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Old 01-27-2014, 10:18 AM   #1
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Default Best Body For Carpet Racing - LTC-R, SPEED6, P37

So yesterday I did an experiment between these 3 bodies, the LTC-R, Mazda Speed 6 and the P37 on carpet.

I have been running the LTC-R (light weight) for about 4 weeks and have been custom to running that body (XRAY 2014 T4). I've had several hot laps running that body but have found the LTC-R makes the car somewhat inconsistent in corner entry, however produces the best straight line speed.

Yesterday I decided to run the P37 (light weight) for my qualifying runs and was amazed from the results, same set up. I ran my fastest qualifier by 1 additional lap also TQ'D and kept running faster by taking TQ from myself the next two rounds of qualifying. This body shown great straight-line speed plus a very consistent, solid feel on the infield game.

The SPEED6 I tested "was not" a light weight version but I could tell the car was extremely planted in the infield, but seemed slower straight-line . The SPEED6 is clearly more of an aggressive/stable feel than the LTC-R and the P37 but just doesn't seem to have that straight-line speed. I could immediately tell, I could get more aggressive on the driving and could place the nose of the car were I wanted and how I wanted with the SPEED6.

From my experience yesterday. I'm going to do more testing with the P37 and the SPEED6 as I feel both bodies offers similar benefits, (good straight-line speed, stable & consistent in-field game and an overall solid feel. The P37 is a superior body over the LTC-R but haven't fully compared to the SPEED6 as I didn't have a "light weight" version. It was very clear the P37 woke up my driving as I had almost two flawless 6 minute qualifying runs with little mistakes, consistently turning lap times 1 - 2 tenths back of lap record for a solid 6 minutes.

The reason for this thread is to get other feedback on the P37 and also, why isn't more people running this body? My driving improved 100% and my car was faster and more consistent over the LTC-R. My opinion is, numbers don't lie and the P37 numbers sure didn't produce bad lap times "in fact improved mine". My testing of these three bodies was on the same day, same set-up and same tires.
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Old 01-27-2014, 10:27 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by NEED-MORE-SPEED View Post
So yesterday I did an experiment between these 3 bodies, the LTC-R, Mazda Speed 6 and the P37 on carpet.

I have been running the LTC-R (light weight) for about 4 weeks and have been custom to running that body (XRAY 2014 T4). I've had several hot laps running that body but have found the LTC-R makes the car somewhat inconsistent in corner entry, however produces the best straight line speed.

Yesterday I decided to run the P37 (light weight) for my qualifying runs and was amazed from the results, same set up. I ran my fastest qualifier by 1 additional lap also TQ'D and kept running faster by taking TQ from myself the next two rounds of qualifying. This body shown great straight-line speed plus a very consistent, solid feel on the infield game.

The SPEED6 I tested "was not" a light weight version but I could tell the car was extremely planted in the infield, but seemed slower straight-line . The SPEED6 is clearly more of an aggressive/stable feel than the LTC-R and the P37 but just doesn't seem to have that straight-line speed. I could immediately tell, I could get more aggressive on the driving and could place the nose of the car were I wanted and how I wanted with the SPEED6.

From my experience yesterday. I'm going to do more testing with the P37 and the SPEED6 as I feel both bodies offers similar benefits, (good straight-line speed, stable & consistent in-field game and an overall solid feel. The P37 is a superior body over the LTC-R but haven't fully compared to the SPEED6 as I didn't have a "light weight" version. It was very clear the P37 woke up my driving as I had almost two flawless 6 minute qualifying runs with little mistakes, consistently turning lap times 1 - 2 tenths back of lap record for a solid 6 minutes.

The reason for this thread is to get other feedback on the P37 and also, why isn't more people running this body? My driving improved 100% and my car was faster and more consistent over the LTC-R. My opinion is, numbers don't lie and the P37 numbers sure didn't produce bad lap times "in fact improved mine". My testing of these three bodies was on the same day, same set-up and same tires.
each body has a unique quality to it, theres a reason the pros run the mazda speed 6 so you might have to try mounting the body differently, and the wing differently, also it may require a different wing in comparison to the other bodies you may have to mount the wing farther back or closer, or cut out the holes in the wing, adjust the rear portion of the body after the wheel to make it rotate better a whole host of variables could make each body better than the other, its a good tuning option but you cant make a clear statement which body is better each has its own place to be best as for the fast laps good for you, the ltc is a very very aggressive body, and i hear its inconsistent
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Old 01-27-2014, 10:30 AM   #3
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can i ask what turn motor was used and what is the track size?,fast flowing or technical,cheers,good review btw
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Old 01-27-2014, 10:41 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by NEED-MORE-SPEED View Post
So yesterday I did an experiment between these 3 bodies, the LTC-R, Mazda Speed 6 and the P37 on carpet.

