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Old 04-26-2002, 03:29 PM   #541
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Right, & as for tuning a stock motor to make it perform better(without any cheating), it kind of depends. Not all stocks are created equal, because of the way they're manufactured(namely, the machine-wound armatures), it opens the door for some arms to be better than others & some that are gonna be a dog no matter what you do to the motor. But if you have a good one & it's come untuned(like a non-Pro P2K 2, P2K, or GM3, for example), then you CAN get it running better like JeffC mentioned. In particular, just skimming the commutator & putting some good high silver racing brushes in will make a noticable difference over the cheap brushes that come with those untuned motors(personally, I like to use a Reedy 767 brush on the + side & a Trinity 4499 brush on the - side of the motor, with Trintiy's polarized springs, namely their red+/green- pair, it's a good combo for lots of situations though you do have to skim the comm more often because of the high silver brushes).....
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Old 04-26-2002, 04:54 PM   #542
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hmm, I've never even thought about running brush combos like that... I've always done either 767's + and -, or 4499's + and -. Gonna have to give that one a try though.
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Old 04-26-2002, 05:36 PM   #543
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here's another for a p2k2:
positive - red spring w/ double-shunted e
negative - green spring w/ 767
*the 767 will wear faster, so you'll have to change that twice
as often, just check the wear pattern.

theory is:
more power through the positive side, less resistance on the
negative side = fast & efficient motor. you can actually gear
a little lower and maintain top end and pick up some bottom
end.
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Old 04-26-2002, 08:51 PM   #544
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diesel31:

How u know there is more power on the +ve side and less resistance on the -ve side??? i checked through the internet and they say stiffness of the spring will play a part also...like maybe stiffer spring on +ve side.....is this true.....

the tuning i refering is on Type T stock and kawada 23T stock motors....during race....find that some cars can really fly on the start and no matter how u go after them, they seems to be further and further from U. Beside battery, chassis, ESC, tyre choice, the only thing that can play is motor.....

Thanx everyone for the info.... Glad to know more abt RC through all these forums...
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Old 04-27-2002, 03:33 AM   #545
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I'll pass on some Big Jim ideas here...
Jeff C,
He recommends tuning the Core/Hellfire the same as an MVP. Cut the brushes and use #767+ and #766-
As far as springs go, I use a 135 deg Peak Viper on the + and 115 deg P.V on the -.
You'll need to play with gearing, if the TOP and MVP motors are as alike as he suggests, it may take a while to find a good ratio to run.
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Old 04-27-2002, 10:48 AM   #546
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Quote:
Originally posted by sosidge
The signs that it's time for a brush change are...

1. When the brushes seem glazed or blackened-up

2. When you notice a drop in performance

3. Excessive wear - you could even wear the brush down to where the brush shunt (wire) is.
When you change brushes, it's always a good idea to skim the comm as well.

But since you're only bashing, I wouldn't worry until you start to notice a performance drop, or the brushes become very short.
thanks for the tips
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Old 04-27-2002, 10:58 AM   #547
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JeffC-

I have the same situation as you. X-Ray with about the same size track as you. My Core and Hellfires are great.

Poistive. 135 Viper with 4499 with Cavity
Negative . 115 Viper with Peak 2221 with Cavity.

Brush hoods aligned, Shaft Sanded with 1500 Grit sandpaper and then Blue Magix Polish Cream. Bearings were also polished with the Blue magic Ploish Cream. It works very very well .

