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Old 08-19-2005, 12:28 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Turtlemaster
heck i just learned a couple of weeks ago about shorting the arm to make it think its a lower wind then it is.
I want to hear this one...PM me dude! I'm probably not gonna do it to anything of my motors but I'm still curious about how to do it
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Old 08-19-2005, 12:30 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by dmayhew25
If you were talking to only adrian then PM him, don't run your mouth about a company ( A well respected one ) that MIGHT have been cheating. I never claimed you were cheating but you took it that way, WHY????? .

Was I at the RROC Race? Nope, Only ever been to a handful of races. Club races at that. Again, did I say you were a middle of the pack racer? No, I said they are more likely to cheat than the guys making A mains at big races. I have no idea who you are but some things you say make you sound like a crybaby.

Do you think if you had their motors you would have beaten the guys in front of you at that race?? Just curious.
sorry bro the only guy crying is you ...EA did not get dissed on this thread its all cool MR.Butter came thru to set things right, if you werent there dont go there...i ran the brushes that came on the motor yes the ones w/ the eyelet..766 i would have finished in the same spot with peters motor ..if your dissing me for telling it like it is so be it , it like being straight with every body even haters.....

Last edited by lickrim; 08-19-2005 at 10:10 AM.
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Old 08-19-2005, 05:56 AM   #18
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What Butter said is correct. EA Drivers didnt use the advance timing on the motors. It was tried before the race and found to make the motors overheat and not run well the end of the run.

No Furman Walker didnt dump in one of his races...the battery false peaked and didnt get fully charged. He knew when he went up on the stand it wasnt going to finish.

And lastly for people that did that/wanted to do that/have done that its only Illegal if they are teching for it and have the tools to tech for it. I for one will not do it...ask butter...he knows!!

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Old 08-19-2005, 06:36 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by EAMotorsports
its only Illegal if they are teching for it and have the tools to tech for it.
So if I understand you right, your attitude is "it's only cheating if they have the tools to scrutineer it"?

Shouldn't the attitude be "it's only cheating if it is against the rulebook"?
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Old 08-19-2005, 07:18 AM   #20
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How do you make a BITTER BUTTER BETTER ???????
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'OL BUZZARD FARMING (lol)
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Old 08-19-2005, 07:56 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sosidge
So if I understand you right, your attitude is "it's only cheating if they have the tools to scrutineer it"?

Shouldn't the attitude be "it's only cheating if it is against the rulebook"?
You can try to spin it off anyway you want I dont care. My point was that how can you make something illegal if there is no way to tech it? Same thing with re balancing stock arms. How do you tell the factory holes from new ones? I played around with it at home enough to figure a way out to tech it with a meter and its 100% effective when testing like this. The reason being is I dont think that it should be something that is done at races or sold in the shops PERIOD. If you want more timing run MOD.

Bottom line is we didnt run it at the RROC and will NEVER run it in a race...I wont be doing this. But there is a company that does it to every motor they sell so beware.

Thats the last post I will make on this subject. Everyone is always out to try and make someone else look bad. I guess if I wanted to be like everyone else I could talk about the handwound arms that were run in spec at the RROC by certain people!!!

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Last edited by EAMotorsports; 08-19-2005 at 08:25 AM.
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Old 08-19-2005, 09:08 AM   #22
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Where in the rule book is this anyways? I just looked....could not seemed to find it.....its never been illegal till now, so must be an amendment....please post the section of the rules....

In the end though, it works like crap. It will cause the motors to overheat and fade badly around 3-4 minutes. Promatch used to use this stupid trick. It makes the motors look good on the dyno.....thats about it. Might work ok in 4 cell....

And besides....Team br00d won 1st and 2nd at the Reedy Race.....Peter Robinson was doing all the motor tuning. He had my portable zapper, which is NOT possible to zap the magnets ahead, as it locks the can into place with the screw holes.

No team br00d production or race motor has EVER had the magnets zapped ahead......I've never even shown Peter how to do it.....


Later EddieO
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Old 08-19-2005, 09:34 AM   #23
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Here is how I feel about Stock Racing. If you can figure out something that's not covered or teched under current rules, it's fair game. Think about NASCAR for a moment -- YES, it's STOCK CAR racing. Most teams run pretty equal equipment, motors, etc. HOWEVER, if a race program (team) figures out a new trick to get the tiniest amount of extra torque, or less drag, or whatever -- it's completely to their advantage! That's why they all spend so much money on their race programs -- to TRY FIGURE OUT NEW STUFF to edge out others.

It's stock racing -- and you try do whatever you can under CURRENT RULES to go faster. If there isn't a rule for it yet, FREE GAME. If the organization feels like your "trick" is unfair, they have the option to ban it by adding a rule. Happens in NASCAR every year. Rules change as technology develops.

