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Old 07-17-2005, 01:32 PM   #106
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Why is a prototype car an advantage??? C'mon Derek now you're being silly. It's clear the FT TC4 is better than the tub chassis TC4. So they changed a lot of stuff on the cars during the race. Don't they do that every race so their drivers have that tiny advantage over their competitors?

Try this. Take Michael Schuamcher and put him in a Minardi. Let him put in as many laps as he can to get the car working the best. Now put him back in his Ferrari. I guarantee his lap times in the Ferrari will be 3 seconds faster than his laps in the Minardi.

Now, you and Michael meet at a go kart track. Same karts, same people help setting them up. No matter how much practice you put in, Michael is going to beat you because he's a better driver than you.

There are 2 things that make a racer competitive. His skills, and his equipment. (or hers, as the case may be) Without one, the racer is at a disadvantage to his competitors.
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Old 07-17-2005, 04:21 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jiml
Why is a prototype car an advantage??? C'mon Derek now you're being silly. It's clear the FT TC4 is better than the tub chassis TC4. So they changed a lot of stuff on the cars during the race. Don't they do that every race so their drivers have that tiny advantage over their competitors?

Try this. Take Michael Schuamcher and put him in a Minardi. Let him put in as many laps as he can to get the car working the best. Now put him back in his Ferrari. I guarantee his lap times in the Ferrari will be 3 seconds faster than his laps in the Minardi.

Now, you and Michael meet at a go kart track. Same karts, same people help setting them up. No matter how much practice you put in, Michael is going to beat you because he's a better driver than you.

There are 2 things that make a racer competitive. His skills, and his equipment. (or hers, as the case may be) Without one, the racer is at a disadvantage to his competitors.
That doesn't make any sense. You're talking about some advatange having things that the normal driver couldn't have. A car is not that. If you don't see the disadvantage of having a car you got a day before the race then I don't know what to say. Driving makes the racer. Those who like to blame everything else but themselves I cannot help or reason with. Some people are just better. I think you're arguing some of the same things, but until you show me something where there is some huge advantage I don't buy it. And FYI I'm pretty sure only the Invite guys had the new car. I was the only person running it in the open mod. And I don't think it made me any better.

And to counterpoint again. I was running a brushless system that nobody else was...and that put me down even further. When I switch to a normal brushed motor I picked up about .1-.2 per lap.
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Old 07-17-2005, 04:25 PM   #108
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I have pitted next to some Pro's(Made the worlds..pros)And I had packs with better numbers than what they had,In fact a friend of mine was having some "motor" problems,But he gave this motor to one of the pros and the guy went out and TQed with this motor..

why you talking smack about me dude!!!!
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Old 07-17-2005, 04:49 PM   #109
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Derek, you want an advantage? How about the 2002 offroad mod nats held at K&M in Houston. Yes I know Rick Howart finished 2nd with the XX4, but it was clear that the XXX-4 was clearly faster than the XX4, just not as dependable due to belts and parts breaking. That clearly showed an advantage with proto type equipment over already existing equipment. Or when the B2 was released and was clearly way better than the RC10 worlds edition, another advantage of proto type equipment. Or what about Masami's home built 4wd that he won the worlds with back in the early 90's, guess he had a disadvantage with his car because he hand built it. What about the Masami 2wd car he used that looks like the current B4? These are all proto type equipment that clearly gave an avantage over the existing equipment.

Keep in mind, no where did I say the equipment would be able to make me an instant winner. I am just stating that proto type equipment is always being tested to find out whether or not they are better or not. Some times the part is clearly better and some times they do not improve the handling of the vehicle. But when those parts do work better, the time gap increases between the factory guys and the rest of the field until the rest of the field gets the parts, then the time gap returns to where it was before the part was even designed and tested.
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Old 07-17-2005, 06:28 PM   #110
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A prototype car that's not available to the public that's clearly better than the other cars? How can you say that's not an advantange?

I think I see where our differences are. You're talking about 2 extremes, mad skills vs. no skills. If you can't drive all the equipment and the money in the world won't help you.

I'm talking about two drivers with similar skills, but one can afford better equipment than the other. A better motor or battery pack will always have an advantage in that situation. Eighty percent of racers fall into this category in one way or another. Some combination of skills and equipment that puts them wherever they are.
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Old 07-17-2005, 06:32 PM   #111
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Which gives me an idea, since the name of this thread is what would yo ask the prez of ROAR:

"Does ROAR have any ideas about how to separate pro level drivers from sportsman level drivers that will keep present racers happy and attract new racers?"
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Old 07-17-2005, 09:59 PM   #112
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blow it the hell up and lets just race...if I dont win,i need to practice more
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Old 07-17-2005, 10:15 PM   #113
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Roar needs a pro class, but it would be a good start to get rid of the sponsored drivers in the stock classes. This has been said for years but no one has the guts to do it. This is how it could began. It should start with all chassis / car, motor and battery manufactures should be required to submit a sponsored driver list once a year and updated as needed. The drivers Roar cards would be marked pro or non pro( a old Norrca idea). The list is the same currently available for checking for current membership it would also show if a person is a pro driver. There should be a limit to the number of factory team drivers.

Last edited by gotyournumber; 07-18-2005 at 12:47 AM.
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Old 07-18-2005, 06:36 AM   #114
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The soap opera about you can't win because you can get the factory stuff will never die. Had factory protype junk and good stuff. Batterys again same story- look at the trinity ad a few years ago when Doseck got a pack from the counter and won( he wasn't sponored by Trinity at the time).Talent goes to the front of the pack.Isn't it time you stopped complaining .Are you in this for fun and is this the way you make money? It's fun and not everyone can drive like the best. What great in the Florida Series is watching drivers over the years develope their skills. See kids drive older stuff and beating me with the much superior stuff.Heck I've given some stuff only to watch them beat me with my own batteries ,motors and many other items. It's skill and talent.
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