I was geared 41/128

Rollout 30.07

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Old 04-29-2002, 12:12 AM   #548
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Quote:
Originally posted by IceBerG71
diesel31:

How u know there is more power on the +ve side and less resistance on the -ve side??? i checked through the internet and they say stiffness of the spring will play a part also...like maybe stiffer spring on +ve side.....is this true.....





yes, spring tension will play a role. for the most part, i use a stiffer spring on the positive end and a softer spring on the negative end. sounds pretty vanilla, but works effectively.

you get more power through the positive end because of the double-shunts.

you lessen the resistance on the negative side with the softer brush.

the brush combo i suggest works off this principle. i'm sure there are other polarized combos that'll work better, i've just yet to find it. anyway, the double-shunted 4499 on the + and the reedy 767 on the - is a good reliable combo that works on the p2k2.

if you can find 'em try putnam brushes, they'll make your motors scream. only draw back is that they'll fade fast and you'll have to change them a little more often.
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Old 04-29-2002, 12:26 AM   #549
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Quote:
Originally posted by IceBerG71
diesel31:


the tuning i refering is on Type T stock and kawada 23T stock motors....during race....find that some cars can really fly on the start and no matter how u go after them, they seems to be further and further from U. Beside battery, chassis, ESC, tyre choice, the only thing that can play is motor.....

...
ya know iceberg, i wondered this myself. where i race, everyone is real close in terms of skill and equipment - we all have the latest in state-of-the-art mumbo jumbo, and we spend more than enough hours playin' w/ this stuff. i was going through a streak where i would start the race real strong, but would get caught up, and fade from contention. it couldn't have been the equipment because we're all dipping into the same pool. so i asked the race director, and he said everytime i broke away from the pack, i would relax - drive less aggresive, and they would begin to reel me in. once i got reeled in, i'd get a little anxious, make a mistake, and poof! i'd be playing catch up.

another thing to consider, the smoother driver will have more punch in the end. everytime you hit a dot, get hit, or impede in anyway your car from going forward, you're drawing away amps. believe it or not, a bump can send such a spike that the amp draw could be the difference you'll need in the end.
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Old 04-29-2002, 03:18 AM   #550
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Thanx diesel31 for the info...so informative.....i dun know there is still so much to play with it and the littles little things that come from the race...just still new, so got to more to experience with all these stuff....
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Old 05-01-2002, 11:01 AM   #551
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Do you guys recommend any type of comm drops?
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Old 05-01-2002, 11:33 AM   #552
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IceBerG71,
I believe for the series we are running, having a quality low resistance ESC and high voltage batteries are the key here.

I draw from a pool of nicads and nimh batteries, and the nimh cells (GP! Not sanyo, not panasonic!) didn't have the oomph to accelerate. So during the race I recycled my 2400s, very bad for the cells but not much choice.

Also for the smallish track @ teck ghee, it seems that the moment you make a mistake which strands your car till the marshalls arrive, it is possible for the car behind to lead you a lap: consistency is key here.
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Old 05-01-2002, 11:56 AM   #553
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreamer
Do you guys recommend any type of comm drops?
Not sure what everybody else is using but I use TRIBO it it seems to work really well. The key is to make sure that your brushes or comm have not been exposed to any other comm drops if they have, clean (ARM and CAN), cut (COMM) and change (Brushes) then apply a half or a full drop of TRIBO on the comm before the heat. BigJim recommends that you go up 1-2 teeth on the pinion to get the full effect of TRIBO. After the heat clean the motor out and re-apply as before. I use half a drop on the bushings as well.

Good luck
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Old 05-01-2002, 12:12 PM   #554
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Oh btw Iceberg, have you tried the tamiya cleaning brushes? Since we can't true the type-ts, I have been using the tamiya cleaning brushes to clean the comm. Seems to work well, gets it shiny again, but not as good as a real cut...
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Old 05-01-2002, 01:44 PM   #555
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Quote:
Originally posted by mike_Webb


Brush hoods aligned, Shaft Sanded with 1500 Grit sandpaper and then Blue Magix Polish Cream. Bearings were also polished with the Blue magic Ploish Cream. It works very very well .

Mike Webb
You polished the BEARINGS? Well of course it's fast then! Maybe I'll press in some bearings and polish them. lol...

Thanks for the brush ideas. I've got the 4499 2shunt brushes, gonna try them on + and 767 on - like Simon suggested. Also gonna try what you said Mike. My Hellfire is awsome in my XXXT with purple/red springs and 4499's.
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