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Old 08-30-2005, 11:53 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hpipro321
i would go for the much more its a better more proven charger
Can you clarify what you mean with "proven" and "better"?

I mean each and every marketing nut can use these terms, while still selling you a P.O.S.

Thanks
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Old 08-30-2005, 02:10 PM   #32
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Check Ebay on ICE, I've seen them on there with temp probes for $119 shipped. I too have not seen any REAL reason to spend the extra on the MUCHMORE, especially without the motor run feature. That's just too important for running a lathe, breaking in motors, etc.

Remember, alot of opinion is based on hype and who won the last race using this, that, or the next thing. Buy what makes sense to you and what you need and you'll save money in the long run.

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Old 08-30-2005, 02:22 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Greg Amendola
Remember, alot of opinion is based on hype and who won the last race using this, that, or the next thing. Buy what makes sense to you and what you need and you'll save money in the long run.

L8R
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Old 08-30-2005, 02:59 PM   #34
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[QUOTE=Mr. Shookie]Reasons why I have two Much More CTX's


1) I race two classes and need two chargers
You'll need 2 chargers CTX or not if you are running 2 classes

2) They are small and are light and fit real nice in my pit box
So is the ICE
3) They charge better and with the step charging they do not false peak
where as other top end chargers even in step charge mode will still false peak
My ICE has yet to false peak...although it can happen to any charger
4) They can warm packs in the winter
Umm..this is good because....
5) They can warm tires with MM tire warmers
Again...can't you do this on any charger with a motor-breakin feature which the ICE does (not necessarily MM warmers)
6) Easy to read
So is the ICE
7) Easy to use
So is the ICE
8) Back lite
No back light on the ICE but just like the other dude said, I don't race in the dark. If I can't read my charger, then I won't be able to work on my car anyways if it is that dark
9) Cause everyone who has ever bought one has loved it from day one....
The same can be true with any charger, love them now, sell them tomorrow
10) Cause I feel like my packs get a better charge...
Like you said, it is your feeling

Not bashing you Shooks, you did list all the things you like about the CTX, which are very good, just giving the user who asked, the other side of the coin.
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Old 08-30-2005, 04:50 PM   #35
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Its all good...
I was just giving my side...Glad someone familuar with the ICE came and made the same list....
I am not familuar with the ICE....
Glad to here it is as good....
Well.....At least for as far as our opinions go...LOL
-Shookie <><

[QUOTE=forty6]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Shookie
Reasons why I have two Much More CTX's


1) I race two classes and need two chargers
You'll need 2 chargers CTX or not if you are running 2 classes

2) They are small and are light and fit real nice in my pit box
So is the ICE
3) They charge better and with the step charging they do not false peak
where as other top end chargers even in step charge mode will still false peak
My ICE has yet to false peak...although it can happen to any charger
4) They can warm packs in the winter
Umm..this is good because....
5) They can warm tires with MM tire warmers
Again...can't you do this on any charger with a motor-breakin feature which the ICE does (not necessarily MM warmers)
6) Easy to read
So is the ICE
7) Easy to use
So is the ICE
8) Back lite
No back light on the ICE but just like the other dude said, I don't race in the dark. If I can't read my charger, then I won't be able to work on my car anyways if it is that dark
9) Cause everyone who has ever bought one has loved it from day one....
The same can be true with any charger, love them now, sell them tomorrow
10) Cause I feel like my packs get a better charge...
Like you said, it is your feeling

Not bashing you Shooks, you did list all the things you like about the CTX, which are very good, just giving the user who asked, the other side of the coin.
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Old 08-30-2005, 05:22 PM   #36
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Can you adjust the charge rate during a charge with the Ice??
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Old 08-30-2005, 05:28 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tres
Not to get off the topic, but as an option check out the Orion Advantage, they come from the same factory as the CTX just out another door from what I understand.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong....
The Cell Master and Orion Advantage chargers are made by completely different manufacturers. This, I am 100% sure of.

I was not going to post in this thread because we are dealers of the Cell Master and I did not want to make it seem as if I were advertising. No one, however has answered the question of why the Cell Master is a better charger.

The main difference between the MuchMore CM and a charger like the ICE is the super linear current offered by the Cell Master. What this means is that the CM has a pure and constant linear current. A charger such as the ICE will have a linear current something like 55-57 out of every 60 seconds.