I have been running the LTC-R (light weight) for about 4 weeks and have been custom to running that body (XRAY 2014 T4). I've had several hot laps running that body but have found the LTC-R makes the car somewhat inconsistent in corner entry, however produces the best straight line speed.

Yesterday I decided to run the P37 (light weight) for my qualifying runs and was amazed from the results, same set up. I ran my fastest qualifier by 1 additional lap also TQ'D and kept running faster by taking TQ from myself the next two rounds of qualifying. This body shown great straight-line speed plus a very consistent, solid feel on the infield game.

The SPEED6 I tested "was not" a light weight version but I could tell the car was extremely planted in the infield, but seemed slower straight-line . The SPEED6 is clearly more of an aggressive/stable feel than the LTC-R and the P37 but just doesn't seem to have that straight-line speed. I could immediately tell, I could get more aggressive on the driving and could place the nose of the car were I wanted and how I wanted with the SPEED6.

From my experience yesterday. I'm going to do more testing with the P37 and the SPEED6 as I feel both bodies offers similar benefits, (good straight-line speed, stable & consistent in-field game and an overall solid feel. The P37 is a superior body over the LTC-R but haven't fully compared to the SPEED6 as I didn't have a "light weight" version. It was very clear the P37 woke up my driving as I had almost two flawless 6 minute qualifying runs with little mistakes, consistently turning lap times 1 - 2 tenths back of lap record for a solid 6 minutes.

The reason for this thread is to get other feedback on the P37 and also, why isn't more people running this body? My driving improved 100% and my car was faster and more consistent over the LTC-R. My opinion is, numbers don't lie and the P37 numbers sure didn't produce bad lap times "in fact improved mine". My testing of these three bodies was on the same day, same set-up and same tires.
IMO the P37 is much like the old Stratus in it's shape and handling. Stable and predictable with it's more rounded "blunt" front end. For some, it can lack the steering characteristics of the Speed 6 and LTC and tend to create a slight high speed push.

place all 3 of them side by side so you can see the differences. Roof, hood and rear decks all are similar but different as well as the shapes of the front fenders into the door area.

Locally here, the Speed 6 is the favorite, mounted forward by 5-6 mm, and wing back 10, for carpet and the LTC for asphalt. The new GX is gaining a foothold as well.
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Old 01-27-2014, 11:36 AM   #5
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each body has a unique quality to it, theres a reason the pros run the mazda speed 6 so you might have to try mounting the body differently, and the wing differently, also it may require a different wing in comparison to the other bodies you may have to mount the wing farther back or closer, or cut out the holes in the wing, adjust the rear portion of the body after the wheel to make it rotate better a whole host of variables could make each body better than the other, its a good tuning option but you cant make a clear statement which body is better each has its own place to be best as for the fast laps good for you, the ltc is a very very aggressive body, and i hear its inconsistent
Really I don't think I gave the SPEED6 a true comparison due to it being "regular weight" testing against "light weight" bodies. My intentions creating this thread wasn't to make a statement, or didn't mean for my question to come off as a statement, however to get other racers opinions on why the P37 isn't being used. I just find it interesting I went just as fast if not faster than other racers running the SPEED6 using a body no one else runs?

But your feedback experimenting with the body mounting in different positions and also wing mounting I find very interesting.
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Old 01-27-2014, 11:49 AM   #6
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IMO the P37 is much like the old Stratus in it's shape and handling. Stable and predictable with it's more rounded "blunt" front end. For some, it can lack the steering characteristics of the Speed 6 and LTC and tend to create a slight high speed push.

place all 3 of them side by side so you can see the differences. Roof, hood and rear decks all are similar but different as well as the shapes of the front fenders into the door area.

