rear bite on entry middle and exit than 2 degrees of outboard, because of the increase rear arm angle
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