Well, why doesn't every charger offer this?
Quite simply, a super linear current would usually result in a much hotter pack at the end of charge. The peak sensitivities offered by a charger such as the ICE are not fine enough to stop the charge at the right time...and a NIMH battery would probably explode or at least, get very hot. Comparatively, the ICE's charging style will result in a cooler battery; the battery will still however build heat as the voltage drops off and the battery peaks.
The MuchMore Cell Master has a more sophisticated delta peak detection program. First, it reads voltage to a thousandth of a volt (ex. 9.115 instead of 9.12). Then, it utilizes much finer delta peak settings to peak the battery.

For example, many racers would normally set their delta peak setting to .030v (30mV for the entire pack) on an ICE, Turbo 35, Integy, LRP, etc charger; with the MuchMore CM, however, you set a delta peak value such as .006 (6mV for the entire pack)...considerably lower/more sensitive than .030v.

You can also see the effects of the super linear current as your battery peaks. With a Turbo 35 for instance, it is common to see a battery fluctuate in voltage as it peaks (with a .03v delta peak setting):

9.14-9.13-9.14-9.13-9.14-9.13-9.12-9.13-9.12-9.13-9.12-9.11-peak cut

With a MMR Cell Master, the voltage does not fluctuate as it peaks, even when it is displayed to the thousandth of a volt. This is how you will see the voltage drop (with a .006v delta peak setting):

9.144-9.143-9.142-9.141-9.140-9.139-9.138-peak cut

Essentially, the CM will deal with the extra heat generated by the super linear current by utilizing these fine peak detection settings. Consequently, you get a battery with a lot of punch without having to overcharge it.

OK, so what difference does it make?

Quite simply, a super linear current will generate more power.

When you combine the CM's super linear current with step charging, you get CTX charging. No other charger offers CTX charging. When you step charge with the Cell Master, you gain more run-time and keep your peak power further into the race without sacrificing much power.

Many racers complain about their batteries feeling "flat" when step charging with other chargers...this is because other chargers do not offer the super linear current to account for the loss in power naturally generated by step charging.

So, with the Cell Master, you can program the charger to get the best of both worlds, or, for that matter, anywhere above, in the middle, or in between (or even below, if this is your wish ).

Does all this make a huge difference to the average racer? probably not. Does it make a difference? probably.
Someone made the comment that all the "big guns" at his track had switched to it. In all honesty, it is the "big guns" who are the ones that care about the little things.

In the middle of this year's Reedy Race, Masami Hirosaka switched from his prototype, super-mega, laptop controlled Yokomo charger to the Cell Master. He had no obligations to MuchMore, as he was not racing for them. After one charge with the CM, the prototype got packed away. He most definitly did not switch because the CM had cool functions.
In reality, a lot of us are just like him; we just go for what we think is faster. A rational racer could probably not be able to justify spending an extra $50, $100, or $200 on a charger...I just don't know that many rational racers that race at big events .

I know that there are a few who may disagree with me...I am just simply here to offer an answer to the "what is the difference" question, and I tried my best to give this answer in good faith.
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Old 08-30-2005, 05:59 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wannabee
Can you adjust the charge rate during a charge with the Ice??
yes.


to the original poster; save yourself 80 bucks now and get the ice. if you're looking for an uber-charger, hold off until the single cell chargers are released somewhere in the (hopefully) near future. regardless of all the hoopla listed above (no discredit, nexus was EXTREMELY knowledgeable and helpful to this thread), single cell chargers are the 'next thing' in charging. we're going to see the focus that has been put on equalized discharging put into equalized charging.
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Old 08-30-2005, 06:25 PM   #39
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ice ice baby
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Old 08-30-2005, 06:35 PM   #40
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WOW nexus you gave a BUNCH of good reasons why the cell master is better!
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Old 08-30-2005, 06:39 PM   #41
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I have an ICE but if i had the money i would get the Much More charger WAY BETTER QUALITY. Its a very impressive charger, but the ice does get the job done.
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Old 08-30-2005, 07:02 PM   #42
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WOW, Kumpol, nice write up, looks like I need to get a Cell Master
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Old 08-30-2005, 07:16 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimPotter
WOW, Kumpol, nice write up, looks like I need to get a Cell Master
Not Kumpol...guess again .
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Old 08-30-2005, 07:37 PM   #44
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Nexus, VERY well put.
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Old 08-30-2005, 07:53 PM   #45
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OK Arun..... I thought you had another login name



Quote:
Originally Posted by Nexus Racing
Not Kumpol...guess again .
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