Locally here, the Speed 6 is the favorite, mounted forward by 5-6 mm, and wing back 10, for carpet and the LTC for asphalt. The new GX is gaining a foothold as well.
I agree all three bodies have completely different characteristics and each is a breed of it's own. The confusion I'm having here, the P37 honestly showed no signs of weakness on the track. I had no pushing issues on and off power or a feel of being unstable and most importantly, lack of steering, in fact I had to turn my DR down due to "too" much steering. The total overall feel of the car felt extremely promising and very consistent also kept getting faster every pack I ran through as traction came up. The car with the P37 showed zero signs of capping out as I kept pushing the car harder and harder.

After my results I don't understand why more people aren't testing this body?
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Old 01-27-2014, 11:54 AM   #7
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Really I don't think I gave the SPEED6 a true comparison due to it being "regular weight" testing against "light weight" bodies. My intentions creating this thread wasn't to make a statement, or didn't mean for my question to come off as a statement, however to get other racers opinions on why the P37 isn't being used. I just find it interesting I went just as fast if not faster than other racers running the SPEED6 using a body no one else runs?

But your feedback experimenting with the body mounting in different positions and also wing mounting I find very interesting.
well i didnt find too much difference between the rw and lw speed6 other than a few grams i probably run my speed6 a lot further than a few others about 10mm but i run a very very tight track, that needs lots of steering yes well what characteristics you like about the p37 im not sure havent had the change to test that one my buddy with an mi5 tried it i think hes running the speed6 again we all mount our bodies forward and our wings 10mm off of the rear of the car
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Old 01-27-2014, 11:58 AM   #8
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I've spent quite a bit of time running all three of those bodies. I've probably raced the P37 more than the other two, but I practice more with the LTC. I find that the P37 transitions quicker than the LTC, but just doesn't have the same stability on the higher speed sections. As such I feel like it's more of a fight to keep it stable at those points. However, it feels much better on the more technical and tight sections. I like the driving feel more than the LTC, but the laptimes just aren't as quick. I tend to get myself into trouble when I switch them around too much on a given night, so I would probably benefit from just committing to one for the whole evening and making the necessary setup changes. The P37s tend to be more durable for me than the LTCs. Maybe because the front end doesn't have as many sharp edges?

I'd be curious to know whether you've had a chance to try several different wing positions on your P37. I'm currently running it on a Xray T3, but I have a Black series Yokomo BD7 2014 coming in this week so I'm probably going to need to re-evaluate my body choices to coincide with different handling characteristics.

I've personally never liked the way the Mazdaspeed6 feels. I've burned through a lot of them, but have never gotten good results with them.
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Old 01-27-2014, 01:01 PM   #9
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well i didnt find too much difference between the rw and lw speed6 other than a few grams i probably run my speed6 a lot further than a few others about 10mm but i run a very very tight track, that needs lots of steering yes well what characteristics you like about the p37 im not sure havent had the change to test that one my buddy with an mi5 tried it i think hes running the speed6 again we all mount our bodies forward and our wings 10mm off of the rear of the car
I'm certain there is a small advantage running a "light weight" opposed to a regular weight. I have never dabbled in adjusting the wing or running the body forward or back to see what differences that makes.

The track I run at is measured 83x40 "HIGH TRACTION" and has a long sweeper coming off the straight, one tight chicane, a fast flowing chicane coming on the straight and a few hard 90's and 180's. There's a few of us in the 9.9's and that's pushing the car, but consistent 10.00's and 10.1's will make things happen.

The P37 seemed to offer an unlimited ability to transition in the chicanes while holding a firm line without traction rolling coming out of the chicanes into the 90 degree turn while hammering the throttle. Also on the fast flowing turns the car seemed to ask for more. Overall the car was far easier to drive fast. Not sure if it's just my driving style matched up with my chassis set-up but a few more runs with this body and small tweaks on the set-up, the car will be dialed. Just wish I would of ran this body at the ROAR Region 5 instead of the LTC-R
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Old 01-27-2014, 01:16 PM   #10
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I've spent quite a bit of time running all three of those bodies. I've probably raced the P37 more than the other two, but I practice more with the LTC. I find that the P37 transitions quicker than the LTC, but just doesn't have the same stability on the higher speed sections. As such I feel like it's more of a fight to keep it stable at those points. However, it feels much better on the more technical and tight sections. I like the driving feel more than the LTC, but the laptimes just aren't as quick. I tend to get myself into trouble when I switch them around too much on a given night, so I would probably benefit from just committing to one for the whole evening and making the necessary setup changes. The P37s tend to be more durable for me than the LTCs. Maybe because the front end doesn't have as many sharp edges?