ROAR will probably never need to make a rule about running advanced magnetic timing, since it's DUMB and doesn't work anyways... If Eric or Eddie weren't at least TESTING those things, I would question their abilities as a tuner. I mean, they should always be in the pursuit of finding every ounce of torque they can get a motor to put out. They've got to be on the bleeding edge. The fact that neither of them USE it also speaks mounds about their abilities -- smart enough to know it's dumb and doesn't work.
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Old 08-19-2005, 10:06 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EAMotorsports
You can try to spin it off anyway you want I dont care. My point was that how can you make something illegal if there is no way to tech it? Same thing with re balancing stock arms. How do you tell the factory holes from new ones? I played around with it at home enough to figure a way out to tech it with a meter and its 100% effective when testing like this. The reason being is I dont think that it should be something that is done at races or sold in the shops PERIOD. If you want more timing run MOD.

Bottom line is we didnt run it at the RROC and will NEVER run it in a race...I wont be doing this. But there is a company that does it to every motor they sell so beware.

Thats the last post I will make on this subject. Everyone is always out to try and make someone else look bad. I guess if I wanted to be like everyone else I could talk about the handwound arms that were run in spec at the RROC by certain people!!!

EA
EA its all good , i get my stories mixed up too. At the RROC i did believe that some people were running hand wound stuff but didnt care you could totally tell by some of the top end of some racers..i would never single out EA thats just the way it came out during the race , Eric i got your back on this one you da man keep on ripping horsepower for the none believers...When Furman dumped in that round thats when the chatter started from most of the east coast racers i was totally wrong for saying anything ..Eric, Furman, Butter keep bangin ...bitter
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Old 08-19-2005, 10:16 AM   #25
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The ROAR motor rules are focused on limiting the motors timing to 24 deg in Stock and 19T On Road. Magnetic advancement of the timing is clearly against the spirit of the rules.

ROAR has been made aware of this issue and it will be addressed before the Nationals. As I said before I suggest you plan on not running advanced motors at the Nats.
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Old 08-19-2005, 10:16 AM   #26
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Hey Eddie it just states in the rules that it must be 24 degrees Maximum timing and that the center of the magnets must be centered in the can. So its a gray area that "should" be corrected in the new rule book...Hopefully.

The "other motor company" that I was referring to is NOT Br00d. Its a small company that not many people know. So please dont think I meant it toward Br00d. They do only the best and are straight forward in their tuning.

Bitter its all good. I no problems here. I know your motor was straight and you drove the wheels off your unit all weekend. Even with that carpet chassis LOL See ya in vegas?? Thanks for the Props!!

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Old 08-19-2005, 10:24 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EddieO
Where in the rule book is this anyways? I just looked....could not seemed to find it.....its never been illegal till now, so must be an amendment....please post the section of the rules....

In the end though, it works like crap. It will cause the motors to overheat and fade badly around 3-4 minutes. Promatch used to use this stupid trick. It makes the motors look good on the dyno.....thats about it. Might work ok in 4 cell....

And besides....Team br00d won 1st and 2nd at the Reedy Race.....Peter Robinson was doing all the motor tuning. He had my portable zapper, which is NOT possible to zap the magnets ahead, as it locks the can into place with the screw holes.

No team br00d production or race motor has EVER had the magnets zapped ahead......I've never even shown Peter how to do it.....


Later EddieO
yo EddieO , If i remember i was in that main event but no love for bitter huh?
hey i knowhow it is , its the peter and jason show only or what dude..if you only quote these guys what about the past two years when i made the main for the last three, one of only three others to do it back to back..if you remember jasons car didnt move in all the mains so my mains sucked cause i would hit him every time...spread the wealth you had more than two guys in that main, thanks for everything ...BITTER
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Old 08-19-2005, 10:39 AM   #28
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OK OK....Charlie was in the main too! My brain is full....I am in New York City....too much to take in, in so little time.

AdrianM, I think ROAR needs to amend the rules then.....cause advancing the magnets might be agains the spirit of the rules, its certainly not actually against the rules. If it was, then they need to outlaw timed brushes...

I certainly don't see how a telsa meter could actually tech it accurately.....sure gonna suck when someone is DQed when they didn't do it,, but the meter says they supposedly did.

In the end, its pointless.....it doesn't work for a full 5 minutes,it simply cheats the dyno sheet, so I just say let the idiots who do it....do it, they won't win anyways.

I know MDI has or had the old promatch videos showing how to do it.....I just asked Big Jim, he showed me and then told me it sucked.....

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Old 08-19-2005, 10:42 AM   #29
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Adrian , you are correct , any magnet advance would be illegal @ the Nats, we plan on doing alot of teching throughout qualifying up until the end of the weekend . If you are not sure about something you would like to try , i would recommend asking first , you will be limited to 3 motor and if you " alter " those 3 and they are illegal , you will be done for the weekend .
Any motor found to be illegal will be confiscated and destroyed , they will not be replaced either . Any second violation for the same person will also end your weekend of racing .

Teching is designed to keep things fair and fun , we will do our best to keep things that way .
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Old 08-19-2005, 12:59 PM   #30
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there, i deleted it


heres a new subject, H

oh wait thats been done.

Last edited by Turtlemaster; 08-19-2005 at 01:46 PM.
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