I'd be curious to know whether you've had a chance to try several different wing positions on your P37. I'm currently running it on a Xray T3, but I have a Black series Yokomo BD7 2014 coming in this week so I'm probably going to need to re-evaluate my body choices to coincide with different handling characteristics.

I've personally never liked the way the Mazdaspeed6 feels. I've burned through a lot of them, but have never gotten good results with them.
Well regarding your lap times being slower with the P37, mine got faster and more of them (a lot more) of them. A smoking fast lap at the track I race is 9.9's, there is one person that got in the 9.8's. I do know when I ran the LTC-R, going on 5 weeks now there is only a few times I got in the 9's and had to push the car for 10.0's and even 10.1's...... Yesterday I decided to anchor down the P37 and ran more 9.9's on my third qualifier than I can count on both hands and consistently ran 10.0's and 10.1's to give me a 36 6.06 run over my best with the LTC-R, 35 lap 6.08 run.

I think I've found my body of choice. I'm rocking out the P37 and hope more TC racers commit to a full day with this body testing as it clearly gave me a faster, more consistent, easier to drive fast 2014 T4
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Old 01-27-2014, 01:24 PM   #11
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i strongly urge you to try the mazda speed 6 at least 6mm toward, and the wing 10mm off the back, i run a 36x60 medium-high grip track, this grip rating would be according to the other racers that go to large events specifically the sponsored ones since you do have that body its just a matter of new holes, i like it you gotta experiment
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Old 01-27-2014, 01:44 PM   #12
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i strongly urge you to try the mazda speed 6 at least 6mm toward, and the wing 10mm off the back, i run a 36x60 medium-high grip track, this grip rating would be according to the other racers that go to large events specifically the sponsored ones since you do have that body its just a matter of new holes, i like it you gotta experiment
The SPEED6 I tried isn't a light weight and wasn't mine. A fellow racer let me try one of the many SPEEED6 bodies he has to see the difference in body handling characteristics. I will be getting another P37 and also will be getting a light weight SPEED6. I have 100% ruled out the LTC-R, as that body is pure puke IMO

I will be playing around with the wing mounts as you suggested. Never really thought of doing that before and should have, as one time my wing came un mounted on one side and couldn't even drive the car straight. Since you bring that up I'm sure moving the wing forward or back can make a huge impact on handling
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Old 01-27-2014, 01:55 PM   #13
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The SPEED6 I tried isn't a light weight and wasn't mine. A fellow racer let me try one of the many SPEEED6 bodies he has to see the difference in body handling characteristics. I will be getting another P37 and also will be getting a light weight SPEED6. I have 100% ruled out the LTC-R, as that body is pure puke IMO

I will be playing around with the wing mounts as you suggested. Never really thought of doing that before and should have, as one time my wing came un mounted on one side and couldn't even drive the car straight. Since you bring that up I'm sure moving the wing forward or back can make a huge impact on handling
yes a 2-3 millimeters is a huge change in handling. also i havent had the chance to try and raise the wing up but id imagine it give it more rear end stability or more wing effect like i suggested before you could try mounting the body forward but your track is larger than mine
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Old 01-27-2014, 02:51 PM   #14
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can i ask what turn motor was used and what is the track size?,fast flowing or technical,cheers,good review btw
Track is HIGH BITE 83X40 and has a mixture of everything 17.5T geared 3.7's FDR... Fast and Flowing, a tight chicane, a fast flowing chicane with a hard 90 coming on the straight, long rounded sweeper coming off and a few other 90 and 180 degree turns. Thank You Sir
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Old 01-27-2014, 03:52 PM   #15
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We have had the opposite experience here. Smaller indoor tight track, not really anything that can be considered a straight. Lap times similar to yours though, 10.0 being fast lap of the weekend. LTCR is the choice, though some go with the Speed6 for less aggressive steering. Everyone who has run the P37 disliked it. Poor steering, poor stability out of the corners, and overall less predictable. I have not tried it, but driven it on others cars without success.

Keep in mind also, that setup plays a massive role in things like bodies and tires. 1st place TC at the race this weekend is running Sweep QTS 32's and loves them. I came in second, running Jaco Blues, and same thing. We both tried the other tires, and both could not make them work. With setup changes, I am sure we could have made each others tires work, or even the P37. Could we make it better then the LTCR...possibly. Welcome to onroad RC hehe.
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